Another 200 grain SWC .45 Auto rim thread.

[JeepinSoldier]

So I just read through DRM50's thread on the .45 Auto Rim.

Great thread and lots of good advice. I did not want to hijack DRM's thread to ask a question about plated bullets.

I have been slowly buying Starline .45 AR brass and this winter I intend to load it for my 5" 625 Model of 1988. I have been shooting my regular ACP 230 grain hardball loads thru it using rimz moonclips with great success but wanted to try 200 grain SWC in AR brass.

Lucked out on the Xtreme black Friday sale and picked up 1000 of the plated 200 grain SWC. Should I use the same advice that was given to DRM50 even though my bullets are plated?

ArchAngel CD's load of 5.5 grains of 231. looks like a good place to start if it will work with the plated bullet.

I have 231/HP 38, Bullseye, and Power Pistol available.

[TAROMAN]

A place to start.
Then load, test, and repeat.

I learned through painful experience that it's best to order new bullets in small amounts.

[22hipower]

200 grain plated SWCs with 5 grains of Titegroup work very well in my 625s with AR brass. Actually, most any plated, cast, or jacketed bullet I've tried works fine in the AR cases. Some folks don't like Titegroup as it takes up so little room in a case, but it works well for me. Good luck.

Jeff
SWCA #1457

[ontargetagain]

Originally Posted by JeepinSoldier

So I just read through DRM50's thread on the .45 Auto Rim.

Great thread and lots of good advice. I did not want to hijack DRM's thread to ask a question about plated bullets.

I have been slowly buying Starline .45 AR brass and this winter I intend to load it for my 5" 625 Model of 1988. I have been shooting my regular ACP 230 grain hardball loads thru it using rimz moonclips with great success but wanted to try 200 grain SWC in AR brass.

Lucked out on the Xtreme black Friday sale and picked up 1000 of the plated 200 grain SWC. Should I use the same advice that was given to DRM50 even though my bullets are plated?

ArchAngel CD's load of 5.5 grains of 231. looks like a good place to start if it will work with the plated bullet.

I have 231/HP 38, Bullseye, and Power Pistol available.

I have shot a whole lot of these Xtreme 200 SWC's with great success. HP38/W231 works great however as I see it 5.6gr is considered max so 'starting' at 5.5 might be on the high side. I have been successful with the exact same gun you have from 4.7 to 5.2gr of HP38.
Have fun, be careful
Karl

[JeepinSoldier]

Originally Posted by TAROMAN

I learned through painful experience that it's best to order new bullets in small amounts.

Sage advice. I agonized over the purchase of 1000 bullets that were untested in my specific platform, but the price got me!

I figured that if I could not get them to perform well on paper at the indoor range, the kids and I would just burn em up plinking milk jugs at close range. Which is just as fun if not moreso.

[JeepinSoldier]

Originally Posted by ontargetagain

I have shot a whole lot of these Xtreme 200 SWC's with great success. HP38/W231 works great however as I see it 5.6gr is considered max so 'starting' at 5.5 might be on the high side. I have been successful with the exact same gun you have from 4.7 to 5.2gr of HP38.
Have fun, be careful
Karl

Thank you ontargetagain!

This was exactly the info that I was looking for!

I have been handloading since the early 90's and know what the usual technique is - start at the starting load and slowly work up until you have the best load using that specific combination for your particular firearm.

However, why reinvent the wheel when somebody else may have developed loads using the same components in a revolver as popular as the 4 or 5 inch 625?

Obviously, a prudent handloader would not exceed max loads in published manuals, and will take advice from the internet carefully, but of the five manuals I have, none have loads for plated or the new coated bullets - which I understand tend to perform between swaged/cast lead and jacketed.

Ontarget, I will load batches of 10 each from 4.7 to 5.2 and see what works best.

Again, thank you!

[Peak53]

Originally Posted by JeepinSoldier

... However, why reinvent the wheel when somebody else may have developed loads using the same components in a revolver as popular as the 4 or 5 inch 625? ...

Good question. I think the answer is that different guns even of the same model and barrel length may perform differently due to chamber size, throat dimensions, cylinder gap, etc. Your decision to back off a bit from near max loads is wise.

[JeepinSoldier]

Originally Posted by Peak53

Good question. I think the answer is that different guns even of the same model and barrel length may perform differently due to chamber size, throat dimensions, cylinder gap, etc. Your decision to back off a bit from near max loads is wise.

Yup. No reason to push the envelope on target/plinking loads. I'm not one of those that needs to stress my guns and use extra powder to shoot paper.

If I ever need to use the 625 for defense I will just use Speer Gold dot factory .45 ACP loads designed for the purpose with the Rimz moon clips.

I'm glad Ontarget posted that the load quoted was close to max.

[ArchAngelCD]

Originally Posted by JeepinSoldier

So I just read through DRM50's thread on the .45 Auto Rim.

Great thread and lots of good advice. I did not want to hijack DRM's thread to ask a question about plated bullets.

I have been slowly buying Starline .45 AR brass and this winter I intend to load it for my 5" 625 Model of 1988. I have been shooting my regular ACP 230 grain hardball loads thru it using rimz moonclips with great success but wanted to try 200 grain SWC in AR brass.

Lucked out on the Xtreme black Friday sale and picked up 1000 of the plated 200 grain SWC. Should I use the same advice that was given to DRM50 even though my bullets are plated?

ArchAngel CD's load of 5.5 grains of 231. looks like a good place to start if it will work with the plated bullet.

I have 231/HP 38, Bullseye, and Power Pistol available.

I know it's very strange but for me a charge of 5.5gr W231 works well with any 230gr or 200gr bullet in the 45 ACP. Should be no different with the 45 AR. Most plated bullets use cast lead bullet load data. I have a feeling 5.5gr W231 will work well for you too.

[Zoner]

i used 5 grs 231 and 200gr cast swc's for years in my 45 acp's and still would be if i could find the 231.

[StakeOut]

For just punching holes in paper at the indoor range shooting a 625-2 I use a 200gr Berry's plated SWC over 4gr of Bullseye or 4.1gr of Red Dot in Starline 45 AR cases.

Total Overall Length of 1.235

[JeepinSoldier]

Originally Posted by ArchAngelCD

I know it's very strange but for me a charge of 5.5gr W231 works well with any 230gr or 200gr bullet in the 45 ACP. Should be no different with the 45 AR. Most plated bullets use cast lead bullet load data. I have a feeling 5.5gr W231 will work well for you too.

5.5 grains of 231 is my load for the 230 grain FMJ's from Precision Delta and its below the 5.7 grain max load listed in the Hornady 8th Edition and the 6.2 grain max load in Speer #14.

Usually you can load lighter bullets with higher charges, so that's why I was looking at your load to begin with. What got me was the difference (If any) between unplated, plated, and FMJ/TMJ bullets.

In the Hornady 8th, max load for 231 unplated is 6.3 grains and TMJ is 6.2 grains.

In the Speer manual, 231 unplated max is 5 grains and TMJ is 5.5.

[JeepinSoldier]

Originally Posted by Zoner

i used 5 grs 231 and 200gr cast swc's for years in my 45 acp's and still would be if i could find the 231.

Sorry to hear that you still cannot purchase 231/HP 38.

231/HP 38 is my favorite all around pistol powder, and fortunately for me it has become available around Denver in 1, 4, and 8 pound containers. After a few years with no powder, when I saw it I purchased 20 pounds of it!

[cowboy4evr]

I consider W231/HP-38 to be an " in between powder " that I just don't need . I use WST for my fast powder (replaced Bullseye ) and WSF for my slower powder (replaced unique ) . Those 2 get the most work out on my bench for my semi auto's and my revolvers . WST is my go to powder for my 45acp loads using 230gr round nose cast / plated . Also great in 38spl using 158gr bullets .

[ArchAngelCD]

Originally Posted by Zoner

i used 5 grs 231 and 200gr cast swc's for years in my 45 acp's and still would be if i could find the 231.

Just in case you don't know, Hodgdon HP-38 is the same exact powder so you can use it as a direct replacement.

[m657]

"200 SWC's with great success. HP38/W231"
I've had excellent results with a variety of recipes in my 625s.

I don't like the 185g cast SWC in my 1911s.

[Groo01]

Groo here
My go to load is 5 gr Bullseye and a 185/200/230 bullet.
If you want a "HOT" load , check out the 200gr loads for CFE pistol!!

[JeepinSoldier]

So last weekend I got the Dillon 550 set up for .45 Auto Rim and I primed some cases.

Today I had some time so I made my first .45AR ammo!

Components were:

New Starline .45 AR brass, CCI 300 large pistol primers, Winchester 231 powder, and Xtreme 200 grain plated semi wadcutters.

I made 12 rounds each at 4.8 grains, 5 grains, 5.2 grains, and 5.5 grains. Now to get the 625 to the range!

When I do Ill post the results.

[spad124]

I have a M1917 that prints 6 inch groups at 15 yards with 45ACP hardball. I tried loading some Berry's 230gr plated in Remington Auto Rim cases with 5 grains of 231. The groups shrunk to about 1.5 inches. All I can think of is that the rim of the AR case provides better and more consistent support case to case than the ACP flopping around in a moon clip.