30-30 Thompson Contender Recoil ******( SEE POST 34 )*******

I’ve shot the 243, 7mm08 and 308 from the Encore. It is a bit heavier but the 308 also generates more energy than the 30/30. I didn’t find it to be bad. I mean you go into it knowing it’s a rifle round. 30/30 in a Contender would be an interesting deer gun. You’re free to use any bullet you want.
 
Great thread!

I was 'smithing in Miami when T/C first introduced the .30-30 barrel.

They hadn't taking into account the harder rifle primers so misfires were quite common.

I had a customer bring his in, and since T/C wasn't offering a replacement mainspring yet I did a small mod on the existing spring.

Of course, fixing a gun that misfires requires test firing. My shop was a big one (had been a Woolworth's) and we had more than one indoor range, so I grabbed a box of ammo and a leather shooting glove.

I'm no stranger to recoil, but five rounds later I was happy to say the gun worked perfectly and I was happier to say "no mas!".

Night and day compared to the .44 Magnum...
 
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OK, here is the long and the short of it. In the target below, the top group in the yellow dot is Remington 125 gr managed recoil shells. The bottom yellow dot is Federal 170 grain full house loads. Both targets have 3 shots in them. The 8 o'clock group of 2 are the first rounds fired before scope adjustments. Distance about 20 yards.

The170 grain loads are too much for me, so I will pull the remaining 17 rounds, and reload 125/110 grain bullets
 

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I hope you find a 357 Mag or Max barrel that is affordable! I picked up a 10" Octagonal 357 Mag barrel about 25 years ago for a reasonable price. He wouldn't sell me the whole gun: Serial Number 1608! From September 1968. Serial numbers started at 1001 in August in a batch of 500 frames! They sold out so fast it took everyone by surprise! But I have the barrel from that gun. The sights on much newer gun are better as far as adjustability and repeatability goes, but the newer sights or gun are no more accurate!

I have a Super 14" 44 Mag I had Mag-Na-Ported and a 12" Hunter 375 Win. with T/C's "Muzzle Tamer" recoil reducer on it. The inch diameter by 1.5 inch long "Bird Cage" Muzzle Tamer reduces recoil by a massive amount! (the little extra weight helps too!)

I have a Super 14" in Match 22 LR that is ridiculously heavy! I have been thinking for 30 years of cutting it to 8" and threading it for a can! I just may get around to it (or not) before I kick the bucket! But I think that would be great in-town critter control!

Ivan
 
I hope you find a 357 Mag or Max barrel that is affordable! I picked up a 10" Octagonal 357 Mag barrel about 25 years ago for a reasonable price. He wouldn't sell me the whole gun: Serial Number 1608! From September 1968. Serial numbers started at 1001 in August in a batch of 500 frames! They sold out so fast it took everyone by surprise! But I have the barrel from that gun. The sights on much newer gun are better as far as adjustability and repeatability goes, but the newer sights or gun are no more accurate!

I have a Super 14" 44 Mag I had Mag-Na-Ported and a 12" Hunter 375 Win. with T/C's "Muzzle Tamer" recoil reducer on it. The inch diameter by 1.5 inch long "Bird Cage" Muzzle Tamer reduces recoil by a massive amount! (the little extra weight helps too!)

I have a Super 14" in Match 22 LR that is ridiculously heavy! I have been thinking for 30 years of cutting it to 8" and threading it for a can! I just may get around to it (or not) before I kick the bucket! But I think that would be great in-town critter control!

Ivan
I have a super 16 in 22 mag that I have yet to put a scope on
 
Recoil in the Contender is a unique feel. All the gun’s weight is forward of the grip since it attaches by a screw into the frame stud. So, there’s a lot of torque to the recoil.
If you use Pachmayr grips, they will help a lot!
Bull barrels dampen the recoil compared to the light octagonal barrels.
The 10” barrels recoil much more than the 14” barrels.

I find the recoil with 44 Magnum, particularly with 300 gr bullets to be pretty heavy. But, the 357 Herrett is much worse! (This is a wildcat made from expanded and slightly shortened 30-30 brass.)
I find 30-30 recoil pretty manageable even in the 10” barrel. But, the muzzle blast might trick you into thinking it’s heavier.
Handloading helps with the 30-30 tremendously if you select powders on the faster burning rate. They have much less blast. I like 4198, RL-7 (is that made anymore?), SR 4759 (discontinued), etc. I also really like cast bullets in the 30-30! The RCBS 165-30 SIL bullet is fantastic!
Also, contrary to general opinion, I recommend neck sizing. Full length dies reduce the brass for easy feeding in lever actions. But, it really hurts accuracy and shortens brass life.
If you simply must use a full length sizing die, try adjusting it so it doesn’t set the shoulder back. You can do this by drawing a pencil line on the case neck and shoulder. Adjust the die to just touch the case mouth. Turn the die in bit by bit, watching the pencil line disappear as it approaches the shoulder. Stop before you touch the shoulder and set the lock ring while the case is still in the die.
RL 7 is still being made but around 70-80 buck per pound. Imr 4198 is non existent bit i have 3 lbs.
 
I hope you find a 357 Mag or Max barrel that is affordable! I picked up a 10" Octagonal 357 Mag barrel about 25 years ago for a reasonable price. He wouldn't sell me the whole gun: Serial Number 1608! From September 1968. Serial numbers started at 1001 in August in a batch of 500 frames! They sold out so fast it took everyone by surprise! But I have the barrel from that gun. The sights on much newer gun are better as far as adjustability and repeatability goes, but the newer sights or gun are no more accurate!

I have a Super 14" 44 Mag I had Mag-Na-Ported and a 12" Hunter 375 Win. with T/C's "Muzzle Tamer" recoil reducer on it. The inch diameter by 1.5 inch long "Bird Cage" Muzzle Tamer reduces recoil by a massive amount! (the little extra weight helps too!)

I have a Super 14" in Match 22 LR that is ridiculously heavy! I have been thinking for 30 years of cutting it to 8" and threading it for a can! I just may get around to it (or not) before I kick the bucket! But I think that would be great in-town critter control!

Ivan
Before you do cut that barrel i would get Eabco barrel alteady done as i am sure they will cut it down for you
 
I have the Super 14 in 30-30. I reload 125 gr JHP over 29gr Reloader 7 for around 2200 fps. I put rubber grips on my Contender and I do not notice much recoil with this load. It is scoped and from a rest I shot a .5" 3 shot group at 50 yds with it.
 
IMG_2690.webpOne of the great things I remember about the Contender is how much Thompson Center supported and encouraged handloading.
If you’re new to the pistol and/or handloading, it might be worth looking for a booklet that they published called, “Making Your Contender Perform”.
It was basically a compilation of information put together by noted gunwriter Bob Milek, plus data from DuPont (who still owned and manufactured smokeless powder at the time).
Used copies are available on eBay, and maybe there are copies online (?).
 
Before my collection downsizing, I had a 14" ported 375 WCF barrel with the standard Contender pistol grip topped by a 2X7 Burris handgun scope. Recoil seemed to be no more than the 44 Mag. The only consideration was when sighting in at the range, the porting seemed to double the blast sound over the 44. I had a shoulder hang holster and it made an excellent dark timber combination for Elk.
Can confirm. recoil with the brake is a hard push straight back. I had Pachmayr Presentations on mine.
 
We all have different perceptions and tollerance of recoil, it's a highly subjective thing. I do not mind the recoil of the 30/30, it is a Super 14 barrel, have never shot bullets heavier than 150 grains in it. Bought some reduced recoil 30-30 ammo for the young ladies in the family that I gifted rifles to, kept a couple boxes back to try but that has not yet happened.

My favorite is the 7-30 Waters, have a 15" Custom Shop Bull barrel for it and the bullets are 140grain, pleasant to me. The 25-35 barrel is even easier on the hands and wrists.
 
I’ve shot the 243, 7mm08 and 308 from the Encore. It is a bit heavier but the 308 also generates more energy than the 30/30. I didn’t find it to be bad. I mean you go into it knowing it’s a rifle round. 30/30 in a Contender would be an interesting deer gun. You’re free to use any bullet you want.
The 30-30 from a super 14 is very manageable as is my Magnum Research Lone Eagle with a 15" bbl in 7mm-08. Great deer guns! Of course I load my own.
 
I shot the 7mm TCU barrel in Metallic Silhouette decades ago. Still as accurate as it was back then.

Also have the 45-70 barrel. With handloads the recoil is not bad at all, the muzzle kinda flips up and then settles back down to where it started. I've harvested a number of whitetails and muleys with it over the years.

May have to drag it to the range this Friday!

Marty at HausOfArms has the best selection of Contender equipment I've found.
 
shot one in 35 rem. 14" that's more recoil than 30/30.Suggest Pachs Decelerator or other stock with recoil reducing insert.
shooting or mechanic glove with anti impact palm.
Put a glove on support hand and wedge fingers into trig guard gap.(if there's a gap guard whacks back of fingers).IHMSA shooters held scope with off hand.Works.
Good hearing protection cause it will bark.
 
I shot a 10" 30-30 twenty or so years ago. It felt like my elbow was going to detach. Hope you have fun.
 
I sold my entire T/C collection some 20+ years ago after collecting two Contender frames, 16 barrels, and adding an Encore frame toward the end. All the barrels were of 10-14” bull barrel configuration. Of those barrels I would say these were the ones with recoil potential, but nothing that I couldn’t handle at the time. I reloaded for most ( had to as several were wildcat calibers ). The top four for recoil consideration would be:

30-30 Win 14” Don’t recall the load, but built for the T/C 14” barrel
35 Bellm 14” Ported Barrel - Made from Win 444 brass
44 Mag Hunter 12” Ported Barrel - Hunted deer with this one
45 LC & 410 10” Actually shot mostly Clay Pigeons with this one.

I don’t recall a lot of difference as to recoil in any of these, but again the Encore frame, ported barrels, and mid-range-loads built for T/C 10-14” barrels kept everything manageable. My reloading manuals of that era had T/C sections and I did not push the max side of the recipe.

I recall Hunter Sight In Days at the range and guys with their T/C Contender 14” 45-70’s ( with muzzle brakes ) made lots of noise, fireballs, and serious muzzle flip. One would assume significant recoil.

Yes, I ran across a Gen 2 frame with a 22 Match barrel that made it’s way back into my safe - Just to good a price to pass up and fun to shoot.
 
The 405 gr are averaging 1105 FPS. The 300's are a smidge over 1300.

405's are a nice rolling *BOOM* when they touch off, the 300's are more of a *CRACK*.

This was some hunting ammo I loaded a few years ago. Shot what you see still loaded yesterday. I plan on loading up 20 more (10 of each) with the same data for this coming season.

Sighted for 75 yards.

Recoil is subjective, I find my Alaskan in 454 Casull to be much less pleasant to shoot than the 45-70.

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Years ago I started asking myself “but what is it FOR?”

When I can’t come up with a good answer, I sure wouldn’t get one. A 30-30 in a single shot hand gun, or any handgun, seems just silly to me.

The contender configuration is too large and cumbersome to have any benefit of a handgun including portability. A 30-30 in one seems more like a trick than a good idea.

I’m sure recoil in one would be substantial. Other than as a he man trick, I can’t imagine a reason to use one.
 
One of the nice things about the Contender is its versatility.
You don’t have to let it beat you up.
Most of the big bore cartridges for the Contender are flexible cartridges that respond well to handloading. The 30-30 can be downloaded to fire 150 gr. cast bullets in the 1300-1450 fps range, which is within the ballistics of the 357 mag in the same gun.
Or, just select any of the many other cartridge options.

And, being a single shot, you’re not forced to load it to function the action or fit in a magazine!
I don’t think there’s ever been a handgun that takes such advantage of everything offered by handloading.
Oh, and why hasn’t anybody mentioned the trigger quality? The trigger can be safely tuned and adjusted to provide a crisp and reliable trigger pull of one pound or less, if desired.
Today it’s easy to forget how immensely popular the T/C Contender was.

As for the question “what’s it for?” there was once upon a time in America an era when handgun shooters actually cared about marksmanship.
(As opposed to blasting away at refrigerator sized targets 10-20 feet from the muzzle.)
Hunting, long range target shooting (a few folks mentioned silhouette shooting), or just the pleasure of developing and experimenting with different handloading techniques are all endeavors served well by the Contender.

Is it “silly” to be able to shoot 1-2” groups at 100 yards or more with a fiream that can be easily carried in the field in a shoulder holster?
 
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I have one that I have not tried out yet. I was researching AI to see what ir said about recoil. The word they use is " Fierce ". I was trying to get AI to draw a comparison with the 44 magnum. They say it is considerably greater recoil than the 44 magnum.

Anybody have any experience with this combination?

Is this a handloading only application?

If you are shooting from the 14" barrel recoil should be no real issue. A fairly heavy gun (scoped?) and a bit of limp wristing make the gun fairly easy shooting. I would suggest handloading not to minimize recoil but rather to take advantage of the variety of bullets available in .308 diameter that are not available in factory loads. Lighter and pointier specifically. Most handloading books carry a Contender or single shot section.

Hodgden puts out a magazine about 4 times a year with lots of handloads to include for the T/C line. They have a fairly vicious 45/70 load for the Contender - a 300 grain JHP @ 2,100 fps. With either H322 or BLC2 IIRC. It hurts.

Pachmayr makes (or made, can still be found I'm sure) a rubber bladder backed grip for the catamount etched Contender. It can be readily adapted to the G2 version. Makes handling recoil of the heavier recoiling chamberings such as 35 Remington, 444 and 45/70, etc much easier.
 
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View attachment 900344One of the great things I remember about the Contender is how much Thompson Center supported and encouraged handloading.
If you’re new to the pistol and/or handloading, it might be worth looking for a booklet that they published called, “Making Your Contender Perform”.
It was basically a compilation of information put together by noted gunwriter Bob Milek, plus data from DuPont (who still owned and manufactured smokeless powder at the time).
Used copies are available on eBay, and maybe there are copies online (?).

Decades ago the T/C plant in southern NH used to hold parking lot sales with some of their experimental barrels for sale. I picked up a TCR 83 barrel in 6 PPC that is a pleasure to shoot. Rather a shame how S&W handled the company. Am hopeful the new owner is more in tune with our likes and need. Or wants, I suppose.
 
I love my Contenders and have barrels in 45/70, 44 mag and 444 Marlin (Super 14), 35 Rem (12" w/brake), 30-30, 35 Max, 7mm TC Super Mag and .223 (10"). All are not unpleasant to shoot, The 45/70 and 444 have a mind of their own when it comes to recoil. The .223 is the one I use to wake the neighbors and the 35 will definitely set the grass on fire.
I was shooting the 45/70 when my adult son asked why I twisted it that way. I let him shoot it and he had an instant understanding of 'torque'. Let 'em do what they're gonna do.
 
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Years ago I started asking myself “but what is it FOR?”

When I can’t come up with a good answer, I sure wouldn’t get one. A 30-30 in a single shot hand gun, or any handgun, seems just silly to me.

The contender configuration is too large and cumbersome to have any benefit of a handgun including portability. A 30-30 in one seems more like a trick than a good idea.

I’m sure recoil in one would be substantial. Other than as a he man trick, I can’t imagine a reason to use one.
In a proper holster a 30-30 Contender carries a lot easier than even a 16" 30-30 and loses little in shoot ability. especially if you are carrying a walking stick/support.
 
Question; "Why would you want a 30-30 Contender?"

Answer: So, you don't have to form 30 Herrett brass! 30 Herrett has much better performance, and much worse recoil!

You could chamber an X-frame revolver in 30 Herrett. But that is the answer to a question that absolutely no one is asking!

Ivan
 
Question; "Why would you want a 30-30 Contender?"

Answer: So, you don't have to form 30 Herrett brass! 30 Herrett has much better performance, and much worse recoil!

You could chamber an X-frame revolver in 30 Herrett. But that is the answer to a question that absolutely no one is asking!

Ivan
The 30-30 is like a completely different cartridge fired from the Contender vs. a lever action. The bullet restrictions due to the tubular magazine are eliminated, so spitzers are OK. And, if you’re not loading to maximum pressure, you can neck size for improved accuracy.

The 30 Herrett in a revolver?! Ha, that might just be”out-blast” the 22 Jet!

The 357 Herrett is a real beast in the Contender when fired from a 10” barrel. I was surprised how much the 14” barrel tamed the recoil and blast.

Those Herrett cartridges sure were accurate and powerful cartridges!
Add the 7mm T/CU and clearly TC knew what they were doing when they selected these wildcat cartridges as general production items!
What a great era that was!
 
I have one that I have not tried out yet. I was researching AI to see what ir said about recoil. The word they use is " Fierce ". I was trying to get AI to draw a comparison with the 44 magnum. They say it is considerably greater recoil than the 44 magnum.

Anybody have any experience with this combination?

Is this a handloading only application?
Many years ago, when I used to reload, my friend had a 30-30 Contender and I would load light loads especially for him and my boys' single shot rifle. Since they were single shots I could load spire point bullets for them.
 
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