IMR 4227 in the .25-20 help

bigmoose

bigmoose

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I want to reload the .25-20 cartridge for my Remington Model 25. I have 85 grain RNFP lead bullets and will use IMR 4227. The plan is to use this rifle for plinking at the range, woodchuck hunting, and the occasional coyote hunt (although the coyotes haven't been cooperating lately).

The hodgdon website lists min 6.0 (1129 fps) and max 7.0 (1317 fps) grains IMR 4227 for the 85 grain bullet. Other sources talk about loads at 9.0+ giving very satisfactory results. I don't want a blooper load. I want one with a velocity of 1500 fps or better. The Remington was built for smokeless loads and is a strong and reliable action.

Does anyone have some loads they would care to share that use IMR 4227?

Thanks much.
 
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Not to sound like a jerk, but why don't you start at the base load and run it through a chronograph. Just a few test round should give you an idea. You could even make a ladder load, with a few rounds each of an increasing volume of powder. I just don't feel all warm and fuzzy from internet load advice.
 
You might look up load data.com, lots of loads but........

That "Mini" 30-30 was a great light load in its day but it depends a lot if you were shooting a bolt action or a tubular rifle............ and the bullet designs were not the best back then for accuracy at long ranges, past 75 yards with the flat nose bullets.

Good luck getting some loads, that has to be a fun load to shoot. Would love to see a picture posted of some targets, if things work out for you.
 
Novalty,
Your advice is well taken, thanks. I wish I had a chrono, eventually I will buy one. I sometimes pose questions like these because there are some folks with lots of experience with certain cartridges and I like to here what they have to say. This round has obviously been around for a long time but I have no experience with it.
 
bigmoose said:
Novalty,
Your advice is well taken, thanks. I wish I had a chrono, eventually I will buy one. I sometimes pose questions like these because there are some folks with lots of experience with certain cartridges and I like to here what they have to say. This round has obviously been around for a long time but I have no experience with it.
Click to expand...

I am in a similar situation. Last year, I got this crazy idea/borderline fascination to get my Grandmother's Winchester 94 out of my father's safe where it has been for about 20 years. So I bought dies, and components to get it reloaded, and asked my father if I could "borrow" it. Fortuantely, he also had about 4 full boxes of old factory ammo that I could get measurements from.

Loaded up my first rounds and shot a test batch through. That experience is one that make me truly enjoy reloading. Yes, I know 25-35WCF ammo is still in production, but I was able to produce with my own hands and get a family heirloom out of the safe and back to the range. For the life of me, I still don't know why I am fascinated with this rifle, as I generally do not like shooting rifles-due to some arthritic issues with my left arm which make me a terrible shot with a rifle unless I bench it.

This is the target from when I shot my first reloads last summer. Yes it is only from 15 yards (standing w/o support), but that was as far away as I could make out the center dot on the target through the factory buckhorn sights.



I think my father was happy to see the old rifle getting shot again, so much that he told me to keep it. This summer I have a ladder load of tests cartridges made to try some different powder levels at 100 yards.
 
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The .25-35! Now there is an oldie but goodie. Yes, it is tremendously fun and rewarding bringing these old rifles out and seeing what they can do, especially with handloads. Good luck with your testing.
 
bigmoose said:
Novalty,
Your advice is well taken, thanks. I wish I had a chrono, eventually I will buy one. I sometimes pose questions like these because there are some folks with lots of experience with certain cartridges and I like to here what they have to say. This round has obviously been around for a long time but I have no experience with it.
Click to expand...

If you don't have chrono you can calculate roughly based on published data. For example my Lyman posts min load (m) and velocity for it (v) and max load (M) and velocity for it (V), your target velocity is (t), so your calculated load based on min values would be (c) = (t) * (m) / (v) and you can calculate same values based on max load; values should be pretty close; you can get the average and make sure it falls in min-max bracket :) In my experience calculated value was very close to what I observed on chrono.
 
Older reloading manuals may have data with higher Max loads than what is currently printed.
I don't have access to my books right now, but the Lyman reloading manual from the 60's (44th Edition?) is often used to mine data on older cartridges.
It can be useful, BUT, it can also send you off loading way over what is now considered Maximum.

I'm just guessing of course, but perhaps those 'other sources' may have gotten loads from the older reloading manual(s).

They update them for a reason. Everyone seems to be in agreement why they do that. But then some turn right around and use that older data as spoken word because they simply have found it in print from a reputable source and it's convenient for their current goal.

Another reason for higher Max loads from another source may be the firearm the source was using to test them in. They may have felt the loads were safe in theirs (Win 92, T/C, ect) but not in anything else.
Not a lot of people even know what a Remington 25 is to be honest.

Just my thoughts.

Nice rifle the Model 25. Had one in 32-20 for a while.
Butt stocks split on them right behind the receiver on top. The more common Remington Model 12 .22cal butt stock fits the Mod 25 if you need to replace.
 
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I load for it's two cyblings, 32-20 and 218 Bee, but have never loaded for the 25-20.
I'd like to see pics of your Remington. They are neat little rifles.
 
Best powder for the 60 and 85gr jacket bullets for factory
dup. loads is imr 4198 c/o the Lyman 45th Edition manual.

This powder also works well with the lead bullets and gives the highest fps with the powders listed in this manuals data.

Highest velocity was with the 60gr Jacket at 2100 fps.
4227 was not listed.
 
OrNPmtZ.jpg


Gregintenn,

Remington 25 in .25-20 with Lyman peep.
 
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Lots of good info on 25-20 reloading can be found here. I run 9gr of 4227 with that boolit in my Blackhawk, but my 1894 Marlin likes 5.5gr of 2400 behind it.
 
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