Hardest ammo/primers to ignite

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pangris

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Greetings all.

Had some work done to a revolver and it came back failing to pop Magtech 158 gr SWC's. Went back in and it is working now, but I'd like to put a few other guns through the paces because that 50% ignition rate made me shiver a bit. It was 100% with Federals prior to that discovery.

So - for the current crop of ammo on the market - which is the most detonation resistant for reliability testing?

Many thanks to the brain trust -
 
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I know this is not exactly the question you asked, but I humbly suggest that if you are getting 50% failures to ignite with some primers you may very well have a firearm problem and not a primer problem. That being said I have been most happy with Winchester primers for reliable ignition, but that's just me. Which is of course the OPPOSITE of the information you want.
 
Any revolver that is in the condition it was in when it left the factory will fire any commercial ammunition dependably! No question about it.

Did the gun fire dependably before you "had some work done on it"??? If it did then whatever was done to the gun is the problem. It may be hard to understand, but every clown out there that fancies himself a Gunsmith doesn't know anything about revolvers!

What did you want done to the gun? Did you want a lighter trigger pull, either single action or double action or both? If so, and the person who worked on the gun replaced the mainspring or either loosened the strain screw or shortened it, then that is your problem, not the ammunition! He also may have installed a Wolff Power Rib mainspring. These require a longer strain screw to properly tension the spring, and Wolff does not tell anyone that!

You have two choices, do you want a gun with a light trigger regardless, or do you want a dependable gun? Ask the person who did the work exactly what he did to it! Believe it or not S&W knows more about the engineering of its guns than the after-market accessory sellers. It is extremely rare that they build a revolver that doesn't fire dependability right out of the box. Tell whoever did the work to fix (un-do!) whatever he did and make the gun dependable and then live with it!:mad:
 
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Thom_44 said:
There be a reason that Clark Custom charges 120$ plus tax to do their service action job on revolvers... light, smooth trigger, that is still going to pop any primer like a duty gun should.
Click to expand...

Them Boy's at Clark Custom work Magic on handgun actions ...
just thinking about shooting a Clark Custom puts a Smile on my Face and a Song in my Heart ... Happy-Happy ...
...Worth every Penny ... I'm telling you for true !
Gary
 
I believe the CCI SP are the hardest to ignite in SP. I have had issues with CCI SP primers in striker fired firearms. I have other friends that have also. Federal SP always go bang. However, the CCI SR primer is thinner than most other brands, so much so that CCI recommends against using it in rifles with floating firing pins (I.E. AR15) even though folks use it anyway. I switched to CCI SR magnum for AR which has a thicker cup and is recommended by CCI.

So, it really depends on the brand and specific primer application.

It seems like I read to not use Federal LR primers in an AR platform, but the Federal SR are fine.

Lee recommends against using any Federal primers in their progressive presses with primer feed and seating.

And magnum when used in a cartridge has an entirely different meaning than magnum in a primer. Magnum primers are really recommended for ball powder, not necessary in stick powder, has nothing to do with "magnum" being in the cartridge title.

Rosewood
 
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I picked up 1000 Mag-Tech SRP's at an estate sale. I've had some of them take 2 or even 3 strikes to go off in my 380.
 
Alk8944 said:
Any revolver that is in the condition it was in when it left the factory will fire any commercial ammunition dependably! No question about it.
:
Click to expand...


Sorry, but WRONG!

My 929 being one example. The hammer was dragging on the frame so hard it would ONLY fire Federal primers.

But back to the original question. I have loaded some .38 specials with Ginex primers that gave irregular ignition in three different guns.

I would have tried a different lot but by then I found a source for Federals at a lower cost.
 
^^ This is a good point. You should check to see that the hammer is not dragging on the frame. You can usually see wear where it is hitting the frame and a shim on that side of the hammer may take care of it, or possibly some light polishing around the strike point.

But if the OP's gun just came back from a Smith shop, you would think they would have checked things like that also on the 1st visit.

Rosewood
 
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Some European ammo had a rep for hard primers. Sellier and Bellot (S&B) 9mm was one I recall from a few years back. Some also disliked that ammo because it tended to be loaded to NATO rather than SAAMI standards.
 
I picked-up a Model 37 from the mid 70's. Alot of miss-fires with reloads using CCI SP primers. Without researching, I sent the revolver back to the mothership whereupon they replaced the cylinder stop and another part that I don't quite remember right now. Anyway, gun still miss-fired. I changed to Federal Primers and no more miss-fires. Hope this helps.
 
rosewood said:
I believe the CCI SP are the hardest to ignite in SP. I have had issues with CCI SP primers in striker fired firearms. I have other friends that have also. Federal SP always go bang. However, the CCI SR primer is thinner than most other brands, so much so that CCI recommends against using it in rifles with floating firing pins (I.E. AR15) even though folks use it anyway. I switched to CCI SR magnum for AR which has a thicker cup and is recommended by CCI.

So, it really depends on the brand and specific primer application.

It seems like I read to not use Federal LR primers in an AR platform, but the Federal SR are fine.

Lee recommends against using any Federal primers in their progressive presses with primer feed and seating.

And magnum when used in a cartridge has an entirely different meaning than magnum in a primer. Magnum primers are really recommended for ball powder, not necessary in stick powder, has nothing to do with "magnum" being in the cartridge title.

Rosewood
Click to expand...

This is incorrect. At one point all I used was CCI primers and had all my revolvers tuned to a 8 lbs. DA trigger pull without any issues with reliable ignition in single or double action.

Then I started cleaning my brass with stainless steel pins and discovered that Remington cases have a larger flash hole that Federal or Winchester so the pins didn't jam in the flash hole. The problem is that my revolvers had unreliable ignition in double action with Remington UMC and I mainly shoot my revolvers in double action. As a result I re-tuned all my revolvers to a 9 lbs. DA trigger and problem solved. Note guns involved were 19, 67, 610, 620, and 625.

The lesson here is that Remington primers are harder than CCI. As for Federal, never warmed to Federal because of the way they are packed in those shoe boxes.
 
rosewood said:
... However, the CCI SR primer is thinner than most other brands, so much so that CCI recommends against using it in rifles with floating firing pins (I.E. AR15) even though folks use it anyway. I switched to CCI SR magnum for AR which has a thicker cup and is recommended by CCI.
Click to expand...

Doesn't CCI recommend the CCI #41 for ARs? That is what I used.

CCI #34 for 7.62 NATO reloads. Those two are "MilSpec".
 
scooter123 said:
This is incorrect. At one point all I used was CCI primers and had all my revolvers tuned to a 8 lbs. DA trigger pull without any issues with reliable ignition in single or double action.

Then I started cleaning my brass with stainless steel pins and discovered that Remington cases have a larger flash hole that Federal or Winchester so the pins didn't jam in the flash hole. The problem is that my revolvers had unreliable ignition in double action with Remington UMC and I mainly shoot my revolvers in double action. As a result I re-tuned all my revolvers to a 9 lbs. DA trigger and problem solved. Note guns involved were 19, 67, 610, 620, and 625.

The lesson here is that Remington primers are harder than CCI. As for Federal, never warmed to Federal because of the way they are packed in those shoe boxes.
Click to expand...

What about my post is incorrect? My entire post? Other than my statement about CCI are the hardest pistol. I need to qualify, the hardest I have tried. I have never used Remington primers, so I cannot speak to them.

Rosewood
 
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SGT ROCK 11B said:
Doesn't CCI recommend the CCI #41 for ARs? That is what I used.

CCI #34 for 7.62 NATO reloads. Those two are "MilSpec".
Click to expand...
Yes, #41, SR Match and SR magnum. The 41, match and magnum are all the thicker primer cups than standard small rifle.

Rosewood
 
Dennis2149 said:
I picked-up a Model 37 from the mid 70's. Alot of miss-fires with reloads using CCI SP primers. Without researching, I sent the revolver back to the mothership whereupon they replaced the cylinder stop and another part that I don't quite remember right now. Anyway, gun still miss-fired. I changed to Federal Primers and no more miss-fires. Hope this helps.
Click to expand...

A popular thing for cops in the 1970s was to put a "Spring Kit" in their revolvers. I always prefer Federal Primers especially in revolvers I buy used.
 
Dennis2149 said:
I picked-up a Model 37 from the mid 70's. Alot of miss-fires with reloads using CCI SP primers. Without researching, I sent the revolver back to the mothership whereupon they replaced the cylinder stop and another part that I don't quite remember right now. Anyway, gun still miss-fired. I changed to Federal Primers and no more miss-fires. Hope this helps.
Click to expand...

Need to correct my Quote. It was when I changed to Winchester SP reloads that I had no more miss-fires. Sorry.
 
The several times I have experienced episodes of FTFs in revolvers, installing a new hammer spring solved the problem. I don't buy into the soft primer/hard primer discussuon.
 
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When (if?) I ever run into a primer that doesn't fire on the 1st hit (and I'm speaking primarily PUN INTENDED:eek: about 9mm reloads) I'll usually give it a 2nd chance, then if no go set that round aside and later pull the bullet & powder...

I then take the brass and put it in my CZ75 and in every instance except 1 that primer fired: this includes all the different domestic small pistol primers, the Ginex I bought during the time when primers were almost impossible to find, and the Argentinian ones which seemed to be the most problematic (but for practice ammo at the range worked pretty well)...

A dud primer is a very rare occurence with any of my revolvers, which are all stock spring-wise.

Cheers!

P.S. The No. 41s (both the cci & Winchester versions) are my choice for 223/5.56 & the No. 47s for 308/7.62 applications. SMRPs for 300 Blackout.
 
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