Not talking about a 22-4 Clint Smith re-release (which I would probably buy if it didn't have a lock)... I am thinking an original 22 or pre-22 is going to be pretty scarce. I am not lumping the M1917 or postwar M1917 commercial models in with the pre-22 group, because I've never thought of those as pre-22s. Thoughts?

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Aaron Terry

They are tough to find. I wouldn't mind having one either, but I am aware of only two or three changing hands in the last three or four years. Unless you come upon one from a naive seller, expect to pay big bucks. Your best bet for acquisition might be to ask one of the major dealers in collectible S&Ws to keep an eye out for you.

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David Wilson

Pretty hard. I've been shifting through the rubble for a month now and haven't found mine yet.

I have a question for the group. In the SCSW, it states that approximately 178 were stamped with a model number from 1957 to 1963. It further states that the pre model versions are less valuable than the model marked guns. It goes on to say that the gun was produced from 1958 to 1963.

If model numbers came into being around 1957/58, it would seem to me that the non model marked guns would be more rare than those produced after model marking began. Lets just say that the guns made in 1957 (1 year) were not model marked and the guns from 1958 to 1963 (6 years) were model marked. Would there not be more model marked guns than those not model marked???

What am I missing here???

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James Redfield
LM #497

jsrIII:
Are you really referring to the rarity of a 4-screw, non-model marked gun?
Ed

Scarcity depends entirely on production volume, which varies from year to year. If, say, 1000 units were produced before 1958 and only 178 in the next five years, there's the answer.

My impression is that the company misread demand for a particular model on more than one occasion in its history, overproducing some models and having unsold inventory sit on the shelf for some time. Later production of these models is then almost on an as-needed basis and will be much smaller.

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David Wilson

There is a pre-M22 with 99.7% finish and in a gold box for sale by Wordsmith (David Carroll) on the Ray Cheely collection list.

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Dick

Could someone give me a sense of which big buck category we are talking here...it's that insatiable curiosity.

Thanks, Pete

Three to four thousand for one of the rarer late varieties in high-90s condition. Probably not less than $2000 for one that shows use and carry wear. If you see one in any condition for a thousand, jump on it without a second's hesitation.

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David Wilson

David hit it on the head. It's production. The book says a total of 3,976 were produced from '51 to '66. So if only 178 were model marked than 3798 were not model marked and therefore much easier to find. The same thing is true of the Model marked 24s. They go for much more than the pre model 24s. Some collectors want one of each; 5 screw, 4 screw and 3 screw. So they would need two that are model marked out of 178!

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Jim
S&WCA #819

I have one inherited from my Dad that is serial #'d to c. '52-'53. But unfortunetly like a few of these, it was sent back to Smith long before he got it to have Target sights installed and cut to 4".

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Jim
S&WCA #819

OK, I get it now. Hondo's answer brought it home. I was reading the section on page 189 that was referring to the Model 22 produced from 1958 to 1963. I thought that they were stating that the gun was only produced during that timeframe and that there were some non model marked and some model marked guns produced. Since 57/58 is the assumed timeframe for model marking, it seemed strange to me that during those 6 years that there would not have been more marked guns than non marked guns.

The answer is that that section of the book is talking about just the model marked guns and page 165 has a section that discusses the pre 22 or non model marked guns. Those guns with a starting serial number of S85000 started production in 1951, so the non marked guns were produced from 1951 to 1957/8.

The book is a little confusing and perhaps warrants a correction as page 165 puts the dates of production as 1951 to 1966 and page 189 puts those dates as 1958-1963.

Wonder if end of production is 1966 or 1963???

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James Redfield
LM #497

Not sure on production but I have a 4 screw that was shipped in 1966.
Ed

Thank you David for a very clear answer. I am hoping to get a look at one locally and I wanted to go into it knowing what to be expected. Not expecting any great deals, the guy definitely know his way around a gun show.

Pete

Good luck Pete, I hope you get it. And remember if it's a little more than you want to pay or think you should pay, you're just "buying it a little early". All of us at one time or another have passed on a gun we liked but thought was a little high only to regret it for years afterwards as we see current prices way beyond what we could have gotten it for!

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Jim
S&WCA #819