160gr. 9mm bullets

Collo Rosso · Sep 30, 2018

Used my Ruger PC carbine for the first time yesterday in a bowling pin/steel challenge match. No problem with a Texas star but the 124gr. bullets ain't got enough a$$ for the bowling pins. 147 grain are easy to find but Bayou bullets has a coated 160 grain RN that might be worth trying.
Any experience with a 9mm this heavy?

jwk · Sep 30, 2018

Going to be slowwwwww!

Alk8944 · Sep 30, 2018

If a 124 gr. 9mm load from a rifle won't knock down bowling pins it has to be a pretty anemic loading! Warm it up a bit.

The only time a 9mm is ballistically superior to .38 Special is with full-power loads with bullets of standard-for-caliber bullets, 124 gr. and lighter.

Warren Sear · Sep 30, 2018

This heavier and heavier-for-caliber-bullet fad is really getting carried away!

Collo Rosso · Sep 30, 2018

Warren Sear said:
This heavier and heavier-for-caliber-bullet fad is really getting carried away!

I didn't start it!

Alk8944 said:
If a 124 gr. 9mm load from a rifle won't knock down bowling pins it has to be a pretty anemic loading! Warm it up a bit.

By Hodgdon's web site it was a max load of HS-6. We shot at 20 yards and none of the 9mm carbines would clear a pin with one shot. I was surprised. One was shooting a M1 carbine and it only needed one round, but many thought it not quite a "pistol caliber". One guy was shooting an old Ruger PC carbine in 45acp and it too usually cleared a pin with one round. Fat and slow rules the day with bowling pins.

Rock185 · Sep 30, 2018

I wasn't shooting bowling pins, but have loaded cast bullets up to 158 grains in 9mm. So long ago, can't remember powder, velocity, results etc. But have you tried the factory 147 Speer Lawman flat point, or factory IMI 158 grain? I've not tried the IMI 158, but IIRC the 147 Lawman averaged 1100 fps or so in my 16" carbine. These might give you a baseline to shoot for in future reloads, if either is more effective at knocking down bowling pins than your current load.

FWIW, I think those guys shooting the heavier and larger diameter bullets are always going to have the advantage at knocking down bowling pins and steel.......

fredj338 · Sep 30, 2018

I've run 160-165gr at 9mm minor with good success in glocks, so-so in my 1911/9. Stupid soft shooting too. Fwiw, I find 147gr adequate for steel or pins. For pins nose shape seems more important than weight, ie flatpoints bite the pin better than rn.

Nevada Ed · Sep 30, 2018

I loaded the Speer 147 TMJ in my 3.5" CD that is .643" in length
and could get 971 fps with Unique powder.

I shot the Berry plated 147 RN that is .672" long in my 5" and
could only get 877fps with Unique due to the case volume but
did get 1040fps with BE-86 powder.

In the small case 9mm, case volume and bullet size gets to be a
major pain whit bullet at 147 grs or heavier with the type of powder
that you choose to use in your loads.

With a 160grbullet..............
ball powders will be your best option.
You might try a 100 count box of 147gr before you buy a lot of 160's.

Good luck.

Ivan the Butcher · Sep 30, 2018

The Accurate loading manual has 9mm loadings for 158gr 357 bullets out of handgun, they'll be safe in a carbine! I always tried for 158gr soft hollow points for the full auto 9mm, they delivered more "umph!"

Over the years I had 3 Marlin Camp 9 carbines, they cycled 158 gr .357 bullets fine. I had a box of .358/200gr RNSP for 35 Remington but never got around to trying a 9x19 load for them. (They did work fine in 38 S&W). The 180 gr FN/TMJ .357 Silhouette bullet just blew the case wall, from the open bolt full auto, never tried them in a carbine.

Ivan

colt_saa · Sep 30, 2018

I have been loading 165 grain plated round nose in the 9MM SMGs for some time now.

YES, they are VERY shiny. eXtreme makes a pretty projectile

Since I was keeping the projectile sub sonic for the suppressed guns, the only way to increase energy was with heavier projectiles.

I originally used to shoot the IMI 158s (we had access to tens of thousands of these), then I started loading my own plated 158TCs once the IMIs dried up

This was a very good projectile for he 9MM.

But, Then I found the 165s and now I am happy

I use 5.6 grains of AA#7. That gets me almost 900 out of the 5" handguns and stays just sub sonic in the 8.3" MP5s and 10" suppressed UZI

It is very quite in all the guns

6string · Sep 30, 2018

Colt SAA raises a very good point. There's myriad applications for 9mm in which suppressed fire is desirable. Subsonic is a key to these applications being successful.
Having said that, keep in mind your barrel twist. A fast twist is essential to stabilize a slow, heavy-for-caliber slug.

The original Swiss made SIG P210 had a 1:250mm twist. That's about 1:10". Perfect!

Jim

Mike SC Hunter · Sep 30, 2018

jwk said:
Going to be slowwwwww!

Yep. Walking speed. Don't do it...........Use a bigger gun.

fredj338 · Sep 30, 2018

jwk said:
Going to be slowwwwww!

Yeah in a 5", you top out around 850fps, but that is 45acp vel??

Ivan the Butcher · Oct 1, 2018

slow 9mm

fredj338 said:
Yeah in a 5", you top out around 850fps, but that is 45acp vel??

Yes about 45 ACP 230 gr velocity, but no where the energy, or bowling pin knockdown!

The 'use a bigger gun' is always a nice idea, but since you are invested already in a 9mm Carbine, faster, heavier or both is the way you'll need to go. I always liked heavier! As an example, 45-70 500 at 1250fps, shoots clear through a buffalo 2 to 3 hundred yards. Slow and heavy gets the job done when the distance is reasonable. A 9mm carbine is just pointless at 100 plus yards!

Ivan

Nevada Ed · Oct 1, 2018

If that Ruger has the long 16" barrel................

make sure the load has enough speed to clear the barrel.

Minimum loads are not the way to start your test loads with the 160's.
Since you want to knock pins over, try a factory box of ammo to see what the fps is, to get a ruff idea what is needed, if you have a chrony.

I would think that a long 160 could hang up pretty easy if going too slow
in a 16" barrel.
I seem to remember a warning about barrels longer than 10" somewhere.....
but can't remember what it was for?

Good shooting.

colt_saa · Oct 1, 2018

6string said:
Colt SAA raises a very good point. There's myriad applications for 9mm in which suppressed fire is desirable. Subsonic is a key to these applications being successful.
Having said that, keep in mind your barrel twist. A fast twist is essential to stabilize a slow, heavy-for-caliber slug.

The original Swiss made SIG P210 had a 1:250mm twist. That's about 1:10". Perfect!

Jim

Jim,
Factory MP5s and UZI SMG barrels also use a 1:10 twist

Collo Rosso · Oct 1, 2018

The Ruger has a 1:10 twist!

Agree with fredj338 that flat nose bullet is important also, letting the bullet bite when not on center. With that I went shopping and have some coated 147 grain RNFP's coming from MBC. Figured that's a good bullet to start with. While I have this obsession with heavy for the caliber bullet thing going I also ordered some 250 grain RNFP's for my 45acp pin loads and 180 grain WFN's for 357 when I shoot revolver class. No bowling pin is safe...

Ivan the Butcher · Oct 1, 2018

Collo Rosso said:
No bowling pin is safe...

Famous last words!

Ivan

Nevada Ed · Oct 3, 2018

I got the 147gr plated FN bullet out of a 5" pistol to do 1040fps.
This adds up to 353 ft/lbs of muzzle energy..........

which should take a pin off the table with a solid hit.

I have no idea what ME is needed for pins in the 9mm and bullet sizes but
I would think that a 300 ME should work, no matter what weight bullet is used.......

against a 3lb 6oz to 3lb 10oz, bowling pin.

Good shooting.

160gr. 9mm bullets

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