38 special federal HST load data

SquarePizza · Apr 3, 2019

So I happened upon some 130 grain micro HST bullets on gunbroker, and I picked some up. For the price of 1 box of 20 factory, I can get 200 pieces and load them myself.

The only problem is, a jacketed wadcutter seated flush with the case mouth, I am worried about load pressures if I take a stab at it alone. Has anyone seen any load data for these bullets?

Nevada Ed · Apr 3, 2019

No data but it would be interesting to see what those bullets look like.

If like the 9mm or a little different shape for the 38 Special design?

Nice find.

ArchAngelCD · Apr 3, 2019

Ed, take a look at the bullets here:
Premium 38 Special +P Ammo For Sale - 130 Grain HST JHP Ammunition in Stock by Federal Personal Defense Micro - 200 Rounds

The show the bullets in pics next to the ammo boxes.

ArchAngelCD · Apr 3, 2019

Load data? Hodgdon supplies data for 148gr WC ammo which is perfectly safe with a 130 WC bullet. Slowly work up until you get close to the factory ammo velocity minus the longer test barrel assistance.

That is what I would do but you do what you think is safe. ( I have having to say that stuff in this new world we now live in!)

Eddietruett · Apr 3, 2019

One of my favorite loads is 130gr Coated Lead with 5.0gr of Universal IIRC I get between 1000-1100 FPS with a 6” barrel. Again I’m trying to remember without my books but I believe around 5.5gr is max +P. I would think 1000 FPS would give pretty good performance with that bullet

GeoJelly · Apr 3, 2019

SquarePizza - I think links to active GB auctions are prohibited here. That said, any hints as to how to locate them on GB? I really like the huge HP cavity on those bullets and would like to find some…

SquarePizza · Apr 3, 2019

I was actually just searching for "38 wadcutter" on GB and I found a guy that had 9 lots of 200. I wish I had snagged a second lot of 200, but I don't know if that is really necessary or not.

To those who have suggested 148 WC data. Those loads are typically really reduced and optimized for target velocity.

The HST 130 is a jacketted defensive bullet designed to fit flush with the case mouth, and be pushed faster than a normal lead WC.

Things that are causing me to pause:

1- Increased pressure of using a jacketed bullet instead of lead.
2- This round is seated flush like a normal WC, reducing volume and increasing pressure.

3- This will be fired from a model 36 and model 10, so I am trying to stay within safe 38 or 38 +p pressure limits.

So for example, hodgden lists 148LWC using CFE as 3.5grs at 14kpsi to 3.9grains at 15,700psi

Given they list 38 spec pressure limits at 17k psi, that loads is still under max pressure. I am using a lighter bullet (less pressure) but it is jacketed and has a long bearing surface (more pressure?)....

Worst case, these bullets do have a crimping cannular so I could abandon the idea of loading them flush and use 125-140gr jacketted as a guide at seat the bullet to max COAL.

I'm also going to try some magnum loads for my 649... but thats another day.

Lastly, for those wanting pictures of the bullet.

STORMINORMAN · Apr 3, 2019

Since these numbers have historically been safe for heavier WC's, a starting load of 2.7 GR BULLSEYE or 3.5 GR WIN231 ought to get the bullets out of the barrel: then it should be easy to chronograph and work up to the 890fps the factory claims...

The many videos show impressive expansion for this round: even in < 2" barrels.

The canellure also gives a lot of flexibility vis-a-vis loading this bullet LONG...

Cheers!

Jellybean · Apr 3, 2019

There was a time when loading Speer 148 gr. HBWC's backward was the hottest rage and showed impressive expansion in clay. But in the real world they were no better than any other HP bullet so no factory picked up on it and the fad died away. The lesson of WC's don't feed as easily as other profiles was relearned on the way though.

Moral of the story is: there really isn't anything "new" in bullet technology that is really new.

reddog81 · Apr 3, 2019

Figure out how much of the space inside the case your bullets take up. Find a jacketed bullet that takes up the same amount of space inside the case and you should be fine using that data. I'd guess that 158 grain data should be close.

What are you shooting them in? That would make a big difference on how conservative I'd be.

Do you have access to a chronograph? Without knowing where your velocities stand everything is just going to be a guess.

hollywood63 · Apr 3, 2019

I thought about getting some and loading them to the canlluer

ArchAngelCD · Apr 3, 2019

Some of these answers make me think the person writing the post doesn't know what the bullets look like, they are full wadcutters and should not use 158gr SWC data.

The OP mentioned he is looking for SD velocities, that's why I made the suggestions I did in post #4.

GeoJelly · Apr 7, 2019

Thank-you Mr Pizza

for the info - I have ordered a lot of 200. Looking at the good photo of the bullet, it has a longer bearing surface than a 158-gr jacketed bullet. So, I’m going to start with Power Pistol 158-gr data and seat to the cannelure with a light roll crimp. This is the kind of ‘experimental’ re-loading that I like to do ... and I haven’t blown anything up yet!

. Needless to say I’ll fire the first few rds in my 3-inch GP-100.

STORMINORMAN · Apr 7, 2019

Yep: and as was previously mentioned...

ArchAngelCD said:
Some of these answers make me think the person writing the post doesn't know what the bullets look like, they are full wadcutters and should not use 158gr SWC data.

The OP mentioned he is looking for SD velocities, that's why I made the suggestions I did in post #4.

...a published Hodgdon's 38 Special ( as in "not +P") load for a heavier wadcutter (i.e., a 148gr LHBWC) of 3.5 gr WIN 231 @ 869 fps MIN is approaching Federal's claimed 890 fps and further development should be rather easy with a published MAX of 4.0 gr WIN 231 @ 956 fps...? Well into SD velocities.

Even more interesting might be a 357 Magnum MIN load of 4.0 gr AutoComp @ 943 fps with a MAX over 1K..?

That might be pretty sweet out of a Model 19?

Cheers!

P.S. Just tried to order 400... Gosh, isn't Gunbroker.com a complicated mess to just make a simple purchase?

tlawler · Apr 7, 2019

How did you guys find them? I did a search on GB, but only came up with factory bullets, no projectiles.

tlawler · Apr 20, 2019

I just got mine in the mail today. I’m researching the threads on them and making notes, and will soon be loading some up for range testing.

Dieseltech56 · Apr 20, 2019

Man I wish I could have found some of these

GeoJelly · Apr 20, 2019

I just loaded 20 today to test fire them at the range next Friday. I used virgin Win brass and noticed that there wasn't much seating effort. Could be that the Win brass is a little thin - or are these things sized to .356? I dunno - I don't have a caliper. I chickened out and loaded them with 4.5-g of Universal, and seated them to the cannelure. Shown with my 360J but I'm going to fire the first batch in either an SP-101 or my M10 snub ...

mikerjf · Apr 20, 2019

If you have a chrono maybe you could fire a box of factory and then work your reloads up to that velocity?
miker

Biggfoot44 · Apr 20, 2019

This thread has my intrest . This is pretty much virgin territory .

Back in the day " full load " 148gr wadcutters at 900-ish used to be a thing, and there was some older data for that . But those were lead .

With the deep cavity on the HST bullet , the surface area ane seating depth should be in same ballpark as 148 WC , but it's wild guessing as to the effects of jacketed , and lighter weight .

If ( using only in a .357 gun to make pressures moot ) I could guess at a powder, and work up to match a chrono reading . But I would suspect Federal used a non-canister powder to get their pressure/ velocity .

38 special federal HST load data

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