.451 vs .452 45 acp 200 swc bullets

Jamesatrange · Oct 21, 2014

I'm new to reloading and started with the .452 lead 200 grain swc. Bought from a local guy that casts thousands for local sale. Issue is the .452 was leaving excess lube on the case when I loaded the brass. Frustrating because it gums up my cylinders or won't fit in after little usage. Also having the issue of some cases swelling when I put the bullet in. I had him done size 100 to .451 and they loaded much cleaner without lube on my casings after loading the bullet. I'm just not sure why I'm the few of his customers having issues with his .452 bullet. Plus I don't like downsizing the bullet because I fear it has increased my leading in the barrel. I shot all 100 of the .451 but and they shot accurate from what I could tell but it did seem to lead faster. What is acceptable lead? Any ideas on what I may be doing wrong with the .452 and why the lube is spewing over? I have a hornady lock n load. I load 40s&w and 357 mag with little lube issues.

venomballistics · Oct 21, 2014

could be the lube itself.
I made some batches in the past that left more in the die than on the bullet, others worked out much better.

I always figured if you could get about 400 rounds out before things jammed or accuracy fell apart, you had a good load. 600 or so was a great load.

Of late however, I switched over to powder coating instead of traditional lube. I have zero leading and no loading drama.
I kinda miss the coat of guntan lotion I used to get from shooting traditional lubes, but I don't miss the smoke.
In rapid fire, on occasion I actually had to stop due to inability to clearly see the target ... with powder coating, I have to stop when the barrel starts to glow

Jamesatrange · Oct 21, 2014

Does anyone sell powder coated bullets online? Is the powder lube as good? Thanks for the info maybe I'll try some powder lube bullets.

Black_Talon · Oct 21, 2014

Jamesatrange said:
Does anyone sell powder coated bullets online? Is the powder lube as good? Thanks for the info maybe I'll try some powder lube bullets.

Look at Bayou Bullets and SNS Casting for the "Hi-tek" coated bullets. I think Missouri Bullets is doing this now too.

venomballistics · Oct 21, 2014

Jamesatrange said:
Does anyone sell powder coated bullets online? Is the powder lube as good? Thanks for the info maybe I'll try some powder lube bullets.

I hold coated in higher regard than copper plated.
its not as good as traditionally lubed and sized ... its a train load better

fredj338 · Oct 22, 2014

Could be the lube or your technique. Lead bullets need more flare for best results.

scooter123 · Oct 22, 2014

fredj338 said:
Could be the lube or your technique. Lead bullets need more flare for best results.

Fred makes a good point. I'll also point out that there is no harm at all with wiping your assembled rounds clean when you place them in an ammo box. I'll also point out that if you don't have a tenth reading micrometer you really don't know the diameter of your bullets.

Fishinfool · Oct 22, 2014

What Fred said. It sounds like you are not flaring your case mouths enough prior to bullet seating, causing the bullets to scrape against the side of the case mouth during seating, depositing lube on the cases.

Some .45 acp's shoot best with .451, some .452. usually there is not that much difference in leading or accuracy. It depends on your barrel. I usually stick to .451's in mine. When using lead bullets, there will always be some leading, though it is usually minimal if the bullet is properly sized to your bore, properly lubed (a softer lube works well in a 45 acp), and not driven at maximum velocities. A flat based bullet can also lead less than a bevel base bullet, as it allows less gas cutting at the bullet base.

Larry

dmar · Oct 22, 2014

I'd flare the case a bit more, and you should have no troubles with lube smearing on the case. Unless the guy is using some sort of really soft lube, or something...? I've loaded all sorts of lead bullets, and the only time the lube has been smeared on the case wall is when I did not flare enough, or had the bullet off center when seating.

As for coats bullets, I've had good luck with both of these guys, great bullets/service:

Welcome to Precision Bullets in Kemp, Texas.
The Blue Bullets

I mostly load coated bullets these days, but still load some of my favorite lead loads, too.

SMSgt · Oct 22, 2014

The swelling is indicative of using a larger bullet and no more than that--not an issue. Bullet lube should be in the lube groove only. Anywhere else and it will be smeared off as you force the bullet into the sized case. If you're getting wax all over the case when you load, you need to clean the die more often.

Lead bullets typically are .001 over bore size. Being undersized can lead to increased leading and inaccuracy.

I haven't tried coated bullets yet as I have a lot of cast already on hand.

M29since14 · Oct 22, 2014

Fishinfool said:
What Fred said. It sounds like you are not flaring your case mouths enough...

Some .45 acp's shoot best with .451, some .452. usually there is not that much difference in leading or accuracy. It depends on your barrel. I usually stick to .451's in mine...

A little more flare should help with the lube smearing but don't flare any more than you need to - for the sake of case life. I agree with Fishinfool's comments about size. I prefer .451" these days as there are so many different brands of cases and the manufacturers do seem to be chambering barrels a bit tighter than they were 40-years ago. I have never been able to detect any difference in accuracy and leading in my guns with either .451" or .452" bullets - maybe I have just been lucky. Leading should not be a problem with a .45 Auto.

armenius · Oct 22, 2014

Many years ago somewhere I was instructed to remove excess lubricant with the use of a rag dampened with lighter fluid.Is that no longer in vogue?Worked good for me.

RussellD · Oct 22, 2014

If you try the new generation of coated bullets, you may not want to go back to traditional lubed bullets. Coated bullets leave you hands, dies, press and gun much cleaner during the loading and shooting process.

Question are you shaving lead when seating bullets? Or is it just an issue of sticky lube making a mess? Shaving lead can be easily addressed with just a little more flare. Lube issues can be cured with a sample pack from Bayou.

Vulcan Bob · Oct 22, 2014

Regardless of the type of bullet used I've found the Lyman "M" type case expander die really helps with seating bullets properly. It preps the case as well as belling the mouth for a straight seat. I use it in all of my .45 calibers.

fredj338 · Oct 22, 2014

Another thought. If you are seating & crimping in one step, this can also cause issues w. excess lube on the exterior of the fin round. I wipe loaded rds off with a paper towel, but the lube type will depend on how easily it comes off.

.451 vs .452 45 acp 200 swc bullets

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