I had advertised on one of the local forums that I was looking for a 5" model 10. A gentleman responded and offered a 4" for a very reasonable price (finish is very very poor). I bought it but it isn't a model 10 or pre 10, not sure what it is as I am having a hard time reading the markings on the barrel. Serial number is 1951xx and barrel is marked 38 S&W Special CTG. I am having a hard time getting the side plate off to look at the condition. Have removed the four screws in the side of the plate but no luck.

1. Any idea as to model and year based on the above serial number?
2. Any hints or clues as to how to remove a stuborn side plate? (No prying, and have banged on the frame w/ a rubber mallet.)
3. Any reason not to shoot modern 38 special (non plus p) ammo out of this revolver? Thinking about using it as my "snake gun".

Thank you!

Can you post a picture of the gun? It's probably a 38 M&P but it's hard to say with so little information.

As for the side plate, I don't recommend removing it unless you really need to. Since you already have the screws out though, try dry firing the gun a few times. This typically works it loose easier than rapping on the grip frame. Examine how the side plate fits in and reinstall it gently when you are done, don't force or hammer it back on.

side plates can sometimes be stubborn, lightly tapping on the frame with a non- marring hammer will loosen them for removal but some need more tapping than others. can you post pictures of your revolver? it will make it easier to ID.

Try something a LITTLE harder than your rubber mallet, such as the plastic or wooden handle of the screwdriver. With the revolver in your left hand (given that you are right-handed), rap on the right-side heel of the gripframe, taking care to miss the stock pin. This has loosened every S&W sideplate I've ever attempted. hth

Larry

Picture credit goes to the individual that sold the revolver to me... much better than my camera takes. Barrel, frame and cylinder numbers match.

I think that ID as an M&P is a good one, from the large knob on the ejector I suspect it's a fairly early one. However, I am not up to speed on the early hand ejectors so I'll leave the details for someone els.

As for getting that sideplate to spring free, that is a process that requires Vibration to do it's work and I don't think a rubber mallet will produce enough vibrations. Flip it end for end and use the wooden handle and it will likely come free. If not, a good soaking of the perimeter with Kroil for a day or two may help make it easier to free up. If all that fails you'll need to use a metal tool to get it to "ring" enough, I would suggest either 1/2 inch brass or aluminum bar stock and a slow process of light taps. In time any corrosion bond will break free and then it will start lifting, however it may take an hour or two of light tapping for this to happen, so do this when your wife isn't around to get irritated by the noise.

.38 M&P from 1912 or so.

Never,

I'm guessing about 1910, or so, on your 38 Special Handejector M&P. The book says from 1909 - 1915 as a range, in which, your revolver shipped. I arrived at the above date via interpolation.
I would avoid modern standard pressure 38's, as I believe this gun is "pre" process for steel hardening.
The instruction you have recieved re: popping the sideplate is the only way to go.
Nice looking service grips.

Mike

Thanks Mike. Where would I get or what would I find to shoot this revolver? Sounds like the typical winchester white box is out of the question. I bought it for only $150 but would hate to only have the ability to shoot snake shot through it.....

I shoot commercial 148 gr wadcutter match loads in my early .38 Specials without any fear whatsoever. In addition to being low-stress rounds, they are accurate and leave nice sharp holes in the paper.

__________________
David Wilson

You are fine to shoot any standard pressure, regular type .38 Special Ammunition with your Revolver in question.

Just stay with Lead Bullet kinds.

You are fine with any of the Wadcutters or semi-Wadcutters, and the usual 158 Grain Round Nose Lead Bullets, as long as they are loaded to traditional standards.


Cartridge pressures of .38 Special were no different then ( 1910 ) than they are today, or if anything, they were likely higher then than they are today...far as that goes.

never,

David's advice is good, you may also find "cowboy" loads in 38 special. I load my own 38's so I don't have a commercial source - google may be your friend!

Mike

I would say that it is a .38 M&P model of 1905 3rd change. Apply a little Kroil or Breakfree in the empty screw holes and under the sideplate after removing the stocks. Let it soak and then try the methods mentioned above. Strike the grip frame where the stocks would normally be while holding the barrel in your left hand (assuming that the hammer or wood dowel is in your right). I usually wrap the gun in soft leather just to be safe and hold the side plate over a pillow or something soft just in case it drops off.

Clean the internals with your favorite degunker and then apply a small amount of machine oil. Reinstall the sideplate carefully and reinstall the screws. Keep track of which screw comes out of which hole as they are not all the same. There are several videos on Youtube that show you this proceedure. Best of luck.

__________________
James Redfield
LM #497

What was the difference between the different changes? 2nd, 3rd and 4th? I am going to let the rem oil soak in and try the taping again tomorrow night to get the side plate offlll

It would take a while to go through the differences in all the changes. Next time you are at a Barnes & Noble, thumb through the Standard Catalog of S&W 3rd Edition. There is a whole section on .38 Hand Ejectors that will list all these. Some are small internal changes, others may be external. Stocks also change through the years, and not necessarily in line with engineering changes.

You bought a nice old gun, congrats. Clean it gently and shoot light cast loads, it will serve you well for a long time.

Man on an old gun like that, I wouldn't consider that finish bad at all. It looks to have a good amopunt of blueing left. The advise you got here is sound. All that I could add is that once you get it running, Ballistol would be a good cleaner, lube and protectant. It's actually good for those stocks too, so no worries about getting any on them. Just don't soak them or anything crazy.

Good looking old gun. Congrats and enjoy...

Thanks. Figured for $150 I wouldn't get hurt too bad and I was looking for a snake gun anyway.... 100 years old and still has a purpose in life!

I would also say that it is a .38 M&P model of 1905 3rd change. I have S/N 1812xx that shipped 11/25/12 which is a 1905 3rd change. Yours probably shipped in 1913.

Tom

The gun has the patent-date roll markings on the side of the barrel,
because its a 4" and because they were using the same roll-marking
dies from early 1902. The made up new dies in 1916 or 1917, and
put the dates back on top of the barrel.

As to the side plate, with the grips off, and holding it in your right
hand, rap the grip frame sharply with a piece of hard wood - like a
hammer handle. Do it several times, hitting on the flat sides of the
grip frame. The plate will loosen up, and start to rise up.

Mike Priwer

You guys were correct, smacked the frame a few times w/ a piece of oak and eventually the side plate popped off. Remarkable how clean it looked! Cleaned it up a bit and replaced the sideplate and screws. It is amazing how hard it was to get the sideplate to pop off but I doubt if anyone has seen the inside of this revolver for almost 100 years... Thanks again!

The differences between model number changes can be large or small. Sometimes the logo is moved from one side to another. Sometimes it is internal changes. Screws added or removed. Dowel pins in the extractor star changing from one to two. Extractor knobs changing size or method of attachment etc. etc. Patent dates changing, barrel lengths changing and so on. From the exterior, many times these changes can be identified only by the serial number range that the gun falls into as they are internal.

If you really want to learn, drop some coins on several of the good reference books available and read, read, read.

__________________
James Redfield
LM #497