I came upon some WW 110 gr SJHP bullets and would like to duplicate the old Treasury 38 Spl +P+ 110 gr loading using Unique. This load will only be used in 357 Magnum.

Appreciate any inputs.

Thank you

Alliant says 6.3gr is max +P. WOrk up in 1/10gr increments from there, but it's a WAG w/o pressure equip & a chrono is a must.

__________________
NRA Cert. Inst. IDPA CSO

My only comment is that the U.S. Border Patrol dropped that round like a hot potato after it failed to perform properly in the field. I certainly wouldn't want to reproduce it.

Thanks, I'm duplicating the loading for historical and hobby purposes only.

Just like 60 grs FFG and Minie Ball duplicates the old 1861 Springfield Union round of the Civil War...no intention to use such as an assault cartridge!

Some data right on this forum:

.38 Special Treasury Load

Not Unique,but my data

Remington 110gr SJHP,CCI500,IMR SR4756(no longer manufactured- my 'go to' powder for 38sp,357,40S&W,10mm,41M,44sp,44M)

3" is M36 6" is M19

10.0 = 1100fps w/3" 1200fps w/6"
11.0 = 1250fps w/3" 1350fps w/6"

Why is it so many times a reloader will ask about replicating a load but then tell you which powder they want to use? If you really want to replicate the load you will need to use the powder that will achieve that end.

__________________
Freedom is never free!!
SWCA #3437

...SR4756 was "the" powder for turning Specials into Magnums...

Bob

Perhaps more than one powder can achieve the means to an end, right?

^^^ correct,DEFINITELY more than one powder can achieve the means to an end.

True but it is not flaming dirt Unique. There are slower better powders,

__________________
Still Running Against the Wind

That's a good one Rule3, lol.

I even use Unique on my breakfast oatmeal!

It's big brother Blue Dot is worse!! Unique is OK when used at mid to full loads.

Any of the commercial factory ammo used powders that we do not have. Power Pistol used to be Bullseye 84. so if you have powders slower than Unique that are listed you should try those.

But again this forum as well as most other do not promote loads that exceed printed data. A (+P+) load is pretty much a starting 357 Mag load. So if you are experimenting please be safe and use new brass, not some that has been loaded many times.

Some of the old data like Speer #8 has some hotter loads, The 38 special can be loaded to near 357 mag data if reduced by at least 10% (more like 15% to be safe.

Not suggesting you do that but if so, you get in less trouble with the slower powders that the fast ones which create too much pressure too fast! A "rule of thumb" if there are any is the powder that fills the case the most will have more lee way or wiggle room.

But again, without a chronograph you are just a shot in the dark.

__________________
Still Running Against the Wind

For sure.

When replicating any factory load its not only the velocity you have to match, you also want to try and duplicate the felt recoil and the type of recoil. Sometimes recoil is snappy, sometimes a thud and other times a push. Of course some of the differences are due to the cartridge itself but powders can also effect the feel of the recoil. If you want a real replica you need to try and match all aspects of the original.

For example, when duplicating the Speer SB .38 Special +P there were several powders I tried that easily matched the velocity of the original but they didn't feel the same as the original. When I tried AA#5 the feel was almost identical to the original and the velocity was easy to match. When duplicating the Speer SB .357 Magnum using Power Pistol made the best duplicate IMO, not AA#5.

Here is a hint, try HS-6 to duplicate the FBI Load and Longshot to duplicate the Treasury Load.

__________________
Freedom is never free!!
SWCA #3437

Thank you ArchAngelCD

Do you "own" HS6 stock? Only kidding. I used it long ago in 357 Mag. Good powder but needed magnum primers imho.

I don't mind using a magnum primer.

No stock but some have suggested I change my name from ArchAngelCD to ArchAngelHS6 lol I do like the stuff and I'm even using it for my .45 Colt loads now too.

__________________
Freedom is never free!!
SWCA #3437

Below is a picture of .38 spl data from the Sierra Manual 2nd edition, from the early 70's. The loads are quite a bit warmer than usually listed in current data. Even though Sierra tested these loads from a 6" K-38 I've always found the velocity produced to be spot on when using a 4" revolver over my chronograph within minor insignificant variation to be expected when using a different gun under different conditions. Could be from using different primers or cases.

Unlike RC I can't feel any difference in recoil using different powders producing the same velocity, the only thing I notice is if there's a difference in muzzle flash or report. So when I'm trying to duplicate a factory load I'm looking strictly for velocity.

The loads listed below would be pretty hot for a light weight framed .38 spl there is no risk of danger in a magnum rated revolver. Use caution and common sense development with old data. This data was published before there was a +P SAAMI standard and most manuals simply had a note to reserve the heavy loads for the .38's specials with heavy frames.