Early K-38 Masterpieces with the Large Ejector Rod Knob (LERK)

[DCWilson]

SEE POST NO. 12 BELOW, POSTED 5 AUG 2013, FOR UPDATED INFORMATION.

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When S&W introduced the postwar K-22 Masterpiece in early 1947 (two specimens are known to have been delivered in late 1946, but for all practical purposes commercial distribution began in 1947), supplies of wartime parts remained available for use. Among them were several thousand large-knob ejector rods. Many were used on the early postwar M&P revolvers that carried S-prefix serial numbers, and some were used on the earliest K-22 Masterpieces. More than 5000 and fewer than 6000 K-prefix revolvers were produced with large ejector rod knobs and notched barrels to accommodate their larger diameters. These have been referred to by some collectors as LERK Masterpieces to distinguish them from the later postwar K-target revolvers that had knobless ejector rods with knurled ends.

The highest known serial number on a LERK Masterpiece is K5680; that gun is a K-22. Not all guns numbered lower than that are LERK guns, though an overwhelming majority of them are. A few lower-numbered K-22s in the K5xxx range are known to have knobless ejector rods (K5154 and K5678, for example), and we may conclude that the serial-number boundary between these varieties is fuzzy.

Though most LERK Masterpieces are K-22s, not all are. A K-38 with the serial number K1661 is known, and I think it is almost certain to have been a large-knob gun. According to Roy Jinks in History of Smith & Wesson, K1661 was delivered in June, 1947; the recipient is not identified. I suspect that this gun was a salesman's sample, and a few other such samples may have been produced at the same time. [See Addendum at bottom of post.]

After K1661, the next known serial numbers of K-38 Masterpieces fall in the K45xx to K48xx range. The lowest observed number is K4562, though a K4549 is said to be referenced in records. K4564 and K4593 have also been reported. The highest known serial number on a gun in this range is K4820. Another early K-38 in this range (K4647, recently reported on this forum by member and distinguished collector bmg60) is extremely interesting in that it has a knobless ejector rod. It is thus the lowest-numbered Masterpiece of any caliber known to have a knobless rod.

I recently had the good fortune to acquire this LERK K-38, K4709. My thanks again to Scotter260 for the deal that brought this gun to my collection.











The gun has been a shooter, not a safe queen. I put its condition at about 90%, with muzzle and high edge wear, a turn ring, blue loss on the bottom of the trigger guard and some scuffing in the cylinder lock pockets. Bore and chambers are fine and shiny. There is no push-off. There is a bit of endshake in the cylinder, and perhaps slightly more rotational play than one sees in the better looking guns of the early postwar era, but movement is within tolerances. The stocks that came to me on the gun were from much later (numbered over 200000). I had the stocks seen in the photos in the woodpile. They are at least closer to the proper age (11464) though they still do not fit the gun particularly well.

This gun shipped in February 1948, which makes it one of the earliest K-38s to have been commercially distributed. The only other LERK K-38s I know about are ones that have been reported over the years in this forum: K4562, K4564, K4593 and K4820 -- along with the one I report here, a total of five. By May of 1948, other K-38s were being shipped with serial numbers between K22700 and K23700. Not one of these guns is known to have shipped with a large knob. But like their few LERK precursors, they are all narrow-rib guns and have a single line address. A single K-38 in the K25xxx range is probably also a single line gun, but the next known K-38 (serial number in the K35000s) may be a four-liner; a handful of K-38s in the K39000s are almost certainly four-line guns. [EDITED APRIL 2014 TO ADD: Based on discussion in posts below, we now know that K4562 and K4820 are not LERK specimens; they have the single-diameter ejector rods.]

What do the serial number ranges tell us? If we set aside the suspected salesman's sample(s) and emphasize the power of round numbers, it appears we might have a block of K-38 Masterpieces numbered from about K4501 to K4825 or K4850. That is a first production run of about 325 or 350 revolvers. There are no known K-22s with serial numbers in this range, and other than the suspected salesman's sample no known K-38s with K plus four-digit serial numbers outside of this range. We know one gun with a knobless ejector rod from this range (K4647 mentioned above), but the other known K-38s with K plus four-digit serial numbers are LERK specimens. It is probably safe to predict that no more than 350 LERK K-38s were ever produced, and perhaps no more than 300, depending on where the true beginning and end of the serial number range actually lie. If that is true, and if only 5500-5600 or so LERK Masterpieces were produced, around 93 to 95 percent of them would be K-22s and about five to seven percent K-38s.

It is possible that another 1000-1500 K-38s were produced in early 1948 at a time when frames still received only the single-line address markings. But the serial numbers are a little more scattered, and single-line K-22s are known with serial numbers in the K25000-K30000 range (though none are known in the K22701-K23700 range that may consist entirely of K-38s). By the time the K-32 Masterpiece came into earliest commercial production with serial numbers in the K56xxx range, large knob ejector rods had long since ceased to be used in Masterpiece production. One should not expect to see a LERK K-32 unless it is an early salesman's sample from sometime in 1947. The histories refer to a single salesman's sample, but there may have been a few. It strikes me as inconceivable that more than a dozen LERK K-32s might ever have been produced, and perhaps far fewer than that. Those would be among the rarest Masterpieces. [ADDENDUM ON THIS POINT: I had forgotten about K66035, which is a LERK K-32, though questions have been raised about its configuration. See this thread: Need info on 1948 K-32 *** Added pics*** ]

If anyone else has a LERK K-38 not reported here, I would appreciate learning its serial number. A PM is fine if you would prefer not to post to the forum, though I encourage all with such guns to announce them and post photos of them in this thread.

ADDENDUM: I had forgotten that there is some uncertainty over the identification of K1661 as the first K-38 Masterpieces. The correct number may be K2137. That number itself is a little confusing because it is in some places identified as a K-32. Actually, the first K-32 is probably K2143. Mike Priwer has pointed this out in other forum posts, and I simply didn't recall his observations when I first composed this message.

[Hondo44]

Thanks David, very well reported.

Are other frames sizes referred to as LERKS as well? If so the only LERKS I own are transitional I frames as you may guess. And as I've observed most N transitionals or goodly % seem to be LERKs as well.

[DCWilson]

I appropriated the term LERK from earlier posts on this forum. I think RKMesa was the original user of the term, but I could be wrong. My recollection is that it has been used only to separate the earliest postwar Masterpiece models from the later ones. There is no reason why it couldn't be used to help distinguish varieties within other postwar or transitional revolvers.

Maybe we should create another term RLERK (Really Large...) for the mushroom-shaped knobs that were phased out about 1928.

[66Park]

Thanks for the fascinating post, David. And that is a fine looking specimen you have!

[1blindref]

Excellent and informative post. Thank you for the education!
BTW - nice gun

[Memphis]

Excellent writeup David (and pics). The LERK's sure are an interesting and rarely seen occurance. I was really glad that one went to you. It seems like a real nice specimen too!.

Roger

[1950jcb]

Thanks much for the very informative post. I have a K22 example, (K4881) and have been looking (without success) for a K38. I have owned (and just bought another) narrow rib examples with the 3 line address. After reading your thread, it appears that might be as close as I'll get to finding a match, although one sold on GB recently. The gun pictured may not be a safe queen, but I'd be very happy to find a similar example in any condition. I'll keep looking. Jim

[DCWilson]

Roger, I know you were interested in this one, and it was just the luck of the draw that I had in my safe the gun the previous owner was interested in trading for.

Take heart. If I'm right in my summary of the numbers, there should be another 300 of these out there for collectors who don't have one yet.

[Scotter260]

Wow, that was a very enjoyable read.

I enjoy these very topic-specific threads especially when it's authored by one who's so interested and knowledgeable on the topic.

Good stuff sir, thank you.

[j38]

Very informative post. Thanks much, David.

Jerry

[RKmesa]

David:

Great post! Just for photo reference, here is K4564 that you referred to. It also shipped in Feb 1948.

[DCWilson]

The letter for K4709 (the gun in the top post) reports that it shipped to Kennedy Brothers Inc. of St. Paul, MN on February 10, 1948. The only other precisely dated LERK K-38 is K4593, which shipped to Belknap Hardware in Louisville, KY a week later on February 17, 1948. Three other guns known to have shipped in February 1948 have not yet had specific shipment dates and destinations established.

The question of early K-38s without knobs on the ejector rod just got more interesting. I had believed that only K4647 among the earliest K-plus-four-digit serial numbers had a knobless ejector rod, but yesterday I stumbled across evidence that K4562 is also a knobless gun. Check post no. 17 in this thread:

A Post War Transitional Model K-22 Dedication Thread

Of five early K-38s shipped in February 1948, three are LERK guns and two have knobless ejector rods. Hard to do much with statistics like that. If only a dozen more K-38s with serial numbers under K5000 would turn up, we might have a sample big enough to allow generalizations.

As I write, there are only four LERK K-38s known to me: K4564, K4593, K4709 and K4820. The knobless guns from the vicinity of these serial numbers are K4562 and K4647. A seventh gun, K4549, has not been observed but is known from records to be a K-38. We don't know if it has a knobbed or knobless ejector rod. [EDITED APRIL 2014 TO ADD: K4820 in fact has a knobless ejector rod; see posts below.]

If anyone has serial numbers and knob reports for other K-38s numbered in the K45xx to K5000 range, please report them here or send me a PM with the relevant information. I guarantee confidentiality for you, but would obviously want to use the information about specific revolvers to paint a fuller picture of these earliest K-38s. (Some guns in the K45xx to K5000 range will be K-22s -- mostly at the high end, I would imagine -- but I am tracking only the K-38s for this study.)

[DCWilson]

It has been a year since this thread started, and I was wondering if anyone has had the good fortune to acquire a LERK K-38 Masterpiece in the intervening months. Or maybe even realize that the old K-38 in the back corner of the safe is more interesting than it seemed.

Don't be shy! There must be more than just four known K-38 Masterpieces with this specific configuration. I'm hoping to expand the data base entries for this uncommon variety.

[Vulcan Bob]

A nice post to be sure, thanks for sharing that one! About three years ago I acquired a nice early 1948 (I think) K-22 one liner without the "LERK" dang it. Oh well, it gives me yet another one to keep an eye out for.

[Göring's S&W]

Im still looking for my first one. Its nice to know they exist (thx david for making this thread about them) because nearly everyone who posts a transitional masterpiece posts a K22. Apparently these PWT k38s are much more scarce than PWT K22s. I hope to find one some day...

[410bore]

Originally Posted by Goring's S&W

Im still looking for my first one. Its nice to know they exist (thx david for making this thread about them) because nearly everyone who posts a transitional masterpiece posts a K22. Apparently these PWT k38s are much more scarce than PWT K22s. I hope to find one some day...

I'm in the same boat, I'm looking for one

[linde]

Originally Posted by DCWilson

. . . If anyone has serial numbers and knob reports for other K-38s numbered in the K45xx to K5000 range, please report them here or send me a PM with the relevant information. . . (Some guns in the K45xx to K5000 range will be K-22s -- mostly at the high end, I would imagine -- but I am tracking only the K-38s for this study.)

Unfortunately I don't have a K-38 to report in the s/n range of interest . . . and I understand you're not tracking K-22s . . . but it might be helpful to know that K4760 is a K-22 w/LERK.

So now the maximum possible number of K-38 LERKs in the study range is down from 500 to 499

Russ

[RKmesa]

David:

I think that you know of all the ones that I know of (I think 5 or 6 in total)... I've kept my eyes open for any other ones. Unfortunately, no success in locating any more.

[paplinker]

Originally Posted by 410bore

I'm in the same boat, I'm looking for one

Me too

If one showed up on GB i would be very curious to what it may bring.

Also i have a k22 lerk, K5277 Maybe a higher number K38 lerk exists.

[Engine49guy]

Actually held one in my hand for sale at the Orlando SWCA meeting a couple of years back but didnt have enough cash to buy it and a K22 LERK for sale next to it on the table ...

Ended up choosing the K22 LERK but suspect that same K38 LERK is perhaps pictured above ?

[JP@AK]

Originally Posted by DCWilson

Maybe we should create another term RLERK (Really Large...) for the mushroom-shaped knobs that were phased out about 1928.

David
I've started referring to them as MERKs (Mushroom Extractor Rod Knobs). Maybe it will catch on, maybe not!

[JP@AK]

David
Thank you for this very interesting and informative thread.
I will certainly keep my eyes peeled for K-38s with the LERK and will report any that turn up.

My research into S prefix M&Ps has turned up quite a bunch of those with LERKs, which will be no surprise. But one item I am tracking in that research is the transition point from those to the small knobs.
So far the highest number reported with a LERK in that series is S903568, which probably shipped in the spring of 1947 (no date from Roy yet). It has a 6" barrel. (Of course, this does not count the 2" guns, which always had the small knob.) I have recorded a half dozen or so lower numbers with the small knob, so the spring of 1947 is emerging as the transition period for this feature. Prior to that time, all the M&Ps reported with barrels longer than 2" have the large knob. The lowest number on a non-2" gun with a small knob is a 4" M&P with the number S882052.

I don't know if this is helpful to you or not, but I thought I would pass it along.

[JP@AK]

I have another question about this matter. What is the thinking about barrels on these postwar LERK guns? Do we think the barrels were machined to fit the knobs or were they simply fitted to barrels produced earlier, along with leftover knobs. Has anyone produced information on this angle?

[red9]

David,

Great summary as always. One correction - K38 #K4820 (March, 1948) is a S(mall)ERK.

Bob

[DCWilson]

Originally Posted by red9

David,

Great summary as always. One correction - K38 #K4820 (March, 1948) is a S(mall)ERK.

Bob

Bob, thank you for that clarification. I will make the change in the data base.

I completely misread the photo you posted in the 2010 thread about light barrel/heavy barrel K-38s. It looked like a LERK gun to me there, but I see now I was probably misreading a shadow effect.

[DCWilson]

Originally Posted by JP@AK

I have another question about this matter. What is the thinking about barrels on these postwar LERK guns? Do we think the barrels were machined to fit the knobs or were they simply fitted to barrels produced earlier, along with leftover knobs. Has anyone produced information on this angle?

In the case of the LERK Masterpieces, new barrels had to be shaped to allow use of knobbed ejector rods in inventory because there were no ribbed K-frame barrels in production until late 1946.

I suspect some of the M&Ps produced in late 1945 and 1946 made use of both leftover ejector rods and leftover barrels, and I'm not sure we would be able to tell which one ran out first. Presence or absence of patent dates, perhaps? Sitting here right now I can't remember the lowest serial number on a gun without patent stamps on the barrel. I'm guessing somewhere in the S8xxxxx range, but I don't know.

[glowe]

I have always thought that MERK and SERK would save a lot of key strokes and will start using them along with LERK.

David - have you thought about putting together a Commentary on early Masterpieces? They are very collectable and popular, so documenting the variations would be a service that members would like to have easy access to for future use. I think a Commentary would be a great place to put some valuable information for long-term storage.

[DCWilson]

Well, this morning's posts are certainly food for thought.

It is now clear that of the the six observed K-38s with serial numbers below K5000, three are LERK guns and three are not.

LERK:
K4564
K4593
K4709

NON-LERK:
K4562
K4647
K4820

In addition serial numbers of possibly three other early K-38s -- K1661 (maybe), K2137 (maybe) and K4549 -- have emerged from company records over the years, but I don't know that these guns have actually been observed. I don't know if they are LERK specimens or not. I suspect the first two would be, but the third one may not be.

In any event, it now appears to me that perhaps only half to two-thirds of the 300-350 K-38s with serial numbers below K5000 were produced as LERK guns. I never thought they were numerous, but now they appear to be even scarcer than I had thought likely. But the numbers are thin and we probably won't be able to make reasonable projections until a dozen more K4xxx K-38s turn up and we can tabulate their ejector rod types.

[JP@AK]

Originally Posted by DCWilson

I'm not sure we would be able to tell which one ran out first. Presence or absence of patent dates, perhaps? Sitting here right now I can't remember the lowest serial number on a gun without patent stamps on the barrel. I'm guessing somewhere in the S8xxxxx range, but I don't know.

David
First, thanks for the feedback on the Masterpiece barrels. This makes sense.
As to the M&Ps with patent dates, so far my collected data indicate that the patent dates show up throughout the S series of numbers. Other than 2" guns, most or all of them seem to have patent dates on the barrels. The highest number recorded so far is S999839. It has a 6" barrel with patent dates on top (it also has the high speed hammer). So far, I have not recorded a single revolver with longer than a 2" barrel that does not have patent dates. There are a few in the higher bracket for which I have incomplete data and, in some cases, the presence or absence of dates is one item not reported. In most cases, I know where these guns are, so I just need to contact the person and get the rest of the information. At this point, however, the data seem to indicate that the S prefix guns had patent dates up to the very end. Those without would seem to be exceptions. As I continue gathering data, this is one of the items I'm looking at.

[RKmesa]

David:

I have a bunch of LERK K-22's, one LERK K-38 and I think I recall seeing photos of a couple of Masterpiece LERK K-32's (K2244, and I think K6XXXX) - I would love to have one to round out the trio.

Do you have a more completed list of the K-32 LERKs as well?

[Scotter260]

Again, great thread.

I missed your initial posting of the shipping info on K4709 - perhaps it never left Minnesota since that's where it shipped and was found. Have you ever searched for info on Kennedy Bros.?

[DCWilson]

The only LERK K-32s I know are K2244 and K66035. Until about a year ago I didn't think there were any, but it now appears there will be at least a few. I worry a little about K66035, because I don't know if it shipped as a LERK gun or ended up as one after a trip to the repair bench. That is a VERY high serial number to be an original large-knob specimen.

My two K-32s -- K66021 and K69843 (shipped Feb and April 1949 respectively) -- are both knobless guns.

I also would love to have a LERK K-32, but I doubt I will ever see one outside of photos.

[DCWilson]

Deleted by accident and reposted, but now with a much later date. Sorry.

Originally Posted by Scotter260

Again, great thread.

I missed your initial posting of the shipping info on K4709 - perhaps it never left Minnesota since that's where it shipped and was found. Have you ever searched for info on Kennedy Bros.?

Kennedy Brothers Arms Co. of St. Paul was said to have been founded shortly after the Civil War and was still in business at least into the 1950s. I haven't found references to the business in more recent decades, but then I haven't looked that hard.

Teddy Roosevelt bought a couple of long guns from them at some point. The company issued periodic catalogs which are available from time to time at Ebay and similar places. Ebay actually has a couple for sale right now.

[75R90S]

Wow, great thread,lots of good information.
I can only add a little to it. I have K4832, which shipped Feb. 6, 1948 and has the small ejector rod knob.