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S&W Revolvers: 1961 to 1980 3-Screw PINNED Barrel SWING-OUT Cylinder Hand Ejectors WITH Model Numbers


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  #1  
Old 09-20-2009, 04:48 PM
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A while back, a fellow forum member asked me to do a thread on stocks by John Hurst. I used to have many more sets, but what I have left I think gives a good idea of what kind of work John did. John was a contemporary of Farrant, Hogue and Stark and worked the Academy during the same period. He was probably the greatest pistol shot the LAPD ever produced. The stocks he made incorporated his ideas. If you look closely, you'll notice his grips are similar to Walter Stark, another LAPD great.
Bob

Here's a notched set on a K-frame PPC revolver (John's personal one). Notice the palm swells and open backstrap, a Hurst trademark:




Here's a couple of J-Frames in Cocobolo and Micarta. Notice the palmswell. John also did flawless checkering.



Here's a nice set of Cocobolo K-Frames for a round-butt. Palmswells, open backstrap and nice checkering. John also made semi-auto stocks and target stocks for bullseye and ISU guns. At one time, all the LAPD pistol team had John's grips on their revolvers.



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Old 09-20-2009, 07:57 PM
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You have some nice John Hurst grips there. I feel fortunate to have one set, which are currently on my 547. They fit OK on the 547 but I think they'd fit better on an older Model 10. I have started digging in the old grips boxes at every gun shop I stop in hoping to find another set.
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Old 09-20-2009, 08:59 PM
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Thank you. More, please.

Anything on the name J. Blackford from that era? (Guns & Ammo 1970 Annual.) Any tips as to how to differentiate Stark v Farrant v Hurst?

IIRC, Mike still owes us pictures of the Stark stocks on Chief Davis' revolvers. Subtle hint.....

My pair of probable Hurst for a Colt MKIII.






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Old 09-20-2009, 09:02 PM
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Hurst. John liked the diamond around the grip screw, but I never saw a set of MK III stocks by him. Interesting!
Bob
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Old 09-20-2009, 09:20 PM
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The MKIII tells are the straight line at the top and the locator pin - highlighted in yellow. Haven't tried them on a revolver, but that's what they look like to me.



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Old 09-20-2009, 11:38 PM
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Great visual history lesson, Bob. The extra material behind the top strap would suggest that the shooter had long fingers and wanted a little more room between his palm and his trigger finger. How do you like shooting with them?

Regards,

Jerry
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Old 09-21-2009, 10:05 PM
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Smile Stark grips

hi guys , Hi bob ,Stark grips please tell me more ??
robbt
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Old 09-21-2009, 10:20 PM
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OIF2,

Re: the J frame grips....
I believe you stated in the past that the Hogue mono grips for J frames are based on these. Correct? What about the Crimson Trace 305s? To me they look alot like these Hurst grips. Anyone know?
Laser Sight For Smith & Wesson J-Frame LG-305 Extended | Crimson Trace Laser Grips
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Old 09-22-2009, 12:35 AM
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Bob,

Very nice indeed. That's more Hurst's than I've ever seen together.
Fuzzy also used the open backstrap. I've got three N frames and a cut Python that are open- J frame enclosed.

Good shooting!
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Old 09-22-2009, 09:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robbt View Post
hi guys , Hi bob ,Stark grips please tell me more ??
robbt
The 1961 Cooper book lists Farrant, Hurst and a Stark as grip makers, with Stark predating Farrant's style.

LAPD pistol team: Earl "Fuzzy" Farrant, Basil Starkey, Emmett Jones and Walter Stark.



LAPD NOSTALGIA
Escapades of a Pistol Team by Lee E. Echols

American Handgunner, Sept/Oct, 1981

"Then they had another little sporting gentleman, Walter Stark. They’d acquired him from the Navy and he was a ring-tail- tooter with all three guns. He lacked about a half an inch of being tall enough to pass muster as a Los Angeles Police Officer, but that was alleviated quite easily when they put him in a pair of elevated shoes just prior to his physical examination. This put him up there with the rest of them and gave him a couple of inches to spare.

Walter’s stock in trade was bringing a few hen eggs out to the range on opening day. He’d get in a very serious conversation with a shooter and surreptitiously slip a hen egg in one of his front pockets. Then, just as the man’s relay was being called to the line, Big-Hands Wheeler would walk by and whack the egg a resounding blow- with one of his huge paws. By the time the shooter would be on the line with his paraphernalia assembled, the egg would be running down the inside of his leg and if you’ve never tried shooting under a handicap like that, you should try it sometime. I have, and found it totally unexhilarating."

------

Walter Rickell in the January, 1986 Guns magazine, in an article about a 1954 mfg. Colt Officers Model Special:

"What really makes this a piece of history is that everyone in the match that day (3-21-54) signed signed [the target] —notable shooters like John Hurst and Fuzzy Farrant, from LAPD and premier handgun grip makers;... and Walter Stark and Joe Blackford, who both taught Hurst and Farrant the art of custom handgun stocks and started the whole business of finger grooves."

..

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Old 09-22-2009, 09:18 PM
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Hi Jerry
The grips are excellent with the extra wood above the open backstrap for the web of the hand (Farrant liked that, too). The open backstrap makes the grips very comfortable and controllable with normal-to-large-sized hands.

Sonny- yes, Hogue still makes a set of stocks that are similar for the J-Frame. One piece, I think. There's a great photo of John Hurst in the April 2008 issue of "Guns and Ammo", along with a pretty good article ("Guns of the LAPD"). It's online at "www.gunsandammomag.com".
Bob

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Old 09-22-2009, 09:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OIF2 View Post
Sonny- yes, Hogue still makes a set of stocks that are similar for the J-Frame. One piece, I think. There's a great photo of John Hurst in the April 2008 issue of "Guns and Ammo", along with a pretty good article ("Guns of the LAPD"). It's online at "www.gunsandammomag.com".
Bob
Got the hard copy of that article when it came out, also have the online one saved in my favorites. Good stuff!
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Old 09-24-2009, 05:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OIF2 View Post
There's a great photo of John Hurst in the April 2008 issue of "Guns and Ammo", along with a pretty good article ("Guns of the LAPD"). It's online at "www.gunsandammomag.com".
Bob
Is this the one you're talkin' about Bob?



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Old 09-24-2009, 07:17 PM
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I'm not Bob, but yes, thats the one he's talking about.
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Old 09-24-2009, 09:08 PM
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That's it, Tom. Since I wrote it, I'm kinda proud of it... John was a superb marksman, a good copper and a gentleman. I miss him.
Bob
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Old 09-26-2009, 09:05 AM
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Not to hijack a thread. But a question for those who have posted here.

This thread reminded me of some grips I picked up about 3 years ago. So I went and found them at the bottom of my box of extra grips. The Back story;

Several years ago a friend was asked to break up an sell a retired US Marshal's "collection" of guns and other stuff. The widow needed to turn things into cash.

I bought a 4" Model 15 for my wife as her range and house gun. My friend knew I liked Spegel boot grips on my K frame Smiths; so when we got together to do the transfer he offered me 2 sets of grips he'd found.

He said, he thought they were Farrants from the 60's, both are for K-frames. One round butt with the extra wood behind the frame at the top. The other was a completely open backstrap for a unmodified K-frame sq. butt. This second pair kind of reminds me of Spegel extended boot grips.

Both are in a almost black wood (ebony?), with finger grooves, palm swell and checkered. Color a lot like the first set in OFI2'2 origional post. Sorry no pictures.

Once I got them onto guns, both my wife and I decided we didn't like them as much as Spegel's. So into the box of grips they went, and have been there for at least 3 years, untill today.

Anyway, to my question, from this thread I get the feeling there are some knowledgeable collectors in the Forum of grips by these makers. If we aren't going to use them; I'm thinking I should make them available to someone who would enjoy them.

But, I have no idea how to value them; cash or maybe in trade for some Spegel grips; to put them in the Classifieds section. I could but don't want to put them on an auction site and let the bidding set the market price; I'd rather see someone here get them. Thoughts/ Suggestions?

Brad
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Old 09-26-2009, 11:19 AM
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Can't do much with a description; post some photos and we can go from there.
Bob
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Old 09-26-2009, 01:12 PM
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I'll see what I can do. I haven't posted pics before .

BAM
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Old 09-26-2009, 09:43 PM
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Do they look like these?
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Old 09-26-2009, 11:55 PM
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Nice stocks, dnater! They look vaguely famliar...
Bob
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Old 09-27-2009, 08:04 AM
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No,no flair at the bottom, both sets taper to the bottom below the palm swell. After yesterdays exchange, I did some more searching and am 99% sure thay are Farrant's. 100% sure they are his style, based on what people are posting as Farrant's. Now I know why Spegel is signing his grips.

Will try to post pics.
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Old 09-27-2009, 12:30 PM
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Post 'em. Farrant had some peculiar features that were neat. They were very nicely made, fit the frame well and did what a custom grip is supposed to-make the revolver more comfortable to grasp and shoot better scores.
Bob
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Old 09-27-2009, 02:46 PM
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I have the pictures but I'm having trouble with linking to the forum, can I e-mail the pictures to someone to post?

Thanks

Brad
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Old 09-27-2009, 04:16 PM
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first four of BAM-BAMs grip pics
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Old 09-27-2009, 04:19 PM
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Last four of BAM-BAMs grip pics
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Old 09-27-2009, 04:21 PM
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Well I want first dibs on the filled upper backstrap one.
Bought a pair last month that postal employee stole from
a member and I still NEED a pair.
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Old 09-28-2009, 01:08 AM
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Very nice Farrants.
Bob
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Old 09-28-2009, 07:57 AM
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bsaride thanks for the help in posting.

Hope I'm not oversteping, but my research hasn't turned up many of these being sold/traded in the open market. Can you help me establish an idea on the value of these Farrents so I can offer them in the classifieds.

I want to find them a good home with a Forum member. Otherwise I'll be forced to go look for 2 early stainless k -frames to .....which would not be good for my domestic tranquility. My wife is really pretty good with my hoby purchases but I'm not sure she will understand my buying guns because I've got grips. She knows I have a big box of grips.

(don't worry bsaride...you have dibs)
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Old 09-28-2009, 09:16 AM
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You may be able to explain to your wife your hobby when you sell a couple of sets of grips & are able to buy a new revolver with the proceads..
I'd like dibs on the K/L Square Butt grip, If I can afford them That is..
Those could be N frame?? Kinda hard to tell??
Thanks
Gary/Hk

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Old 09-28-2009, 09:39 AM
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Headknocker,

It's one thing to buy grips for guns its another to explain buying guns to fit a set of grips. They are k-frames....I checked them on a 66-0 and a pre 17 this weekend. I don't know if its oversteping here with requests for dibs... so drop me a private message.
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Old 09-28-2009, 10:32 AM
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How about a picture of Farrants on a Model 15?


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Old 09-29-2009, 10:06 AM
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BAM-BAM you shouldn't have much trouble selling those K frame Square Butt grips for $150 IMO..
I will have to pass as currently I am broke but you should get someone who can't live without them, besides you don't come across them very often & when you do the price is usualy more like $200, like the set I saw last weekend at the 2100 table gunshow in Louisville..
Great Thread
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Old 09-29-2009, 10:49 PM
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Wink Stark grips ???

hi guys , Hi bob , Stark grips please tell me more ??
robbt
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Old 10-03-2009, 10:16 PM
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From Jeff Cooper's 1961 Complete Book of Modern Handgunning:

Photos in this book are sometimes clearly mislabeled, leaving doubt about others. This is supposed to be Hurst. The profile at the top of the grip is rather like my pair for the Colt MKIII.





Not clear from the caption if this is Stark or Farrant. The rear angle and the diamond are different than any known Farrant I've seen.




The Stark stocks - as ID'ed by Mike Priwer - on Chief Davis' K-38 pictured in the 1996 Faintich auction catalog looks like just like Farrants, but with a more pronounced recoil shoulder.

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Old 10-04-2009, 08:06 PM
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Finally getting around to showing my 547 with Hurst grips.. This set of grips has a fully expose backstrap.
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Old 10-04-2009, 08:23 PM
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Very nice Hurst stocks... the open back style was very popular with most patrol coppers and sold well at the Academy store. I used to have a set on my 6" M68.
Bob
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Old 10-22-2009, 10:54 PM
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First off, THANK YOU, Bob for starting this thread and sharing pics of those Hurst stocks!

Quote:
Originally Posted by OIF2 View Post
Very nice Hurst stocks... the open back style was very popular with most patrol coppers and sold well at the Academy store. I used to have a set on my 6" M68.
Bob
Second of all, are you kidding me?!?!?! I was born too late and too far East. Unbelievable that you could buy Hurst/Farrant/Stark stocks in the freakin' acadamy store!!! Those were the days!


So, Bob, considering that I'll never be able to drop several hundred dollars on a set of Hursts, who do you recommend as a modern-day grip maker who could make something very much like Mr. Hurst's grips?

Sounds like some people are suggesting Craig Spegel is very close to Fuzzy's, so I'm betting with a little nudging, he could come really close to Hursts.

Thanks again for sharing. This is great stuff. Congratulations on owning his personal PPC revolver. You must've been good friends.
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Old 11-07-2009, 09:55 PM
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Smile lefty farrants

howdy guys , i just found a set of Farrants ( leftys too , sorry bob i 'll keep them, OIF2 ), odd as they have a a little thumb rest on the right sight side and a heavy over hang so your grips does not side up on the left, will try to post a few pics , opps its for a Colt Python or Officer model.
robbt
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Old 11-07-2009, 10:18 PM
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Let's see them!
Bob
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Old 11-08-2009, 09:22 AM
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These were advertised as Farrant's when I bought them for $5.00 from eBay a few years ago:









No, I don't want to double my money

They're for a Colt, and not wanting to grind the grip frames of the one's I already owned, I bought this holster worn Official Police just to put these grips on:



However, the Herrett's on it are so comfortable for me, that I haven't done it yet. Someday I will, though.
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Old 11-08-2009, 10:45 AM
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Those Herrett Troopers are VERY nice, too!
Bob
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Old 11-08-2009, 11:03 AM
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I would go ahead and grind the frame on that old Colt, you will still be able to use the Herrett's, but then you'll really ba able to enjoy the Farrants too.

The Farrants on my Model 15 are the most comfortable revolver grips I have ever held!
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Old 11-08-2009, 11:28 AM
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I have a pair of Hurst, K frame, that Mr. Hurst made for me around 1978, I used them maybe 3 months,PPC pratice, then sold the gun. But I keep the stocks. They look like the first picture. I guess I need to find a gun to put them on. Do you think they will fit a 686 or 586? I did have a pair on my 29-2 but they left with the gun,I sure miss that gun. Maybe I ought to just sell the grips, what would they be worth today?
29R
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Old 11-08-2009, 06:48 PM
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Wink here we go

howdy guys , well heres the picture of my recent grip find, odd as these Farrant grips were found in a junk box in up state NY gun show , they are picture on a 1953 vintahe Colt .357 , they are a target varation with the lack of a thumbrest , any ideas ???





here are pictures of my other Farrant grips on sixguns



here is a vintage Farrant on a old Official Police pictured with a un marked Lewis Holster
holster is marked " OM " FM INC, Glendale , Callif.
41 6


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Old 12-21-2009, 09:47 PM
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Just picked up the candidate for the Sq butt Fuzzy Farants
Walked in the door and mounted the grips. I will post pics
when I get the chance.
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Old 12-22-2009, 08:52 AM
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Default Hurst grips

OIF2

I recently picked up a pair of Hurst grips for a K-frame that were signed. I picked them up along with a pair of Bill Davis rubber grips from someone in Lanchster Calif. They were suppost to have been on a model 67. When did he start doing this and have you seen that before?
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Old 12-24-2009, 11:44 AM
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The rubber stocks, if I recall, were designed by Hurst for Bill Davis. John and Bill were good friends and Bill tried to market John's design in rubber. The mold wasn't that good, though, and the execution wasn't the best. I guess they're collector items now.
Bob

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Old 12-24-2009, 12:03 PM
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I spoke with Guy Hogue's son at last year's NRA meeting in Louisville and mentioned that I still had a couple of grips made by John Hurst. He confirmed that John and his father had been best friends and had begun making their grips together in their respective garages.

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Old 12-24-2009, 12:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OIF2 View Post
The rubber stocks, if I recall, were designed by Hurst for Bill Davis. John and Bill were good friends and Bill tried to market John' design in rubber. The mold wasn't that good, though, and the execution wasn't the best. I guess they're collector items now.
Bob
Speedwell has obtained the molds, and apparently the rights, and the Hurst style AKA Bill Davis extended grips live on. The rubber compound has changed, now it is a lot softer than the original rubbers were. I had an older original set on one of my older competition guns. Dummy me, I loaned that gun out to a new shooter for one season and when the gun returned it had Uncle Mike's grips on it. The guy swapped them out for a smaller set and couldn't find my grips when he returned the gun. All of my competition revolvers wear the newer style.

While the mold and execution weren't the best, they are sure a comfortable fit to my hand when shooting PPC.
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Old 12-24-2009, 10:42 PM
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Interesting and informative thread.

These N frame, RB grips have been in my box for several years. They seem to share a number of characteristics with some of your grips. Did any of these makers make any one-piece grips? Any suggestions as to the origin of this set?

Bob





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