Any love for 200gr in .38 special?

[TomkinsSP]

A local guy casts bullets from old molds. (I think he is more into collecting molds than anything.) His newest find gives a 200 grain "wadcutter?" designed to be seated 3/4 inside the case (with 3 grease grooves) crimped over a shoulder that is no more than 10 percent of the diameter, with the remaining 1/4 continuing at about 90 percent of diameter to a flat sharp edged front. (Might be a Cramer, I have seen some lighter ones that look very similar.) Any thoughts?

[rwsmith]

...but I would need a lot more barrel. I'd probably load them into my 6" 686. That would do them justice.

I'm experimenting with extra heavy bullets in 9mm (up to 165 gr) so I do have an interest in them.

[Ivan the Butcher]

I used a 200gr RN for 35 Remington in my 38 S&W chambered guns to duplicate the English Military load. This could work for that.

With all that bearing surface, it should be accurate out of every barrel length, I just wonder about the recoil out of a alloy J-frame snubby!

Ivan

[DWalt]

One of the reasons given for the handgun use of a 200 grain bullet at lower velocity is that being longer, it is less stable in tissue and yaws, creating a larger permanent wound channel.

[Nevada Ed]

One of my "Old" loading books shows the 200 gr lead bullet doing
842 and 824 fps with two of its slower powders listed at 15,900 CUP.

If you have HP38 or W231 the starting load of just 2.5grs is at 640 +/-, 11,800 CUP.

[squidsix]

I would shoot fast 200 grain out of a long barrel or levergun in a second. It should group beautifully and will penetrate very well. I have fired lots of 180 grain hard cast out of model 10 and 15 revolvers with great results. This should not be too different.

[Wee Hooker]

Without seeing it, I'd have concern with climbing pressures induced by the reduced case volume when you stuff that big wad cutter in there. I'd be limiting myself to light loads of bullseye (or similar fast powder ) to start. Watch for pressure signs too.
Could be a fun experiment though.

[LoboGunLeather]

I recall playing around with a 200 grain cast lead round nose flat point in .38 Special back about 1980 or so. I had a 2" Model 36, 2.5" Model 19, and 4" and 6" Model 19's at the time.

The Model 19's were zero'd for 50 feet using 158 SWC loads. The 200 grain bullets regularly shot about 5" to 6" above point of aim. The longer barreled revolvers provided good groups with apparent stability of the bullets. The short barreled revolvers also shot quite high in relation to point of aim, groups were much larger, and frequent key-holing indicated a general lack of stability from the short barrels. Penetration was very impressive, with three 2X4 boards back to back required to stop the heavy slugs (in the third board) shooting at about 5 yards, and those slugs punched through car doors like an ice pick through butter.

Don't recall the specific loads used, but they were all quite moderate. Recoil was sharp, and in the Model 36 recoil was quite uncomfortable.

These results are by no means empirical evidence of anything, just anecdotal observations on one bullet type in a few handguns. Others may have much different experiences.

For my purposes I decided not to pursue the idea any further.

[Duckford]

YouTube

I've only done work with the 195 grain Lyman mold bullets, and then only testing to find a good minimal load for a Super Police rough equivalent for this particular ballistic gel test. What surprised me was even at an average of 620 fps, they appeared to be accurate in my 4 inch Model 10 and 6 1/2 inch M27. At 100 yards I was able to ding the 12 inch gong offhand regularly with both revolvers, without holding high, even with the bullet drop. The only problem I had with such a low load was it didn't work as well in my 1894 20 inch rifle.

I really like the bullet and it seems very accurate, but I've been too caught up in mass production of other bullets to get around to working with this and the Lee 200 grain again, but I think it has great potential. If Lyman made a 4 mold for it, i would buy it. Going to get my Ransom set up and get the final scientific word on the real potential of the heavyweights here in the near future.

[nachogrande]

I considered 175 gr cast, but ran into a case of "leave VERY good enough alone" with the 148 gr DEWC's seated flush & 2.8-3 gr's of bullseye. Run em up the flagpole & see who salutes.

[TomkinsSP]

[QuUOTE=nachogrande;139651861]I considered 175 gr cast, but ran into a case of "leave VERY good enough alone" with the 148 gr DEWC's seated flush & 2.8-3 gr's of bullseye. Run em up the flagpole & see who salutes.[/QUOTE]

My locker is full of 148 lhbwc (mostly Hornady's) over 2.8 of BE and 150 lfbwc over 3.2. (My edc is loaded with this.) But its fun to expirament, that's how I found a Hornady 158 SWC over 4.6 of TB another fun load.

[TomkinsSP]

Originally Posted by Wee Hooker

Without seeing it, I'd have concern with climbing pressures induced by the reduced case volume when you stuff that big wad cutter in there. I'd be limiting myself to light loads of bullseye (or similar fast powder ) to start. Watch for pressure signs too.
Could be a fun experiment though.

I'm not sure exactly what to call theese boolits. They aren't EXACTLY wadcutters, because you load them 3/4 in the case not flush with the,case,mouth. But they aren't EXACTLY semi-wad cutters because they have a straight side and metplat that is just a smidge under 100 percent of diameter. Just enough to clear the cylinder rebate. The .358 part is about as long as a 150 grain lfbwc, makes sense 3/4 200=150. Man that is selling them is calling them "pencils" but I have never heard this term in regards to bullets before.

[reddog81]

I've got the Lyman 195 mold and have had success accuracy wise with a couple loads. The front driving band on the Lyman mold is really long and caused some issues with chambering in revolvers with tight throats. With any bullet that long you are probably swaging the bullet down in diameter because you have to seat it so deep.

It is definitely possible to load bullets that large, you just have a lot less room for error. OAL becomes more important. Powder charges have a smaller window, etc. It's fun to experiment but realistically I'm not sure what 195 grains can do that 180 or even 158 can't...