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05-14-2017, 09:53 AM
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Weapons used to protect The White House
I have 2 uncles and a great uncle that served at The White House (Washington DC) from the 1930's until about 1975. Two were uniformed guards.
Maybe, just maybe, if I could find one, I might be interested in adding a former White House revolver to my collection. But I see that there are many towns & cities named White House. A revolver marked WHPD could be from White House TN, OH, TX, etc.
Can anyone tell me what weapons were issued to the men guarding The White House, and how they were marked?
Thanks,
--Joe.
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05-14-2017, 10:02 AM
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IIRC.................
The "guards" are part of a uniformed branch of the Secret Service.
The Capitol has it's own "Capitol Police"
when I was younger (70s) seem to recall that the President's Protection Detail carried 2 1/2 inch Model 19s.... and Uzi's
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05-14-2017, 10:04 AM
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You might want to get a copy of Stephen Hunter's book about the 1950 assassination attempt on President Truman, "American Gunfight: The Plot to Kill President Truman--and the Shoot-out That Stopped It"
The guns used by the Secret Service presidential protection detail have changed a lot over time. I don't know how you'd find out.
I'd expect that places like White House TN, OH, TX, etc. are likely too small to have more than a constable.
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05-14-2017, 10:09 AM
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From the 1930s through the 1950s, your best bet would be 4" S&W Military & Police revolvers chambered in .38 special or the Colt Official Police set up the same way.
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05-14-2017, 11:52 AM
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I would imagine currently they are carrying Glock 40's or 9's.
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05-14-2017, 11:56 AM
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I doubt the guns were marked, if so it would be USSS.
In the book cited above, the Secret Sevice agents and the uniformed guards carried Colts - Detective Specials and OPs.
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05-14-2017, 12:06 PM
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In 1978 I know one Secret Service Agent carried the 2 1/2" Model 66.
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05-14-2017, 12:17 PM
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I have come across a few specimen of the Colt Official Police from the 1930s or 1940s that are marked Treasury Dept/Secret Service (dont't recall the exact wording) on the backstrap. Those were standard 4" revolvers and more likely than not carried by uniformed officers.
PS: Found a reference from the Colt Forum about a Colt OP: "And on the backstrap, it's marked TREASURY DEPARTMENT SECRET SERVICE."
Of course the poster used Photobucket so the picture is no longer available.
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05-14-2017, 12:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H Richard
I would imagine currently they are carrying Glock 40's or 9's.
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Nope; the USSS is carrying Sig P229 in .357 Sig- Investigations, Uniformed Branch & Protection Detail.
The USFAM's carry the same exact weapon in addition to the optional P239 in .357 Sig.
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05-14-2017, 03:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Absalom
I have come across a few specimen of the Colt Official Police from the 1930s or 1940s that are marked Treasury Dept/Secret Service (dont't recall the exact wording) on the backstrap. Those were standard 4" revolvers and more likely than not carried by uniformed officers.
PS: Found a reference from the Colt Forum about a Colt OP: "And on the backstrap, it's marked TREASURY DEPARTMENT SECRET SERVICE."
Of course the poster used Photobucket so the picture is no longer available.
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That might have been a gun I used to own. A few years back I purchased a 1939 Colt Official Police 38, 4" barrel, service stocks that was marked "TREASURY DEPARTMENT SECRET SERVICE" on the backstrap. I sold it to a fellow in Georgia who collected department marked Colts and didn't have one from the Secret Service. It was just another gun to me. To him it was a missing piece of his collection.
I deleted the picture when I sold the gun, as I do all guns I sell, because it's not mine anymore, and I believe only the owner should be able to post pictures of "their" gun.
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05-14-2017, 04:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Absalom
PS: Found a reference from the Colt Forum about a Colt OP: "And on the backstrap, it's marked TREASURY DEPARTMENT SECRET SERVICE."
Of course the poster used Photobucket so the picture is no longer available.
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Photos of the revolver in question, or one very much like it, can be seen here:
Colt Official Police Photo Thread , photos 8 and 9 of Post No.51
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05-14-2017, 04:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CajunBass
That might have been a gun I used to own. A few years back I purchased a 1939 Colt Official Police 38, 4" barrel, service stocks that was marked "TREASURY DEPARTMENT SECRET SERVICE" on the backstrap. I sold it to a fellow in Georgia who collected department marked Colts and didn't have one from the Secret Service. It was just another gun to me. To him it was a missing piece of his collection.
I deleted the picture when I sold the gun, as I do all guns I sell, because it's not mine anymore, and I believe only the owner should be able to post pictures of "their" gun.
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That would be me!!
I still have it and there should be pics posted in a few threads on this and the Colt Forum. I'll check tonight and repost the photos if need be.
Best,
Charles
EDIT: The link posted to the. Colt Forum above is the gun in question.
Last edited by policerevolvercollector; 05-14-2017 at 04:39 PM.
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05-14-2017, 04:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by policerevolvercollector
That would be me!!
I still have it and there should be pics posted in a few threads on this and the Colt Forum. I'll check tonight and repost the photos if need be.
Best,
Charles
EDIT: The link posted to the. Colt Forum above is the gun in question.
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COOL!!
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05-14-2017, 04:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CajunBass
.....
I deleted the picture when I sold the gun, as I do all guns I sell, because it's not mine anymore, and I believe only the owner should be able to post pictures of "their" gun.
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Sorry about the "angry face". I just do a lot of research on the forums and get really frustrated when by three or four years back the majority of photos (and always just the one I'd need to see) are gone and have been replaced by the Photobucket symbol. Nothing personal .
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05-14-2017, 04:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Absalom
Sorry about the "angry face". I just do a lot of research on the forums and get really frustrated when by three or four years back the majority of photos (and always just the one I'd need to see) are gone and have been replaced by the Photobucket symbol. Nothing personal .
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We're good. Just explaining why it's not there.
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05-14-2017, 05:00 PM
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As far as automatic weapons go I believe the following were used or are perhaps still being used:
Thompson sub machine gun
Uzi Sub machine gun
H&K MP 5
P 90 ( I believe this is the current sub gun in use)
For those of you remembering the Reagan assassination attempt one of the agents deploys an UZI after the shots were fired.
I sat thru a presentation given by Gerald Ford after his term as President and he was flanked by 2 SS agents. One of the agents coats opened enough and I could see he was packing an UZI.
Jim
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05-14-2017, 05:04 PM
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I suspect NSA's Carnivore flagged this thread!
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05-14-2017, 05:53 PM
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I served on the 7th Coast Guard District Presidential Security Detail (PSD) from 72-75. I can share what we were armed with, but not much about the Secret Service Detail's weapons.
I did hear rumors about some new type of Isralie manufactured sub-machine gun in the brief cases caried by the agents on my boat at times. I only had one opportunity to see the weapon. It was my first look at a Uzi, about 12" from my right ear and pointed at some yahoos on the flying bridge of a Bertram that refused to stop upon my command and continued to approach the yatch President Nixon was on.
I didn't have much time to examine it as I was a bit busy reacting to the command to come around and ram the Bertram with my 27' Magnum Marine. Luckly the operator of the Bertram decided the Uzi pointing out of the Bimini top at him made my blue light and siren a little more conviencing, and he brought his engines to netural!
My putting the boat into a power slide pushed up a wall of water between my starboard side and the port side of the Bertram and adverted the ramming. That wall of water rebounded off the Bertram and came over my gunnel, knocking the agent and his Uzzi to the deck! My boat was ordered back to the POTUS formation, and another boat crew [with SS agents aboard] were dispatched to board the Bertram and investigate the situation.
The agent was not a happy camper for the rest of his boat ride. The Uzi was stashed back inside his briefcase still dripping salt water.
The only thing special about the 1911A1 in my briefcase along with my charts and dividers was that we had them Teflon coated [a new process at that time] to cut down on rust from constant exposure to the salt air in south Florida. The Winchester or Remington pump shotguns in the case at the engineer's feet were Teflon coated also. I don't even recall any USCG markings on our small arms.
The M1 Garands, and after mid 1973 the M16s, were stored at the armory along with a couple M60's. We trained with them, but never carried them on board our boats while I was there.
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05-14-2017, 07:54 PM
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Patton once said the secret service was "a bunch of cheep detectives always smelling of drink" .. which apparently hasn't changed much.
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05-14-2017, 08:04 PM
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1986-1987 a presidential detail in NYC, I had the "pleasure" of being posted next to the secret service. You know the guys in the trench coats with the things in their ears. They weren't very friendly to us uniformed NYPD officers. I noticed a few of them walked into a building leaving behind a small bag. I picked it up and bingo an UZI was inside.I then went inside to hand it back to the agents. They gave me a "what are you doing here" look ,till I explained to them what I was doing there.They became my best buddies for about 4 hours.
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05-15-2017, 03:26 AM
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I have to confess that this thread was a HUGE disappointment to me. Don't get me wrong, there is lots of interesting information here. But when I saw the title, I expected to click and get a nice photo-essay showing a range of Protective Detail revolvers and pistols. Boy, was I wrong in my anticipation! Bummer.
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05-15-2017, 04:16 AM
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I can assure you that the Whitehouse, Texas Police Department never issued or marked any firearms used by it's police department or City Marshal during that time period and all the way up to 1977. Like most small rural communities in Texas at that time all the law enforcement personnel had to purchase and supply their own sidearms and leather gear.
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05-15-2017, 10:47 AM
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Didn't somebody here have a Colt that was Fitzed, and a Berns Martin holster for it carried by Fairbain when he protected FDR ?
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05-15-2017, 01:22 PM
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Here is what Secret Service Agent Clint Hill carried in Dallas on November 22, 1963:
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05-17-2017, 01:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JP@AK
I have to confess that this thread was a HUGE disappointment to me. Don't get me wrong, there is lots of interesting information here. But when I saw the title, I expected to click and get a nice photo-essay showing a range of Protective Detail revolvers and pistols. Boy, was I wrong in my anticipation! Bummer.
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From what I know; there isn't a lot of published information regarding the SS arms used over the years. I expect this is tied up in the whole "security" area and the principal reason. I pieced together the information I provided above regarding sub guns from various sources over the years.
Jim
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05-19-2017, 05:29 PM
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there ain't no cop or constable in White House, Illinios. In Whitehouse, Ohio, Glock 22s, 870s, and AR15s
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05-19-2017, 07:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H Richard
I would imagine currently they are carrying Glock 40's or 9's.
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No Glocks - the Secret Service and capital police don't like mis-feeds and stove pipes. LOL
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05-19-2017, 07:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by firearmsunlimited
No Glocks - the Secret Service and capital police don't like mis-feeds and stove pipes. LOL
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Anyone who has the above problems usually is causing the malfunctions themselves.
I carried a Glock M17 9mm for over 7 years. I had to qualify for the state and for the federal government 2 or 3 years a year and never had a problem.
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06-05-2017, 08:05 AM
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I just wanted to close the loop on this one, and thank you all for the insightful feedback.
DWalt, thanks for recommending the Hunter book. It was a good read. Now I know that in 1950, the WH suits carried Colt Detective Specials, and the uniforms carried Colt Official Police. Also in 1950 they still differentiated between Secret Service Agents, and White House Police.
JP@AK, point taken. Should have titled the thread with a question.
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06-05-2017, 08:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CRT2
In 1978 I know one Secret Service Agent carried the 2 1/2" Model 66.
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I've heard the 19/66 was in use from around 1964 to 1991 or so.
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06-05-2017, 09:47 AM
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i read an account of FDR's trip to north africa early in the war and the train he took to florida was loaded with a "rack of M1 carbines" for use by the secret service.
later in morocco he passed by in review of disarmed U.S. troops with secret service agents armed with thompsons
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