What kind of velocity edge will the .30-06 have over the .308 in a 20" barrel, using bolt action rifles and handloads? Will the .30-06 have any real advantage? I have a good amount of brass for each and need a bolt action rifle. I don't want something too cumbersome so I'd like to keep the barrel length to a 20" maximum. I'm sure the .30-06 would be faster, but by how much? Enough to justify it over a .308?

Dave Sinko

All right, I'll bite.

Without knowing the selected bullet weight or your desired performance parameters (purpose), let's just address getting more velocity.

Buy a 7mm-08 and use your .308 brass. That will shoot flatter than either of the .30 cal.

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Science plus Art

With regard to bullet weight, it would be literally anything I can get my hands on, from 90 to 180 grs. For practical purposes though, it would be 150 grs.

I am no longer interested in anything other than .308 or .30-06.

I suspect the .308 is the way to go, so I'm kind of hoping somebody will jump in here and defend the .30-06.

Dave Sinko

Not I.

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Science plus Art

I know this will not answer your question,but I also had to pick between the .308 and .30-06.I went with the .308 because I found a New Remmington 700 SPS with 20'' BBL I like the feel and fit of the rifle,the rest is history.

The thing about the .30-06 is that it handles heaver bullets much better than the .308. So, at that point, the question is:

Do I want the added flexibility of the 06?

If using a turnbolt rifle, does the short action make a big difference in your application?

The .308 is slightly more accurate, intrinsically. In a hunting rifle, the difference is minimal.

Personally, I prefer the 06 but with 150 gr or lighter bullets, they are pretty much ballistic equals.

Bruce

For some of us the choice is simple. 308 is so much more pleasant to shoot and the shorter receiver and nicer bolt throw on turnbolts makes for a much nicer handling and shooting rifle. In addition, unless you load 30-06 to max, you will just be operating at 308 performance. A fully loaded 30-06 out of 20 inch barrel is a very noisy rifle.

Actually, I agree with poster that suggested getting a 7mm-08 and necking down those 308 cases (which will need neck reaming for full up loads). This provides a much more pleasant shooting rifle and one that is as effective on all but largest game -- think 7X57 in short case.

Niklas

"The .30-'06 is never a mistake."
Townsend Whelen

Good shooting.

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Good shooting.

A Remington Model 7 in .308 will fit your requirements regarding size and barrel length. It is a very handy woods rifle. With the .308 you have the possibility of using military surplus ammo for practice.

The tipping point between the 308 and 30-06 is bullet weight. 180Gr and above tends to favor the 30-06. For practical purposes long action or short action there is little deference. People swoon endlessly about the short action. Measure the length difference and tell me if you thing it’s that significant. When people talk about inherent accuracy but how many can apply the difference. Minute of angle - minute of angle always talked about shooting from the bench rest. Its all theoretical “Bull Feathers” if you can’t stand up and shoot.

I lost a lot of sleep over this last night. I definitely want a compact bolt action rifle and in the .308 I was considering a Hawkeye Compact with the 16.5" barrel. I guess a 20" .30-06 will significantly outperform a 16.5" .308 and the .30-06 will handle the heavier bullets better. For all practical purposes I was doubting that the shorter action would really make a difference to me other than save a bit of weight. And I think it's safe to say that 20" is as short as anybody would want to go with a .30-06 barrel.

Dave Sinko

I think you have to compare data from reputable reloading sources and factory ammo figures.

Using Hodgdon's data, the max velocity for the .308 with a 180gr slug was 2683 @ 58KSI, for the .30-06 it was 2798 @ 49,300 CUP. So, the .30-06 had a little over 100 fps edge at lower pressure. These figures were with a 24" barrel for both calibers.

Yes, I know full well that PSI and CUP aren't the same but I'd say 49K CUP is lower than 58KSI.

So, not a big deal in the field and I'd certainly say no one should get rid of a .308 in order to have a .30-06 for any reason other than nostalgia. Don

For help in deciding which cartridge to select, take a tip from the US Military that studied it extensively.

The old standard .30-06 service cartridge delivered a 150 grain fmj ball bullet at approximately 2800 fps from a 24 inch barrel.

The replacement 7.62 NATO (.308 Winchester) delivered the same 150 grain fmj at 2800 fps from a 22 inch barrel.

Now granted there were changes in chamber pressure and propellant, but that gives you a starting point to compare the two cartridges.

I own/load/shoot/hunt with both guns. Using 150/165/180 grain bullets, nothing you hit will know the difference. The 06 is common and probably easier to get components for. In Central Oregon, a .308 sporter is hard to find. My choice would center on which gun I could shoot the best, the one with the best trigger.

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beaver

The equation between the 308 and the 30/06 has changed a lot.

Bullets are so much better now than they were 10-15 years ago that a plain 165-grain spitzer in either cartridge will do 95% of what you’d ever attempt with a non-magnum 30-caliber rifle. If you needed more punch, the old answer was a heavier bullet. Today you can use the same weight in a tougher design (Partition, A-Frame, Bearclaw or TSX) and still have the flat trajectory and mild recoil that makes the non-magnum 30’s so popular and versatile.

Barrel length is a personal thing. I hunt in thick brush, and I’ve tried a lot of bolt actions with shorter barrels. For me, the tipping point is around 22”. A bolt gun with a 22” barrel doesn’t seem any easier to handle than one with a 20” or 18” barrel, but it seems about a foot shorter than one with a 24” barrel.

Bolt-actions with 22” barrels also tend to balance well and handle quickly, which matters more than overall length or barrel length. My current favorite is a bolt-action 308 with a 4x Leupold. The weather was foul the first year I hunted with it. After three cold, rainy, windy days, I was on the edge of becoming another dumbass Pacific Northwest hypothermia victim, so I decided to turn back. Half a mile from camp, I spotted a little spike 90m away across a clearing. I saw him, turned and shot him through the lungs in less time than it takes to read this sentence. I’ve since used that rifle to kill other blacktails with very fast, precise shots inside 30 yards.

I’ve shot and hunted a lot with 308’s and 30/06’s with barrels that were 18”, 20”, 22”, 24” and 26” long. Because of noise and blast, I don’t want any part of either cartridge with anything less than a 22” barrel. If I need to go shorter, I’ll use a revolver, a 94 Winchester or a single-shot.

Both the 308 and the 20/06 are just about ideal in a 22” barrel, so I’d buy the one I could get the best deal on. There won’t be a nickel’s worth of difference between them on live targets.


Okie John

What ever your pick.....make sure you get a 1 ~ 10 twist to handle all bullet weights you might want to use. (You will have some 'air' in a .30-06 as typical powder loads do not fill the case....where-as .308 will usually be full to the top with your powder).

I'm glad I held off and didn't do anything rash. I have come to my senses and realized that a Compact is NOT for me. I'm 6'4" and while the Compact is all cute and handy, it is clearly not the best choice as something which will see extensive use (as in shooting and not just carrying). I do not want to sacrifice fit and velocity with such a small rifle. I have decided that it will still be a .308 and I like the laminated stocks, so the logical choice is a Hawkeye Sporter. I still might have it cut down to 20" (it comes with a 22" barrel) but I am still undecided about that. I will have iron sights installed and my Leupold 1x4 will be attached with quick release rings. As stated above, the 1:10" twist should handle all bullet weights.

The only question which remains is that issue of barrel length...

Dave Sinko

My dad picked up a TC Icon in .308 last year and loves it. It's easier shooting than my .30-06 and very accurate right out of the box.