I would like to develop a 38 Spl 200 gr Super Police load using Unique and Magnus 195 gr cast bullet. This is more for the enjoyment, and going down memory lane when this load was popular.

I can only find Lyman 44 data for their 195 gr bullet (358430). Lyman's Unique loads ranged from 3.0 grs to 4.1 grs. Lyman lists 3.8 grs as "Factory Duplication" velocity loading. I've loaded 15 at 3.7 grs and will test tomorrow out of a S&W Mod 642 38 Spl +P rated.

Anyone out there loaded this round before? With Unique? Any suggested loads?

Thank you

I have several old Lyman handbooks going back into the 1950s, and none of them have .38 Special recipes for bullets heavier than 175 grains. My 1980 Lyman cast bullet handbook provides no .38 Special loadings for bullets over 168 grains. I'd probably start with 3.5 grains of Unique and work upward slowly from there with a chronograph until I got something close to a MV of 700 ft/sec and stop.

Lyman #45 has data for their bullet 358430, 195 grains, Unique starts at 3.0 grains for 572fps and goes up to 4.1 grains for 772 fps. "Factory duplication" load is 3.8 grains for 773 fps.

Same data you found.

I don't think Lyman re-tested their data very often, especially for older calibers and older powders.

That's a very long bullet. Wonder if the cartridge will fit the cylinder of a 642 without seating the bullet excessively deep?

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USAF, 69-92
Vietnam, 72-73

W-W had 200 gr. loads in the early freebie Ball Powder Loading Data Booklets-let me know if you want that.
Data also shown in a DuPont freebie booklet from '66-'67.

Sharpe's book also has some loads.

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Good shooting.

And there's lots of info available right on this board. Here's just one example. Note the difference in bullet length.

Hvy. bullet .38 Spec. loads?

__________________
USAF, 69-92
Vietnam, 72-73

If you want to try it just for the heck of seeing what it's going to do,be my guest.As far as I'm concerned,the positive side is the mass will give good penetration if....the mass has enough ooomph to drive it through the intended target.The problem when you couple the 200(or 195)gr bullet with a case capacity like the .38Spl,you might/will probably run into problems before reaching that kind of velocity(of course,saying does not apply to paper target).

Mr.Keith used to think highly of a 173gr bullet in the .38 Spl as the best weight for caliber ratio until the few last years of his life when he reavaluated his position for a lesser weight of around 150gr.And while I admit that some of his sayings are now being prooved wrong(a very few of those),I must admit that most of them still hold true.And this is one I'll stick to.

After all,the man was way before his time!
Qc Pistolero

38SPL HV,

If you want to replicate the 200 Gr. "Super-Police" load, first you need to understand a little about the factory loads. The first thing is here absolutely nothing "Super" about it. Over many years I have only had shooting quantities of this load twice, one box each of Western from the early 1960s that I bought ca. 1962-3 as I recall. Old yellow box, Luballoy. There was also a full box of late Winchester, white box, yellow X, bare Lead bullets, that I was given just a few years ago by an old (literally) friend!

These are the results of chronographing these two loads. Coincidentally I have data fired from the same Model 10-4 used in the .38 Special "Back in the Day", and Comparing "FBI" Loads threads.

Published velocity for both Winchester and Remington was 730 FPS.

Winchester:
684 FPS for a 5 round sample, 6" Model 10-4. 5/15/2011

635 FPS for a (?) round sample, 5" 1918 M&P ca. 1995 (At least 5 rounds)
621 FPS Same gun, separate string of (?) rounds. (Again, at least 5 rounds)

Forgive the small sample sizes, this stuff cannot be replaced! I still have nearly half the original box, all I have ever shot of this was to chronograph it!

The old M&P typically runs a bit slow when compared to my later 5" from 1948/50 era, and most of my .38 revolvers!

Lyman .358430 98/02 Lead Tin weighs 199.5 gr. from my mold. 3.2 gr. Bullseye gave me 686 FPS for a 20 round sample from the 1918 5" M&P.

4.2 gr. Unique, bullet same as above, 6" Model 10-4, gave me 781 FPS for a 12 round sample.

Both of the above loads were crimped in the top cannellure, LOA 1.550". This will fit any standard revolver as this is SAAMI standard LOA for .38 Special.

You can get better velocity, but you asked about duplicating factory!