Under what circumstances would a .38/200 Victory end up with an Austrian police mark but no acceptance marks from any Commonwealth country? The gun has the US Property G.H.D. marking on the top strap and the P proof mark on the frame (left side, upper rear corner), barrel underside and rear face of the cylinder. Apart from those marks and the usual serial numbers and rollmarks, there are no other markings on the gun except the Austrian Police stamp.

I have it in mind that this gun might have been part of a shipment to the British that was never uncrated, then after the war moved from Italy up through the British sector of Austria and into the American sector. I believe this path might would have avoided disputes with the Russians, who were basically taking an obstructionist position about rearming local police forces within occupied Austria in the decade after the end of WWII.

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David Wilson

I would remark that supposedly a quantity of .38/200 Victory models were routed to the OSS, which could have in the immediate post-war period served as a covert conduit for rearming the Austrian polizei. But regardless, all of them were stamped "MADE IN U.S.A." so the Russians were never going to be much in doubt as to who was ultimately responsible for supplying them.

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SWCA #590
"Colligo ergo sum"

I wonder if Roy would know when the last British contract was shipped. I know that in early 45 the US was canceling contracts because the war was winding down. I imagine that like most manufactures S&W was stuck with finished product and no contract when this happened. As there would be almost no domestic market for K Frames in 38 S&W they would probably have pulled whatever strings they could to get them shipped to Europe as Police issue or anything else. Just a theory.

Not a bad thought. The specific gun I am asking about is V573116, which shipped in April 1944.

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David Wilson

David, Many Victory models were furnished to the civilian police forces in the occupied portions of Germany by the British & Americans. This is an interesting sub-field of Victory collecting, to see how many different police force stampings you can collect. Based on specimens I have owned, or observed, there are probably a good dozen different stampings known to collectors. Most are in .38/200 caliber, as is V573116. S&W wasn't "stuck" with any left over guns after 1945, that they didn't want. Remember, S&W was run by the Army in WW2, and the Army didn't produce what they didn't want, as had happened in WW1. S&W was happy to have any left over K frames in 1945 in order to get into civilian production after WW2 as fast as they could, ( and give us collectors a nice variant of SV serial numbers to hunt for!) Most of the lend lease .38/200 Victory models do not have any commonwealth acceptance stamps, especially the ones acquired by the British, so a gun with Austrian police stamps and the US inspector's stamps would probably have been one of the guns supplied to the Austrians by the Brits. Ed.

Britain, France, the US and Russia cooperaqted in rearming the Austrian (police mostly) after WW II. France supplies P-38s they made from parts after they occuied Oberndorf. Russia supplied Lugers!!! It was a pistol and a caliber the Rusians didn't want. I don't remember what Britain and the US supplied but it's not beyond belief that Britain supplied Victorys, which would have had nothing but the usual markings on them, with which they left the US. There's a long article about this in an old Deutche Waffen Journal, of which I have a translation someplace, but I haven't seen it for a while.

Most proof markings found on Lend Lease guns from the UK were applied post war when they were sold, in compliance with British proof laws. These lend Lease guns were not typically marked by the Brits when received. I have a Bavaria Rural Police marked Victory in 38 S&W with no additional added markings. I also have a Lend Lease M1 rifle with Birmingham Proof House markings and no additional British property markings. Remember, these arms were still US property.