I have been saving up lead for the past several years when I come across it in the hopes that I was going to take the next step and start casting one day. Well I think that day has come. I am going to PC my bullets as I’m already set up to do so (I had to remove lube from some cast bullets I had that were full of crud and lube falling out and had success coating them). I have a Lee 20lb pot, a few molds (rcbs/lee), ingot mold, and of course lead. Thats the part I’m not so sure about. Do I need a hardness tester to see where I’m at with the lead I have? It’s mostly old blocks and containers from a hospital nucmed dept (the stuff is not radioactive haha). I also have like 30 or so pounds of pulled bullets (others loads I pulled for components). It seems that hardness doesn’t matter as much for revolver loads that are coated however too pure and it won’t fill out the molds properly? Not sure how to start with that part and any help will be appreciated.

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Jim

You do need to know what your alloy is. Pure lead will be too soft and will lead something terrible. A hardness tester will get you there, but there is another option. Many pawn shops now have XRF machines that they use to verify jewelry with. They can use it to determine the alloy in your lead and there are charts that will give you the hardness based on the alloy. If you are friendly with one, they will likely test a sample for you and tell you what you got.

You can add tin and antimony to get the right mix. Tin can be had from radiator solder, something like 50/50 is 50% tin and 50% lead, adding to the mix can get you where you need to be. You can also order the metals online, seems like rotometals is one dealer.

Rosewood

Thank you so much! I did not know about the pawn store trick so I’ll be sure to give that a try. Also thanks for the tip with the solder.

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Jim

I have been casting for more than four decades but I have never owned or even used a hardness tester

I have always known the sources of my lead so I knew how to alloy them as necessary, but you have not disclosed where your lead came and if it was one or multiple sources

What you can do to get around the need of a hardness tester is take one of your existing commercially cast bullets that work well for you and see how your thumbnail scratches them and brushes across them, Then compare that to the lead that you have sourced to do your casting from and see if it's softer or harder

If you have lead from multiple sources that happen to be of different hardness you can probably alloy them together to come up with what you need

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"Acta non verba"

^Agreed. Knowing what you got, you can do the math and get where you need to be. But if your sources are unknown, then you can do some inductive guessing or have it tested and eliminate the guess work.

Rosewood

I've cast before and I used straight lino when I could get it. I have a question for those of you who powder coat, how important is hardness if powder coated??

Just word of cautiom...don't mess with antimony unless it is already mixed with lead...makes it hard...but it is dangerous to mess with as temps have to be high. The antimony I get is from lead shot.Mag shot runs 5 to 7% antimony. Tin I get from farm auctions yard sales usually in ingot form and as stated 50-50 solder or sometimes at yard sales etc from lead free solder90% tin. I bought 80 lbs of lead free solder at an auction. I actually have 4 tons of lead left. I took a ton to the scrap yard and got $1.05 a pound. I made a lot of my own shot

Here's a discussion about hosp and lab shielding lead.
Some interesting info.

Isotope Lead??? [Archive] - Cast Boolits

I don't cast my own bullets anymore. But, when I did I got free wheel weights from gas stations and added tin to the pot. Never had a problem with bore leading even with full house 357 and 44 mag loads.
I now buy my lead bullets usually from USA Midway. Casting your own is a lot of work plus breathing lead fumes.

Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook, is the best reference book on bullet casting. I have the 3rd edition and the 4th is the current one. There is a casting section in all the Lyman Loading Manuals, but many editions don't have al the little secrets the CBH does.

Since you are Coating the hardness won't be a major issue. But different alloys produce different "As Cast" diameters from the same mold and different weights too. That should be important to you.

Ivan

The first 98 pages of the Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook 4th Edition is filled with "How-To" information and casting knowledge ...
The rifle and handgun loading data follows these informational chapters /
Lots of great info contained in one book ...
My advice ... Buy one , study the first 98 pages and keep it handy for when working up loads .
Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook 4th edition and The older 3rd Edition ... are still my #1 Go-To source of information be it casting or loading lead bullets .
The best way to learn how to cast bullets ... is to .., Cast Bullets !
Jump in there and pour hot lead ... Good Luck !
Gary

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Certified Cajun
NRA Member

The cheap and effective hardness testing method uses art pencils. It's on YouTube.

Thanks for the help and knowledge my friends. I have a lot of homework to do and can’t wait to jump in. Now, I don’t “plan” on casting everything in shoot and only when times are tough to get components however I know myself way too well and I’m sure I’ll be getting more and more molds! I’m one of the ones who enjoy reloading as much as shooting. It’s a way to spend more time with the gun hobby and I think casting will also allow more time enjoying it.

Side note…I’m completely stupid as I have a copy of the Lyman cast 3rd edition already! I like it for the cast loading data and didn’t even think to look ofer the casting section! I also do like to ask the members here because there’s a wealth of knowledge and lots of tips and tricks from you all.

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Jim

From Ingot to Target: A Cast Bullet Guide For Handgunners, Table of Contents - Fryxell/Applegate

hardness tester ...... Get a box of some hard cast approximately of the same style your casting. pit them against eachother, nose to nose in any contrivance you can smash them together with.
this is a quick cheap and dirty way of checking your alloy for softer than, harder than or pretty derned close to that of a known sample.

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it just needs more voltage

Started casting in 1972. 52 years ago. never had or ever felt the need for a hardness tester........I mostly use WW's sometimes alloyed with lynotype.. Shoot "em" in gas guns. Garand/30 carbie/Ruger 44 auto.......Little to no leading and NEVER clogged a gas port.....That's Really an old wive's tale.

Iffen you you want to harden your lead mix. Buy a roll of rosin core solder and add a bout a 12 in. piece to each melt.

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S&W Accumulator

You will learn too soon that you don't have enough bullet molds!

On used molds, it is OK if they are rusty on the outside, as long as the cavity(s) and mating surfaces are still smooth.

I thought a used Lee 185 SWC 45 ACP mold would be a waste of money! My Best Friend and have cast well over 150,000 bullets with it in the last 40 years and it is still going strong! So used Lee's can be fine if not abused.

It is OK to cast a pile of bullets, and not use them for years. Castings are a great way to store lead, or at least as good as using ingots for storage.

You can use cast bullets for a 38/357 in a 9mm and sometimes vice versa.

Ivan

Get a set of artists pencils (amazon for $5)

Take the point and sand it down at an angle (+/- 45*) making a chisel tip.

Try to scratch/gouge a lead ingot with 1 of the pencils starting with a soft pencil. Keep testing with harder pencils until they won't scratch/put a groove in the lead. The last pencil that scratched the lead will give you an idea of the hardness of your alloy.

The absolute biggest mistake you can make is doing/making small batches of alloy at 1 time. Accuracy is consistency. I've used nothing more than range scrap/hill pickins for casting bullets for years (1980's). Typical batches are #100+ of clean ingots at 1 time making 8/9bhn alloy.

Used to use a large cast iron pot to melt everything down in. Now I use a propane tank cut in 1/2 and a propane turkey fryer base. The tank is full of alloy (#100+)



I've pretty much have made/used the same alloy all these years for 99% of my pistol/revolver/ under 2000fps rifle bullets.

Never had to add any tin for fill out (wish I had a dollar for every time I've read it's needed).

Never had too soft of a bullet (wish I had a dollar for every time I've read about too soft of an alloy and leading).

You're coating bullets which is a huge plus!!!!

My brother brought me some range scrap. Probably 200# of it divided between (4) 5 gallon buckets (only about 1/4 full). I melted it down and cast some boolits with it. They clearly did not fill out the molds worth a dang. In fact, the boolits looked awful. They are also clearly softer than my clip on wheel weight ingots. It is on my to do list to have it checked and add tin as needed.

Rosewood

Just wanted to say thanks again for the links, knowledge, and tips. You guys are always a wealth of information.

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Jim

I'm pretty lackadaisical about lead hardness. My guns are my hardness testers.
Too soft, and boolits will deform on the feed ramp and I'll get FTF's. In order to increase hardness I'll add handfuls of Lino to the pot as I cast.

It allows you to shoot a softer alloy without leading. You still need to size but you can do that in a standard press with NOE's sizing system. Sizing Tools | NOE Bullet Moulds

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Front sight and squeeze

My setup. I cast with 4 molds in rotation. On gets to hot I go to the next one. Divider box holds 4 different calibers. Casting and loading is the only way I can afford to shoot the big boomers a lot. I have never powder coated a bullet. I just lube/size in 2 RCBS lubersizers. I use homemade lube. 60% commode seal and 40% canning wax. Works great. Been using it for over 20 years.

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S&W Accumulator

Guess I've been lucky for decades now.

Or I was unlucky.

I have been casting off and on for 50 years. Never checked for hardness of any of my cast bullets. Never have noted any problems with leading in any caliber. I have been powder coating my bullets that I cast for several years now. I have noticed that the amount of patches to clean the fouling in the barrel are fewer now that I powder coat. Never have had a problem with the lead (wherever I got it) filling a mold. As has been stated "Guess I've been lucky!".

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USMC 69-93 Combat Pistol Inst.

Having the correct diameter projectile is more important than hardness. There have been times when I got more leading from hard commercial cast than I have with bullets that I cast myself.
When looking for a lead alloy, my primary concern is how well the mould gets filled out. Then size the bullet a little on the large size, and use a SOFT bullet lube like Alox. *I never messed with powder coating. The old Lyman Lubrisizer always worked great. I have no desire to reinvent the wheel.

When everything goes right, casting was satisfying. I can't find lead anymore. Truth be told, I shoot a lot of XTPs now. My lead supply is gone.

I didn't start casting until about 2012 or so. I had leading issues in several cartridges. Played around with molds, oversized molds and even the "beagle" trick. Worked out most of the issues, but once I started powder coating, those molds that gave me leading issues no longer do so. PC'ing solved a lot of leading ails and the ammo is so much cleaner now. I won't go back to lubing except for some gas checked molds.

Rosewood

I want to start a reloader's anonymous group. I started just doing hunting loads with my father. I guess that makes him an enabler. Then I moved into reloading 38/357. Then more pistol and rifle calibers.

Then I got hooked on the really hard stuff. I started casting 38/357. I moved onto 44 special, 45ACP/460 mag. I am now into .308 for 30/30. It is a special kind of addiction. Kinda seems like there is no in between, you are all in with reloading/casting or you are a regular at Scheels or Midway USA to buy whatever is cheapest.

Is there a scared straight for kids to not get into reloading?

I started casting in 1975. Then I had a huge supply of pure lead, linotype and bar solder. I got the Lyman #2 formula from the Lyman casting manual, and for many years I judiciously weighed out the 3 components. Back then, and still today, many advocate the Lyman #2 formula.

About 30 years ago I ran out of the 3 components. At the same time I was gifted a couple of buckets of wheel weights. I stockpiled them and have been using straight WWs ever since.


Before casting I was using Speer wadcutters and had leading all the time. Since casting my own I have not leaded a single barrel.

I find that WWs are very consistent. I water quench out of the mold and that has increased the hardness. I won't use range lead because I don't know what the alloy is (might be some Speers in there).

My casting is done in the basement with virtually no ventillation. Also, I shoot at an indoor range at least one a week. After 49 years of doing all that my blood tests show virtually no lead contamination.

Lead isn't from breathing, it is from injestion. Most folks with lead issues were folks that worked with lead that smoked. They handled lead then put cigarette in mouth. If you keep your hands washed and don't touch your face, mouth or something you plan on sticking in your mouth, you are not going to have lead issues.

Rosewood

Clip on wheel weights are the best alloy without having to modify it.

No, it is just the opposite, we were "scared" into it. Sandy Hook drove me to casting, couldn't get bullets back then.

Rosewood

Hey Doc ... when you breathe in lead particles you are ingesting lead.

I don't think you are breathing them in. Melting lead isn't vaporizing it. When you are casting boolits, the lead isn't floating in the air, the impurities are what are burning off Doc.

Do some research on it yourself if you doubt what I said. When I started casting I was concerned about lead. After lots of research, that is what I learned.

Rosewood

No dog in this fight. I do remember when I went to the FBI Firearms Instructors Course, I was told about lead poisoning. They said if we worked an indoor range that we needed to have a blood draw every 3-4 months to look for lead in our blood. They were also talking about the air filtration systems in the ranges. This was 1988, so I would guess back then they believed you could breathe it in.........

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USMC 69-93 Combat Pistol Inst.

Used to clean the air purifying filters at a small indoor range I used to belong to weekly. Tons of crud in them, mostly unburnt powder. I'm positive there was lead particles in them also. Just couldn't see it.

That is different than casting. Casting lead doesn't vaporize lead.

Did you ever know of anyone that had high levels?

Lead fumes can cause lead poisoning. However, lead does not let off fumes until about 900 degrees. Since most casters do not get to that temp. it should not be a problem.

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USMC 69-93 Combat Pistol Inst.

No, but then I never worked an indoor range. The only indoor range I ever saw while in the Corps was at the USMC/USN Reserve Center on Carnegie Mellon Campus in Pittsburgh, Pa. It was closed by the EPA due to lead contamination. Lead dust was all over everything inside the building. Had to wear full hazmat gear with full filtered face masks to go inside. To this day I refuse to use an indoor range. Spent 20 years working as a Medical/Surgical Nurse after I retired from the Corps and never ran into anyone with "Heavy Metals Poisoning", did read some case studies on it though. Know enough that I do not want to get those kind of problems.

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USMC 69-93 Combat Pistol Inst.

Attached is a PDF file with some basic lead safety information for beginners.

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Well I ordered some of those pencils and tested my lead. About 300lbs is 4-5 bhn while another 200lbs is 14-15. I melted some of the harder stuff into ingots and decided to try and see how actual casting went. It’s FUN! I have a 6 cavity LEE 358-105-swc mold that I wanted to try. I lubed it, smoked it, and pre heated it and casted my first bullets. These are my first so don’t go too hard on me. They measure .359-.360 and I didn’t weigh them yet. I also have an old rcbs 2 cavity 38-140WC mold that I want to try out. I’ve been reading and watching so many videos on everything and I’m having a blast with this.

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Jim

This is what I use to size my bullets.
I size after I powder coat them.

Lee Precision, Inc.. Classic Bullet Sizing Kit

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never get out of the boat

I have two Lyman Luber/Sizers from when I used mainly alox to lube with. Now that I powder coat, I use the Lee Sizers also.

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USMC 69-93 Combat Pistol Inst.

Have you tried the new/newer style sizer from lee? 20 dollar body that screws into the press, and then you spend 12-20$ per sizer die and punch you want to push through

IMHO as hobbyists, our greatest source of exposure is breathing lead-laden dust. The stuff that gets stirred up when we handle those old wheel weights, of when we skim the pot, or when we tumble cases.

Any operation that gets your hands dirty or leaves a taste in your mouth is one that is giving you exposure.

Beagle trick?............I used "em" to run deer and rabbits.
Started casting in 1972.....For a Browning P35.

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S&W Accumulator

And....You can stick your tongue out and say 'pphhhuuu" when there are no bullets on the shelf to be bought.

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S&W Accumulator