PB IMR POWDER 3.6GR TO 4.0 I NEED ADVICE

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marathonrunner

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Guys, I got awesome advice from this site. There is no load data for PB Pistol Powder for 9mm 115gr Hornady Round Nose FMJ. However the folks told me to use Speer Dot load data and my range for FMJ round nose is 3.6 to 4.0.

However, after using 3.6gr, my action on my Shield would not cycle and kept jamming. It was quite obvious the load charge was way too weak. I am now worried, will 3.8 make that much of a difference? I can't imagine a few tenths of a grain can be the difference but Power Pistol the load data calls for 4.7 to 6.7gr so this seems suspicious. What if I go to 4.0gr and the pistol charge is still way under powered? Will it exceed the pressure of the cartridge regardless? I bought three hundred dollars worth of this powder so I hope this works .
 
This happens a lot with semi autos: load the min and the gun does not cycle. So don't use the min. Look at the speeds: 950 fps is a pathetic 9mm load.
I'm not a big fan of PB, but 4gr will get that 115gr bullet downrange, and should cycle the shield. Helps to hold the Shield firmly.

P.S. 32,000 PSI is well within 9mm capability (35,000). 9mm +P is 38,500.
 
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My book shows PB 3.3 to 3.7 for 115gr Lead (Note; I use lead data as a benchmark because I shoot mostly plated 115s and that's where I always start.), and, 3.6 to 4.0 for the Hornady XTP. There are probably other differences between the XTP and your FMJ other than the hollow point, so just keep that in mind.

So if I was loading some other Hornady 115gr projectile, I'd stick to the XTP data - which, IMHO, you did correctly.

To answer your question; in 9mm, .2 gr can make all the difference in the world!!!

I would load a handful at 3.7, 3.8, go test them. Then if the gun starts cycling better, go on up to 3.9 and 4.0 (test loads only - no quantities) until I found one that worked every time.

You will probably be fine going up to 4.0 on your next test if that's what you decide. Unless you can find load data for a Hornady 115 FMJ, I would not recommend exceeding that XTP load data.

IMPORTANT POINT: ignore that power pistol data! It is absolutely irrelevant.

I stumbled into some Titegroup awhile back and started loading 9mm with it and .2 gr made all the difference in the world. Now I really like TG!
 
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hot load

OKFC05 said:
This happens a lot with semi autos: load the min and the gun does not cycle. So don't use the min. Look at the speeds: 950 fps is a pathetic 9mm load.
I'm not a big fan of PB, but 4gr will get that 115gr bullet downrange, and should cycle the shield. Helps to hold the Shield firmly.

P.S. 32,000 PSI is well within 9mm capability.
Click to expand...

Yikes! 4gr seems like a lot. Isn't that a hot load? It is hard to imagine there is much difference between 3.6 to 4.0. If it is so weak at 3.6 I don't see how 4.0 will make that much of a differnce
 
thanks!

M3Stuart said:
My book shows PB 3.3 to 3.7 for 115gr Lead (Note; I use lead data as a benchmark because I shoot mostly plated 115s and that's where I always start.), and, 3.6 to 4.0 for the Hornady XTP. There are probably other differences between the XTP and your FMJ other than the hollow point, so just keep that in mind.

So if I was loading some other Hornady 115gr projectile, I'd stick to the XTP data - which, IMHO, you did correctly.

To answer your question; in 9mm, .2 gr can make all the difference in the world!!!

I would load a handful at 3.7, 3.8, go test them. Then if the gun starts cycling better, go on up to 3.9 and 4.0 (test loads only - no quantities) until I found one that worked every time.

You will probably be fine going up to 4.0 on your next test if that's what you decide. Unless you can find load data for a Hornady 115 FMJ, I would not recommend exceeding that XTP load data.

IMPORTANT POINT: ignore that power pistol data! It is absolutely irrelevant.

I stumbled into some Titegroup awhile back and started loading 9mm with it and .2 gr made all the difference in the world. Now I really like TG!
Click to expand...

I plan on now trying 3.8 and see how that works. Anyway I hated the Shield's stock trigger it was horrible. I got the Apex Duty Carry and I got the aluminum trigger on order which should make that shoot just like a Glock. I am still baffled why Glock does not make a slimline 9mm. I also heard Glock is now using MIM parts and experiencing issues. Nothing wrong with MIM from others that told me SW has it down to science but Glock seems to not have much experience.
 
If it is so weak at 3.6 I don't see how 4.0 will make that much of a differnce
Click to expand...

Rough (real rough) rule of thumb with medium powders is 10% increase in powder gives 20% increase in pressure, which in case you don't know, is significant to MV and recoil.
 
or, OR, you could get some different bullets!

Personally, I don't buy FMJ, XTP or any of the 'high dollar' projectiles for launching at paper targets. The lead doesn't cycle well enough for me in 9mm so I stick to plated (normally Berry's or Rainier) with 100% success. Never a FTE, FTF, etc. with a plated round - in thousands and thousands of them (though, full disclosure, never tried PB).

Edit: further to this point, you could also try those rounds in a different gun. I used to have a 92FS that would cycle absolutely anything (despite it's horrid trigger and way-too-big grip).
 
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A lot depends on the powder you are using........

I use fast to medium slow in my 9mm 115gr plated loads for standard loads but I also load X-Lite target loads that just work the action without any problems.

Your spring has a lot to do with what you can get by with......

My pistol lets me shoot 81% and even a 70% load with one fast powder.

It takes time to "Learn" your weapon and what it likes....
hang in there, it will work out for you in time.
 
I would like to use barns, berrys, or rainers but heard a lot of them the weight varies too much from one bullet to the other so accuracy is not all that great
 
DoubleH said:
I checked my old load records and found my load for 9 mm 115 gr was 4.0 gr of PB. Good load in my P38 and Glock 19 and cycled the action every time. Haven't used PB in years:)
Click to expand...

Isn't 4.0 considered rather hot? I wonder what the velocity is but heard from others that PB the bullets don't go as fast as others.
 
marathonrunner said:
I would like to use barns, berrys, or rainers but heard a lot of them the weight varies too much from one bullet to the other so accuracy is not all that great
Click to expand...

Don't rely on "what you hear", rely on what YOU observe for yourself. I've used most of the plated bullets available and have determined that ALL of them will produce loads more accurate than I am capable of shooting with a handgun offhand. They also produce loads that exceed the accuracy I can get from a rested position using iron sights. I have to mount a handgun scope to my revolvers before I can observe any real difference in accuracy with a plated bullet in comparison with a traditional jacketed bullet and that difference is still not enough to be concerned with in something like a Shield.

BTW, as others have pointed out, with a relatively "fast" powder that is somewhat "dense" just 0.2 grains CAN mean the difference between a semi auto cycling properly or not. It's why some of us are so fussy about a variation of just 1/10 grain of powder from our powder measure. With some of my loads if I see a variation as large as 1/10 grain I'll hand weigh each charge thrown because I've learned to interpret the reading of my beam type scale down to a resolution of about 0.033 grains. When the total recommended load range is just 0.4 grains details like this really do matter.
 
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marathonrunner said:
Guys, I got awesome advice from this site. There is no load data for PB Pistol Powder for 9mm 115gr Hornady Round Nose FMJ. However the folks told me to use Speer Dot load data and my range for FMJ round nose is 3.6 to 4.0.

However, after using 3.6gr, my action on my Shield would not cycle and kept jamming. It was quite obvious the load charge was way too weak. I am now worried, will 3.8 make that much of a difference? I can't imagine a few tenths of a grain can be the difference but Power Pistol the load data calls for 4.7 to 6.7gr so this seems suspicious. What if I go to 4.0gr and the pistol charge is still way under powered? Will it exceed the pressure of the cartridge regardless? I bought three hundred dollars worth of this powder so I hope this works .
Click to expand...

This is another example of the need for a chronograph.

Velocity with a given bullet (weight) allows for pressure estimation.
Example: if you're running "Titegroup" powder (or Bullseye/etc) with a 124 JHP and making 1300 fps (and haven't blown the gun up), you are way over maximum pressure.
Conversely; if you running the same powder and bullet, making 800 fps, there is no way an autoloader will cycle.
 
I tried PB in 9mm earlier this year. I had real problems with cycling using a 125 grain lead bullet. Even at max load it would not cycle reliably. I picked up a 100 Berrys plated, which list heavier loads on Hogdgons website. They ran great even in the middle of prescribed load range.

FWIW the PB makes a great, if somewhat dirty, load for 158 grain LSWCs. Very low recoil, and accurate.
 
gaijin said:
This is another example of the need for a chronograph.

Velocity with a given bullet (weight) allows for pressure estimation.
Example: if you're running "Titegroup" powder (or Bullseye/etc) with a 124 JHP and making 1300 fps (and haven't blown the gun up), you are way over maximum pressure.
Conversely; if you running the same powder and bullet, making 800 fps, there is no way an autoloader will cycle.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't recommend a chrono here unless I built them
this guy would buy me a yacht.

Marathon, old buddy, you still owe us coffee.
Protocol remains the same.
Raise the charge till it works glitch free and accurately.
Be it a 90 grain 32 or a 458 winchester magnum kicking 550 grains into orbit.
You should have been up and running fully self sufficient several months ago.
 
800 fps will not cycle...?

The 3" Kahr I tested with a 115gr plated with a very slow burn
rate IMR 4227 with a full charge worked 5 times out of six with
my chrony reading only...............

784 fps average..........the fps started at only 735 fps and the high was 816 fps.

However I will accept that 800 fps in some powders.
 
An aside; who are "the folks" and why do you use their load data? I've been reloading off and on for 30+ years and I still get my load data from published reloading manuals. If there is no data for a specific powder/bullet combination, I would find out why waaaaaaay before I tried any load data from any forum expert, range rat, pet load website, or gun shop guru...

jes an old guys thinkin'...
 
WILL PUTTING MAX POWDER LOAD WEAR OUT GUN FASTER??

Hey Guys, I am using PC IMR for 9mm 115gr and the range is 3.6gr to 4.0g. I started out 3.6gr but the gun will not cycle because load is so anemic and weak. I am worried that 3.8gr won't make much of a difference and afraid I may have to go all the way up to 4.0gr max load. If I have to use that much, will that max pressure really wear my gun out faster? The bullet coming out at 3.6gr is so anemic, I cannot imagine it doing anymore wear on my chamber in spite of max pressure. I thought max pressure, the gun would feel like it is blowing up in your hands.
 
I'm not familiar with your load but what I see is the load goes from minimum to maximum in under 1/2 grain of powder. if 3.6 is too weak then try 3.65, then 3.7. Baby steps are always safer.

And yes full power loads put more wear and tear on firearms than mild loads. This is a general rule applies to all machines, work a machine harder and it will need maintenance sooner.
 
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baby load

Smith357 said:
I'm not familiar with your load but what I see is the load goes from minimum to maximum in under 1/2 grain of powder. if 3.6 is too weak then try 3.65, then 3.7. Baby steps are always safer.

And yes full power loads put more wear and tear on firearms than mild loads. This is a general rule applies to all machines, work a machine harder and it will need maintenance sooner.
Click to expand...

Well I read somebody was using 4.0 which is max for PB. I now don't want to run this through my Glock 34 because I got pricey parts in that gun. I will just put it through my Shield which is my beater gun
 
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