Most are probably aware but the Remington 125 gr SJHP bullets typically sold for reloading are identical to the ones Remington loads in their 357 Mag ammo, but not in their 38 Spl + P loading.

The Remington 38 Spl +P 125 gr SJHP bullet is different with its cannelure closer to the bullet's base as compared to the 357 Mag version. I believe Remington does not sell their 38 Spl + P SJHP version as reloading components.

Although not one of todays "wonder bullets", the old .357 125 grn. SJHP, when loaded to full power magnum velocities, was, and I would bet still is, one of the best one shot stoppers available in a handgun. Whether the 38 spl. version of this bullet differs in performance, or is available for sale as a component, I cant say. When carrying factory Remington .357 mag. 125 SJHP's in my original duty revolver back in the 1980's, I never felt undergunned. Heck, I even killed a black bear with one shot with that combo once.

Larry

I suspect the reason the +P bullets aren't offered as a loading component, is if this bullet was loaded in a .357 mag case to the cannelure, the C.O.L. might be too long for some cylinders.

Close examination of these two samples shows some 'minor' differences..


Even the cavities are a little different.
This might be just some different tooling making the bullets.

I've wished the +P bullets were available as a component for years..

They are a fantastic bullet in either configuration.

Eric,

While there may be structural differences between these bullets, the position of the cannellure means little, if anything. I have been buying bulk Remington bullets in several calibers for a lot of years. In both .38/.357 bullets, 200 Gr. 44-40 Soft Point, and their 100 gr. .32 Soft Point for .32-20, I have seen nearly that much difference in cannellure position from one batch to another, and sometimes even within a single box of 500 that apparently were from mixed lots! Don't place too much weight on this slight difference!

Used to see the same difference with the older Hornady 125 JHP that came from different lots.

The bigger cavity is similar to Speer's Gold Dot bullets which are highly regarded just about everywhere.

__________________
"He was kinda funny lookin'"

I would imagine that Remington and other big ammo makers engineer their bullets to behave in a certain way (penetration and expansion) at different velocities for different chamberings even if the bore diameter is the same. There is a fair amount of difference between most factories' .38 Special and .357 Magnum loadings's velocities with the same weight bullet. They need different bullets depending on how fast they go. You can probably use the same bullet in .38 Super and 9 X 23 Winchester, but a bullet that expands at standard .44 Special velocities may come apart at .44 Magnum velocities before it penetrates adequately.

Gelatin testing is pretty standard in self defense handgun ammo testing, and velocity and expansion standards are often specified in some big departments' ammo orders. More of today's bullets work like they are supposed to than they did a few decades back.

My mom used to tell me that I had a gift for the obvious.

Bullet hp 101:

Typically, the size and depth of the hp determines at what velocities it will function properly at. Larger hp's ='s slower velocities.




Same bullet mold just different hp pins. The penta points open extremely fast and are best in snub nosed revolvers/low velocity rounds.



Lyman made the popular "keith" bullet designed 173gr swc/358429 into a hp version. The 358439



They actually did 2 versions of this mold. The 358439 hp is a 158gr hp with a .125" diameter pin.
The 358429 hp version used a shallower hp hole with a .155" diameter hp pin.

As far as the cannalure goes more likely than not they are passing their 2nds out in their bulk bullets. What you really don't want to see is a cannalure on the left bullet in the picture RDub posted. It's a deep cannalure made for a heavy roll crimp. But A a minimum you want the seating depth of a bullet to be at least as deep as the bullet diameter. Hence, a .357" bullet has a minimum seating depth of .357". Anything less you don't get enough neck tension to hold the bullet in place.

When I make/swage my own jacketed hp's for the 38spl/357's I like to leave allot of bullet base before the cannalure. The deeper seated bullets have better neck tension and taking up more case capacity makes them more consistent/powder is less position sensitive.



Playing around making bullets with duel cannalures. I use the top cannalure for revolvers and the bottom cannalure for "Contender only" loads.



Those large deep hp's were designed to be at their best in the 1100fps range. Why 1100fps???



Because I found an extremely accurate load for the contender @100yds. That bullet/load combo slowed down to around 1100fps @100yds. I planned on using that bullet/load/hp combo in the 75yd to 125yd range so I made a hp bullet that had a hp design that is optimal for those yardages.

Anyway look at the design of a hp and make sure it fits your needs. The size/depth of a hp tells you what you need to know.

Forest (or anyone)

I always wondered (well sometimes), why the SJHP was not as popular for self defense ammo? If it was/is a great hunting bullet for I suppose soft skin animals like Deer. Why not for self defense? To much penetration? Not enough expansion in two legged creatures?

Seems it is kinda the best of both designs. Penetrates, mushrooms etc.

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Still Running Against the Wind

I'll take an educated guess. In the late 1970's / 1980's, that SJHP bullet developed quite the reputation as a stopper when fired out of factory .357 mag. loads. In an era when HP bullets were starting to become popular, many did not perform well in real world use. Many of the "old design" jacketed HP's still don't. Remember the first generation 147 JHP 9mm loads?

That particular bullet, with lots of lead exposed, along with a thin, scalloped jacket, probably more by luck than anything else, found a "sweet spot" when used in full power .357 mag loads.

It was only after modern, computer designed and tested HP's such as the Gold Dot came out, that reliable performance in expanding self defense bullets was achieved with other calibers / velocities.

Its lack of popularity today is more a function of the big switch to semi-autos. Having seen the results this bullet is capable of, there is no reason it would not still be a good choice for the .357 revolver shooter. The fact it is still available today indicates it is still popular.

Of course, there are many good choices in bullets today for use in the 357 mag., but many are just a re-invention of the wheel.

Larry

You can add the Winchester SJHP to the Remington design, also.
Both are old style design and will work for a lead tip and not
lead the barrel like a full lead bullet will at higher speeds of a +p loading if desired.

I have seen loose Remington 125gr GS bullets on the net but
have yet to see them advertise by Remington in a box for loading.