Please correct me if I am wrong on any of this.

As I understand it, the HD was officially dropped from the catalog in 1966. I suspect that actual production ceased long before that and S&W struggled to sell guns from inventory as they were moving so slowly due to the introduction of the Combat Magnum.

Does anyone know when the last HD rolled off the line? Were any ever made with a ramp front blade or do they all have the old style rounded blade? Anyone have a line on the last HD serial number? Mine is S154256 which likely dates from late 1956 or early 57 but letters as not shipped until 2/60. I wonder if this one is close to the end of the line?

Again, based on what I have heard, model marked HDs (Model 20s) are very rare. The only one I ever saw was for a police department (Austin?). So how rare are M20s? Could the few known have been stamped after manufacture to satisfy the PD requirements or were HD frames made after model numbers were being applied and sold through regular channels? I suspect they were not, thinking no new guns were made after 1957. Again, correct me if you have definitive info to the contrary.

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SP,
I don't have my records at hand, so I can give you a partial answer. I believe that S&W made a large run of HDs and from those they filled orders. The 5 Screw HDs run up to about S161000 range (from memory). The Model 20 no dash guns were in the S192000-S211411 range and were 4 screw guns. There are about a dozen of these known. They were shipped in 1963. The 20-2 guns were 3 screw frames in the S255000 range and all 50 known were shipped to Austin PD. They were shipped in Dec 1964. My theory is that sales were not bad until 1954 and the Highway Patrolman was introduced. I suspect that the price between the two was pretty close and I can check that when I get home. then followed in 1956, the Combat Magnum was introduced. I think both of these killed the HD and Outdoorsman, especially the Outdoorsman. The highest serial number for the Outdoorsman, a Model 23, is in the S178000 range (again from memory). I've never seen a ramp front sight on an HD, although I have seen the rounded blade sights modified in different ways. Roy is the only one that can answer if any were made after the 50 guns shipped to APD. I will provide detailed numbers when i get my files.
I hope this helps,
Bill

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Thanks. I knew you'd have some good info.

Do you think the 50 Austin guns were the total production of 20-2s or were others produced? The Austin PD must have been a very conservative department to eschew the 357 Magnum after 10 years since the HP's introduction. I think you're right about the HP hurting the HD but I hadn't thought of it before, thinking mainly about the CM killing HD sales.

Any idea why guns shipped as late as 1964 still had the round front blades? Could all the barrels ever used have been made before the ramp was in use?

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There are HDs up in the S161000 range and then it jumps to S189000 and then the Mod 20s which there are 15 and 9 went to Pueblo CO PD. Then the Mod 20-2s which there are 50 4" nickels. Last number is S255888. So there you have it.

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I have a Pueblo, Colorado PD Model 20 (no dash) .38/44 HD, 4", blue, # S192578. I believe it is listed in the database as shipped in 1963. I have another N-frame, a 4" blue Model 21 (no dash) # S192567, lettered as shipped 6/14/61. These are 1959-ish serial numbers, but shipped years later.

The story I have been told by a respected collector is that S&W made a large run of N-frames in 1959 or thereabout. Many of these N-frames were serialized, put on the shelf, and drawn from inventory as orders were received and filled for N-frames other than Models 27, 28, and 29. S&W did not carry a large inventory of completed and somewhat obsolete HD's, OD's, and .44HE models on hand; they were built on demand and model numbers stamped when assembled into complete units. I don't have evidence other than this anecdote and the Model 21 Jinks letter.

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Tom in AZ
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Tom,
You will notice that your MOd 20 is a 4 screw. I would imagine that the Mod 21 is too. That would shoot the on the shelf theory because all the earlier guns were 5 screw guns.
Bill

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Good point Bill. Yes, both are four-screw. The S192xxx serial numbers indicate 1959 manufacture.
If I have my dates in order the four-screw frames appear in 1957, model numbers in 1958, dash one (-1) in 1960, and dash two (-2) three-screw models in 1962. That's a two year period of no-dash model production, 1958 and 1959. I can understand four-screw Model 20's and 21's built during 1958-1959 sitting in inventory for up to four years, but can't imagine S&W building -1 and -2's with slow-moving no-dash models sitting on the shelf. Does this make sense? If so, then perhaps the Pueblo HD's were among the last of the 1959 production run to ship out, the APD guns were a special run, and December 1964 was the end of the line for the HD.

Who, then, has "The Last Heavy Duty"?

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Tom in AZ
Respect the Dingbat

I would like to see pics of those guns Mr. Gila. The 4 screw guns have the nicest post war polish jobs and blue. I'd like to see a post war HD, and or model 21, with a 4 screw polish.

S255888 is out there. With the serial numbers so far apart-S192000-S241000, for the Mod 20, and 4 screw frame, it is hard to imagine when they made them. All the mod 20s I know of where shipped in 1963.
Bill

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk 2

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Beagleye, This is the Model 21 .44HE Military, four-screw, 4", blue shipped in 1961. The finish is in better condition than the Pueblo PD Model 20.

003.jpg 002.jpg 004.jpg 007.jpg

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Tom in AZ
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1Aspenhill, I have a well worn, marked Model 20, 3-screw frame, serial# S 241734. (You saw this gun, I bought it at the Tulsa show in late 2011.)
It shipped March 10, 1964, to J. T. LLoyd Co., Little Rock, AR.

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John

That's a trucking company. Arming the security guard?

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John,
Yes I remember-it should have been marked a -2 and it seems 4 of the 16 serial numbers are known.
Thanks,
Bill

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