I've finally had some time off, and gotten back into reloading handgun in earnest. Got my .38 target load down, and even got a 230 grain .45 that works in my 1917, 1911, and even my Thompson with good accuracy. However, scouring over my old books and data, I have become interested in some old listings and loads from my NRA book. For .45 AutoRim, there is a big 300 grain lead bullet pushed by 7.5 grains BlueDot, and listed as safe even for the original pre war steel 1917's. I've seen some of the other Autorim threads, but I don't believe I ever saw anything about this monster. The NRA book sadly does not list in greater details what exact bullet, if it was sold factory, custom, or what mold would drop it. I was interested in knowing if anyone here has done something similar, or knows more details of the load I'm referencing.

When thinking about this particular load, I also thought it would be worthy to ask about some other classics. Does anyone have a .45 ACP/AR equivalent to the old .45 Webley tumbling bullet loads? Also, anyone try to recreate the old British 38/200 loads in the .38 Special? Anyone recreate the old 200 grain Super Police .38 Special load?

Any and all details of bullets, molds, powders, ect. would be greatly appreciated.

There's an article in Handloader #240 (Apr-2006), "Super Heavy Bullets in the 45 ACP". It uses a 300gr bullet made by Northwest Custom Projectile (no longer in business?).

It's essentially a JSP though with a large expose lead nose & equipped with a copper boat-tail base, that facilitates loading such a long bullet in a short case by matching the case's inside taper & seated to normal 45 ACP length.

Minimal load data. Unique @ 5.8gr= 770fps from a 1911. No Bluedot data.

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Waiting for the break of day

I would suggest that you subscribe to Handloader magazine. One
article by Brian pearce on the 45 AR a few years ago featured loads
that included a cast SWC of 280 grs or so. The classic loads you mentioned have been covered in past issues from time to time. Many
past issues are still available from the publisher.

Handloader #254 does have the Pearce article with data for a "280 cast RCBS 45-270-SAA" bullet.

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USAF, 69-92
Vietnam, 72-73

Not exactly responsive to the O.P., but be careful loading for your auto rim. Recently, I loaded the exact same target load for my .45 auto rim as my .45 acp (4.6 grains of TightGroup) for my 625-2. The same load caused my auto rim cases to excessively expand in the middle making ejection difficult whereas the .45 acp handled the same load in the same revolver without any problem. I was surprised that the pressure was significantly more in the auto rim than in my acp. My acp brass has been reloaded dozens of times more often than the auto rim, so I do not believe the auto rim cases were fatigued. If you plan to reload heavy bullets with slow powder, my suggestion is to work your way up very slowly.

Forgot to mention that I was using 200 grain LSWC over 4.6 grains of TightGroup.

What particular brands of brass were you using Mr. dmy? Was it more an issue of the brand, perhaps, or the cartridge?

I'm shooting a 292 gr cast/ 5 gr Unique out of 455 Eley. Colt NS
and S&Ws. Bullet cast from 322 hp. Mold, modified from old
Ideal, for 45/70. Approx 625 fps. According to book.

dmy 45 AR brass and 45 acp brass have the same capacity. Your load
of 4.6 grs Titegroup with a 200 gr LSWC is a starting level load or even
below starting level depending on your particular bullet. So there's
something else causing your problem with AR brass other than
pressure with such a light load. And as far as brass expanding in the
middle to the point of difficult extraction, I don't see how this could
happen unless your chambers are out of spec. You need to take a
good look at your loading technique and brass before you blame it on
pressure. Could your AR brass be too long and need trimming?

There are bullet mold making outfits that produce custom molds that are surprisingly reasonable. They have hundreds of molds programmed into their CAM machines, or you can make one of your own. I know one outfit offers aluminum, brass and steel as choices of materials. If you can't find a bullet maker that has these, I'd look into this.

PS. I would be willing to bet that Big and Slow would be a great combination for accuracy.

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"He was kinda funny lookin'"

Another reason I wanted to try some heavier bullets. I've heard other 1917 revolver shooters claim that heavier lead bullets tend to do better than 230 jacketed, and that big lead tends to do well in most handgun cases. Lately I've been backing off Bullseye on my 158 SWC in 38 and 230 LRN for 45, and slow seems to be working just fine and dandy. Well worked max loads can be fun in their own right, but it seems like the tightest groups come from the tame ones.

Thanks for your responses. The only auto rim brass I have is manufactured by Remington. I do not recall if I measured and/or trimmed the cases when I first bought them, but after experiencing the problem recently, I measured the cases. They were slightly under the max length of 0.890" and measured 0.885" - 0.889". They are chamfered and deburred. The only or main difference between the auto rim and acp loads were a roll crimp on the former and a taper crimp on the latter. I would not be surprised if the different crimp caused a slight pressure difference, but as one of you noticed, my loads are very close to being on the minimum side.
One possible explanation which seemed plausible was that the case mouth might be expanding and causing friction with the headspacing shoulders. I thought that might be possible, but when I measured the case mouth of the spent auto rim brass and acp brass, they were identical (from memory, both were either 0.461" or 0.465", which was the same diameter as the case just above the "rim"). The middle of the auto rim cases were expanded (0.470" - 0.471"). I found it a little hard to believe, but have no other reasonable and likely explanation for an expanded belly of the case other than excessive pressure (even though I was shooting what I thought to be light loads).

You might be able to get a 300gr into a 4ar case, but not just any. I have been able to load the 270gr RCBS, which actually comes out closer to 285gr, with good results. I use Unique, run them about 800fps in my 4" M625. IMO, anytime vel falls much below that, penetration is going to suffer, any caliber.

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NRA Cert. Inst. IDPA CSO

I agree with alwslate, something else is going on if the same (45ACP/45AR) loads are giving different symptoms in the same gun.

I load my S-L 45AR brass to 45 Super levels & they extract the same as those in 45 Super brass, in my 325NG.

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Waiting for the break of day

Ok, go back and look at the specifications for the .45 acp
case and the AR case. They are basically straight walled
case designs with a normal dia of .472-.473 or so. Your
brass is not over expanded. You might be overdoing the
roll crimp with the AR brass but you're not getting high
pressure signs with fired brass at .470-.471.