Question for the real S&W gurus...

[Art Doc]

Lets say back in 1958 someone special ordered a custom, non-catalog barrel length (as an example but I'm thinking of any custom modification done at the factory before shipping as a new gun). For example, a 38/44 Outdoorsman with a 4" barrel. Would they have cut a 6.5" barrel and assembled the gun, or would they have taken a completed gun from inventory, pulled the barrel and cut it? Or did both happen? In either case did the modified gun receive any service stamps or other markings (on the gun) to indicate its status as a special order?

I'm guessing they did not given the number of unusual guns that turn up with owners asking if they are original and nobody mentions such markings. If S&W didn't stamp special orders, I'm a bit surprised. Seems like a good idea.

[Club Gun Fan]

Being close to the plant, I've know a number of employees at S&W.
I have owned many guns that were owned by workers there. I had a Model 60 once that had a 3" barrel, special stocks, semi target with a bead blast finish. It was a gun that they pulled from inventory and using the term he used when I bought it, "screwed around with it". It lettered as a plain Jane model 60. I do know that if they made changes to a gun sometimes the changes didn't get on the invoice.

[Bill Bates]

Strictly a guess but I'll bet that both happened; barrels were cut to put on waiting frame and assembled guns had barrels cut (got to move that sitting inventory no matter what). That just makes sense to me.

I'm sure someone will come along that has information beyond a guess.

[keith44spl]

Franklin,

I would say this,

If a 6 1/2" was cut to four inches, for a special order,
a newly forged barrel blank without roll markings or one
having the existing roll marking polished off and then
proceed with making the special length barrel.

The roll marks would have been applied after the cut to
the special length and centered up within the space allowed.

Without much fan-fair...
As for documentation of a special order,
that's would be a maybe kinda thing, I'd guess.


Just my opine.....

Su Amigo,
Dave

[Hondo44]

There are several possible markings associated with your barrel question:

S stamp Service Dept.: An S on the grip frame usually means 'Service Dept.' and was added when the factory fixed cosmetic or mechanical problems found or when modified, barrel change lanyard swivel added, etc., on completed guns. S let the bluing dept. know that it needed to be returned to Service instead of the Fitters like the other ~200 barrels that they blued with it. Parts were blued in large batches.
Other S usages: on a barrel following the serial # most likely stands for Service, as in Service Dept. An S inside the Diamond usually stands for "Service Dept".

Diamonds/circles: were stamped on replaced parts or heel of grip frame on left side for refinish followed by letters, sometimes in a rectangle or diamond, B (blue), N (nickel), or S (standard/blue) with an R (for refinish), on 'heel' of left side of grip frame. A circle under the barrel can also indicate that the barrel was replaced.
"Parts on Hand"- i.e. replacement parts sold out the door.
Parts modified by the factory on a new gun like a shortened barrel BEFORE originally being shipped can have a diamond stamp sometimes with an S inside indicating service dept. work, but w/o a rework date like guns returned to the factory!
It can mean a gun that had service work done, just like the Star was used.

These are just rules of thumb, not at all meant to be an all inclusive list, and often lack consistency (especially size of digits) like anything from S&W.

R stamp: “The "R" indicates an “in house” rework of the revolver [on a gun that never shipped and therefore would not have a date stamp as opposed to rework on a customer gun].” Roy Jinks

"The R marking can indicate that a barrel was removed in manufacturing and returned for a repair, probably a finishing repair. This is done so that the barrel is returned to the Hard Fitting Department to be reinstalled and does not go back into the production line.” Roy

[Wyo]

I can't answer your question as to the barrel but I can provide some info. I once had a Model 25 with a 5" barrel, Baughman front sight (rather than the standard Patridge), magna stocks and a lanyard ring. All of these were factory work on a custom order, but the gun had no special markings at all. I had the box and it had all the custom features noted. That was the only way I could be reasonably certain that all this was factory work. I sold the box with the gun, but if the two were ever separated there would be no way to know for sure whether this was factory work except, perhaps, with a letter from Roy.

[jjbrewst1]

I have also seen a O stamped on the grip frame and the barrel. Which according to my sources means it was a rework after it was made, but before it left the factory for the first time.

My source is a WELL KNOWN Speaker during a presentation at a SWCA Symposium.