Need help w/ S&W top break ident

Fireguy67 · #1 09-04-2014, 01:12 AM

5 shot top break
38 S&W CTG
SN 56822 (on butt and cylinder)
There is no model number found on gun
Patent dates on top rib of barrel-
PATD Aug 4 96, Dec 22 96, Oct 8 01, Feb 6 08, Sept 14 09
Break requires release of a lever on the left side and simultaneously lifting a lever at the rear sight.
There are 4 screws on the right side and a screw on the inside of the grip.

Each time I attempt to post pictures, it deletes this text??

DWalt · #2 09-04-2014, 02:03 AM

Sounds like it may be the .38 Double Action "Perfected" model from your description. If so, your SN would indicate a late one, around 1920. In good condition they are fairly desirable, as there were relatively few of them made during the period 1909-1920. They were displaced by the swing-out revolvers.

Fireguy67 · #3 09-04-2014, 02:54 AM

the gun is in good condition and fit is very tight. Are there any other specific items to look for?

LaVistaBill · #4 09-04-2014, 04:44 AM

If it looks like this (see below) it's a Perfected Model, the last of the hinged frame S&W revolvers. Mine is circa 1919...

Fireguy67 · #5 09-04-2014, 06:34 AM

That's it exactly. Is there any way to tell the date of manufacture? I noticed that many of the SN's on S&W are 6 characters where this is only 5. Is there a period that the SN's changed to 6 characters?

glowe · #6 09-04-2014, 08:58 AM

Welcome to the Forum. Your revolver is not often found for sale in the USA, but not because of low production numbers. In a discussion with Roy Jinks, he related that this model was very popular in Eutope and many were exported. The serial number range was from 1 - 59,400 and manufacturing ended in 1920. I am sure some were shipped later and if you request a factory letter on your gun, Roy will include the exact date of shipment and where it went from the factory. This model was manufactured using a Model 1903 HE frame and a 38 DA barrel & cylinder to satisfy demands for the company to continue production of a top-break hammer gun in 38 caliber, but interest declined as the Hand Ejectors gained popularity.

I have been interested in these late production Perfecteds and thanks for sending the detailed information. I have one example with a serial number just 1100 higher than yours that had a 1914 patent date on the barrel rib. Previously, the highest number I had found with a 1909 date was 54100. This helps narrow down the change in barrel stampings. The attached pictures of my Perfected sn 579XX was shipped in September 1919. This model could be purchased with target stocks and target sights. Mine was shipped with just target stocks.

Fireguy67 · #7 09-04-2014, 12:07 PM

Thanks all for the information! I have been trying to add a few pictures with no luck but will keep trying. This revolver is in remarkable condition. There is only slight holster wear at the end of the barrel. The rest of the bluing is near perfect. The grips show almost no wear with no cracks or chips.

I probably should to add this to my insurance. Any ballpark estimate on value.

Skeetr57 · #8 09-04-2014, 12:20 PM

That patent date of Dec29'14 shown in the post above is for the hammer block safety. The late Perfected models were the only top breaks to get a hammer block safety.

DWalt · #9 09-04-2014, 04:19 PM

"Is there a period that the SN's changed to 6 characters?"

For the Perfected model, the serial numbers never reached six digits. For others, some SNs reached to a million, and several times over. The .38 DA in .38 S&W, a top break revolver which was the direct predecessor of your Perfected model, serial numbers reached about 550,000. Most of the S&W revolvers were numbered separately for every model, so there is a huge number of S&Ws which have six digit serial numbers. I can't provide a current worth, but in prime condition, I'd say close to $1000 in a private sale. Scarcity and condition are everything. Yours has both.

glowe · #10 09-04-2014, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skeetr57

That patent date of Dec29'14 shown in the post above is for the hammer block safety. The late Perfected models were the only top breaks to get a hammer block safety.

How about the Perfected Single Shot top-breaks? I was always told that the frame and action on Perfected revolvers was the same as the DA single shots, but I don't own one a Perfected SS to check.

glowe · #11 09-04-2014, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skeetr57

That patent date of Dec29'14 shown in the post above is for the hammer block safety. The late Perfected models were the only top breaks to get a hammer block safety.

How about the Perfected Single Shot top-breaks? I was always told that the 2 models had the same frame and action?

So . . . I am now down to only 2400 Perfected revolvers were made with the hammer safety block & 1914 patent date.

Skeetr57 · #12 09-04-2014, 07:04 PM

I once asked Roy Jinks about the hammer safety on the Perfected model revolvers and he said that the late ones had the safety block. On further thought, the single shot Perfected couldn't have had the one mentioned in that patent, as it worked off the hand, and a single shot doesn't have a hand.