Hey,
My Mom recently passed and my Dad gave me her fathers pistol. Its a nickel plated S & W 32 CTG - Its has pearl grips - serial # 1146XX

Can anyone tell me about the gun - Year? value? The nickel is showing wear - should I get the pistol restored?

Thnaks!

The S.N. is 58253. I was suprised to find the sn. in 4 different places. 1. Butt 2. Cyl. face 3. Under the barrel lock. 4. Inside right handle panel.
In the letter from Mr.Jinks he stated the gun was shipped from the factory on August 19, 1895 to M.W. Robinson Co. New York City.
Hope this helps "place" your 32.

my sn. is 58XXX and was shipped 8.19.1895. Description is the same. Per my letter.

When I spoke to Roy Jenks, he informed me that I should call them the Safety Hammerless.

I will never refer to these revolvers as a "Lemon Squeezer" again! I will always view this as a disrespectful euphemism.

Thank you, Roy.

Scott

Hi guys, I'm trying to get an approximate age on a .32 Safety Hammerless that belonged to my wife's great grand father. SN number is 132576, it has a blue finish black plastic S&W grip panels and a 3 inch barrel. Thanks for your help.

I own a nickel-plated Smith and Wesson 32 "New Departure" with pearl grips, serial # 168XXX (168890 for the DB). It has the S&W logo stamped on the right side of the frame, and small S&W "Buttons" set into each side of the grip.

There is a bit of wear of the finish, and some surface rust, but the pistol itself seems tight. I would guess 70%. I have not yet fired it.

I think, from what I have trolled on the boards, it would have been produced sometime around 1902.

Before I pay for my local gunsmith to inspect it, would anyone be able to tell me if 1) These guns in good shape are able to handle modern ammunition (and whether the 32 S&W Long I see is the same as this gun shoots), and 2) Approximately what it would be worth should it be considered mechanically sound?

Letjimdoit,
There are 4 1st model 32 Safety Hammerless in my data base with serial #s within 1000 of yours either way. All were shipped in 1890. That doesn't absolutley mean yours was. They were not always shipped in sequential order. The only way to know for sure is to get a cerificate of authentication from Roy Jinks. The star on the butt of the gun means that it was sent back to the factory at some time to get worked on. Most often that means a refininsh, but it could have been for any work. The Markings present only on the barrel rib is consistant with 1st model 32s.
Mark

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Mark Connot

The .32 that is used in these revolvers is the .32 S&W, NOT the .32 S&W Long, which is more powerful and...longer...so it would not fit into these older guns. (It's NOT a .32 SHORT, just a .32 S&W. For many years it wa considered an adequate self defense cartridge, and was even carried by some police of the era. I believe Remington makes it and maybe some of the European makers such as Fiocchi. It is pretty costly and not very powerful, and it is loaded down for use i n these little old top breaks.

info on .32 S&W Cartridge (Note - the CTG on the barrel of some revolvers stands for Cartridge - it's not a model name.)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.32_S%26W

ADDED: On that Warner revolver - they started importing a European auto pistol in 1912, gradually moved into making small caliber 5 shot revolvers very similar to the Meridan and Iver Johnson revolvers. They later were combined with another company and went out of business in 1919. The auto pistols are very collectable and bring a good price...the revolvers, not. I did see one sold several years ago at an auction for $65. If it were mine, I wouldn't shoot it.

mark

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Liberals made the USA

Can .32 Automatic ammo be fired in my Safety Hammerless so-called lemon squeezer ? Years ago I was sold box UMC Remington 32 Automatic 71 grain metal case L32AP as okay for this revolver but never got around to firing it. I would NEVER try 32 S&W Long, but 32 Auto is only slightly longer than 32 S&W bullet so I wonder if it can be used ?

I measure barrel as 3 4/16 inches with Serial Number 18,400 something on 3 locations, largest S/N on butt. My late uncle bought this after World War II from West Georgia policeman who thought highly of it. Seems very good condition with no rust I see & is black color all over. Last patent date on cylinder is July 1895 so I guess it was made about mid-1890s I've always used rifles/shotguns so I know nothing about handguns. I plan to weigh it.

I should NOT have posted Ammo ? on this thread but I thought my 32 was a lemon squeezer. Now I've found it is probably either a Model 1896 or Model 1903 .32 Hand Ejector because it has SwingOut Cylinder to left side. see thread ".32 Automatic Ammo in Safety Hammerless Revolver ??" on 1896 to 1961 Hand Ejector forum.

CNTRPK

You have probably had an answer to your question on the year of your revolver.
If not, give me the complete SN. and I can get real close.

dons1040

New to the Forum and have a few questions about 2 lemon squeezers. The serial numbers are 1633XX and 1949XX. If anyone could give me an approximate date and what model they are that would be much appreciated. Thanks!

Cntrprk,
My letter from Mr. Jinks shows a ship date of 08/19/1895. my sn. is 58253. Roughly a thousand behind yours. Hope this helps some.
dons1040

Hi, my name is George, and I have this 1889 SW lemon squeezer.
I was try this revolver with Fiocchi .32 sw short ammunition with
velocity 220 m/s and energy 133J.It is FMJ bullet.Shooting was without problems. What do you think,
it is safe ammunition? I can't destroy this nice old gun...Thanks for answers! Regards George.

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Just picked up a rare .32 with 2" barrel today it has gold accents and mother of pearl grips. I belive it to be all original and not refinished? What year was it mfg 107,xxx if it is a true gold accent and mop grips from factory what would value be? I need to order letter on this one i think?
image.jpg

I have a .32 safety Hammerless first model (lemon squeezer) s/n in the 29xxx range. When was it made and any other info you can provide.
Thanks,
Jim

Probably a cut barrel and gold wash applied post-manufacture. My guess is that your barrel will measure only 1 1/2" long and not the original 2". The original bicycle gun would have had a half-round front sight. Also, the pearls are post-factory. All factory pearl gun stocks of that era had small gold S&W medallions.

The 32 Safety, 2nd Model was manufactured from 1902 to 1909, with serial numbers from around 91,000 to 170,000. Yours would probably fall around 1903.

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Gary
SWCA 2515

Welcome to the Forum Jim. Your 1st Model 32 Safety would have shipped from the factory around 1892-1893, so it is an antique as defined by the BATF. There were over 91,000 1sy Models made from 1888 to 1902.

I just picked up a 4 digit 1st Model, manufactured first year of production, and it still shoots like it was brand new.

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Gary
SWCA 2515

I am new to this forum, and am not sure how to initiate a post without replying to an existing one. [I]Mea Culpa [I] for any error.

I was visiting a friend a few days ago, and he gave me a .32 Lemon Squeezer that he said had belonged to his grandfather. I am researching history and value, although I have no plan to sell it. I have read through earlier posts, and understand about obtaining exact dates for manufacture from S&W. At the moment, I am looking for best information available at this time.

This pistol is in what appears to be its original box is described as a << S. & W. 32 SAFETY, 3 ½ INCH>> The pistol is nickel-plated with mother-of-pearl grips, and (what I understand is the standard) gold-colored SW seal recessed in the grips on each side. It also has the S&W logo engraved on the right side between the cylinder and the grip. The serial number on cylinder shows as 1343xx. There is a serial number on the butt which is more difficult to read, but I assume also is 1343xx. (The second digit is difficult to read and could also be a "5" or an "8.")

The left-side of the barrel is engraved with: 32 S & W OTG -- bounded on each side by a small graphic design. The top of the barrel is engraved with "SMITH AND WESSON, SPRINGFIELD, MASS" followed by a series of what appears to be patent dates. I am unable to accurately decipher all of the engraving even with the aid of a magnifying glass. (I have made an appointment with my ophthalmologist.)

The pistol is in excellent condition with no marks or mars. I have not tried cleaner in the cylinder or barrel to check for powder residue, but it appears that it might never have been fired. The box clearly is old, but intact and in good shape with the inside text completely legible. There is no interior packing.

Any information that could be provided regarding time of manufacture, approximate value, etc., will be appreciated. I would be happy to upload a photo, if someone can give me some instruction as to how to do so.

I just got a 32 cal Safety Hammerless,3 inch barrel from my dad. It was in a house he purchased. It has a serial # 6xx. I assume it was made in 1888. Any information about age or value would be appreciated.

Welcome to the Forum. With that early serial number, it would have certainly been manufactured the first year of production. As for value, it can be worth from $75 to $500 and without pictures, it would be impossible to estimate. Many of these were made and prices for a "good" condition 32 Safety would be $200 to $250, and only high finish guns will commander higher prices.

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Gary
SWCA 2515

Thanks for the reply Gary. I will post pictures the next time my daughter comes home as she has a better phone than I do. The gun seems to be in good shape with a few small blemishes. The big mystery is the serial # on the handle. It has extra numbers that are different sizes. The main number matches the cylinder number with a bigger 17 & smaller B then the serial #. Pictures soon. I can't believe I missed this, but I just noticed the lettering on the top of the gun. It says Harrington & Richardson Arms Company. I guess what threw me off was the "32cal S&W CTGE" on the side of the barrel. So is the H&R related to the S&W or a different beast altogether?

My 1st. model safety hammerless .32 has a serial number of 345** with a 3" barrel. I think about 1894. Am I close? Thanks guys.

My Grandmother had a pearl handled one. Serial# 134xxx. Could one of you shed some light on when it would have been made?

Thanks!

MC

Hi... I hope someone who has one of those niffty books that helps with serial numbers...

I am trying to find what year a .32 (short) Caliber S&W Lemon Squeezer was manufactured. It bears serial number T0844...or it could be T "O" (as in Oh-my) 844?!!!..

Any help will be appreciated. Thanks in advance.

Jim

jlb932, check your serial number. S&W did not use letters (T or TO) in the serial numbers of the Safety Hammerless ("Lemon Squeezer") line. Only numbers were used.

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Mike Maher #283

Hi, new here just got a M&P shiled & 9 Pro. however been looking at the squeezers / i have 1 , the chrome is good , black S&W grips have shot works fine. Not sure about this 1st model or 2 ect thing. guess will get S&W to answer based on vin. ???? any one have idea on value ???

My Smith &Wesson 32 cal hammerless lemon squeezer is a nickel finish with mother of pearl grips. Serial #31111, there are no other markings on the gun except along the top of the barrel with all of the S&W info including patten dates, watch. Is this a 1st Model and any idea of dates of manufacture?

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PLEASE DO NOT POST ADDITIONAL REQUESTS ON THIS THREAD. WHEN YOU HAVE A NEW GUN THAT YOU NEED HELP WITH, START A NEW THREAD OF YOUR OWN!

I see there are several unanswered requests, and that's because no one checks them out in a thread with a dozen different gun requests. It gets very confusing.

At the top of the list of current threads, there is an orange button, click it, add a title, and compose your post. That way, no one will have a request lost in the jumble of other threads. Please add pictures.

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Gary
SWCA 2515

You have a 32 Safety Hammerless, 1st Model, shipped in 1892-1893.

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Gary
SWCA 2515

Gary,
Thanks for your response. It is a neat pistol and one we will keep in the family. Merry Christmas!
Walter

My Father just gave me his Grandfather's Safety Hammerless with a serial number of # 45503. Would you be so kind as to check your database for an entries with that serial number?

Thank you very much.

I wanted to share my info for a .32 I inherited from my great grandfather. Mine is a nickel plated .32 with a serial number of 169690. I'm not as informed as others, but I would assume this is a second model in collectors terms correct?

Yes, if yours is indeed a Safety Hammerless, it would be a Second Model, which was produced until serial #172000 in 1909.

So your #169690 falls near the end of that range and is most likely from 1909.

Is there an online database where I could search for more info on the gun that I have? My father mentioned the S&W will do this for me, but I have not been able to find more info.

There is no database as such, but you have two options:

1. The free one: Use the search function above to look for old threads in this forum. Make the search terms as specific as you can, and you will find a ton of information about your model.

2. For $75, the S&W historian will research your serial number and send you a history letter telling you when and where it shipped. You find the form in the Notable threads sticky at the top in each subforum.

PS: I just noticed that nobody responded to your initial question above. Sorry. What caliber is your Safety Hammerless? As I said, there is no database, but with type, caliber and serial, educated guesses are possible based on published serial ranges.

Reckon Mr Roy G. Jinks will feel you're being disrespectful by spelling his last name wrong ?

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wanna do right-- not right now

Hello. I have been reading the posts and wanted to respond, any help is appreciated. I have a 1st model with serial #69 I inherited. What would the estimated value be and would it be worth it to get the paperwork from S&W? It is a .32 S&W.

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This has been covered so many times in the past, and you do not need a database. There are a series of 1973 BATF letters of acknowledgement that documents the antique status of every S&W made during the late 1890s. There is a serial number cut-off and that is all anyone needs to determine for themselves what is antique and what is modern. This thread will lead you to copies of the letters and Rawles listing of many manufacturers antique serial number cut-off. Mr. Jinks letter to BATF on Antiques...

If you lose track of the link, just search the Forum using the word Rawles and several links will come up with information needed to get members to the list. The good news is that you do not even need to know the exact change, model, just the configuration and caliber of the revolver and the serial number should get you the answer.

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Gary
SWCA 2515

Welcome to the forums from the Wiregrass! Gary has given you what you need to answer the antique question. As far as obtaining an historian's letter, I would advise against it for 2 reasons.

1. S&W made a lot of these guns. They are not rare and only have added value if they are pristine and come in the original box. A nominal value for a .32 safety hammerless shooter around here is $200 or less.

2. Your gun has been refinished outside the S&W factory. It has 0 collector value.

What is interesting about your gun is the serial number can be read correctly no matter which way the barrel is pointed.

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Guy
SWHF #474 SWCA LM#2629

Shipping date yes.

Unfortunately, and to no fault of those issuing S&W letters, S&W did not record manufacture dates and historical letters are based on the shipping date. The BATF uses the date that the serial number was applied to the frame as determining when a gun was born and henceforth its antique or C&R status. With S&W's it is possible that a true antique does not qualify because it wasn't shipped until after the cut off date.

There are some models that folks have worked with the BATF to establish that all frames are antiques since they were in fact manufactured before the cut off date but I don't think it covers all models.

Some states like California IIRC, use a different date than the BATF to determine antique status so you must also check your local state rules as well.

All in all, it never gets easier.

Personally, as we quickly approach the era of phasers and photon torpedoes, I think that any firearm that was designed originally to shoot black powder should be considered an antique. Heck, a car is considered an antique at 25 years.

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James Redfield
LM #497

There are a few models that are considered antiques, but shipped later than 1898, so even more complications. The Model 1896 32 HE, the 44 Single & Double Action revolvers were shipped into the 1900s, but were all classified as antiques by the BATF. Story was that all frames were manufactured and serial numbered before 1899.

So the BATF list is the simple way to determine antique status and one does not have to worry about ship dates or frame dates, just worry about CA and NY regulations.

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Gary
SWCA 2515

My God, print the letter to BATF from Roy and keep it with you. It is rock solid. Best, Mike

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Mike 2796
SoFo Bunch member

Hi -New here

I have a SMITH & WESSON SPRINGFIELD MASS. U.S.A. PAT'D FEBY 20.77. DEC.18.77 MAY 11.80 SEPT.11.83 OCT.2.83 TWO AUG.4.85".

Sn 15065 on handle – matches cylinder and under open latch

Pretty sure it is a series 1 and and antique from research on this forum and have downloaded the letters referenced - S&W DA .32 top break hammerless ("lemon squeezer") revolvers (serial # below 91,400

My questions is what ammo to use. My dad had an old box of .32 S&W and I purchased similar. But now thinking this might require older black powder type ammo? Or can it shoot new .32 S&W?

thanks - great forum and info BTW

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Welcome to the forums from the Wiregrass! You can shoot smokeless ammo in it. S&W issued a notice in 1907 stating that they would warranty their guns if commercial smokeless ammo was used. There were a lot of older BP guns when original BP ammo was loaded with smokeless. The ammo manufacturers made sure it wouldn't damage the old guns.

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Guy
SWHF #474 SWCA LM#2629

Hi All,
Thought I would share this. I had to dissemble and repair my SW 32 lemon squeezer. Hope it helps others who have asked similar questions.

as always - great forum and posts here. Thanks to all as it helped me!

Disassemble and Repair of a Smit and Wesson .32 cal Hammerless Pistol - YouTube

I'm no expert by any means, but I would definitely get a letter on that revolver even though it's been refinished. I seriously don't believe there are many model 1's with serial numbers close to yours. BTW even though it's been refinished it is still a very nice-looking model 1. Congratulations on your inheritance.

Here is what I have as far as letters posted before on this site I think.
Most early models are considered antiques. You can find model numbers in the attached.Model 1896 ATF Letter 1.jpg

Model 1896 ATF Letter 2.jpg

Model 1896 ATF Letter 3.jpg

b.hopper was last here on 1-30-2017.

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So many S&W's, so few funds!!