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11-03-2009, 01:03 AM
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m27-2 & m28-2 brothers
Made the mistake of visiting a pawn shop and walked out with these two, no boxes or papers. They are worn shooter-grade pieces with dings and pitting on the bluing. They seemed mechanically OK and I liked the grips on the m27 (wonder if they are original), so I gave little over a grand for the pair. I had been wanting these 2 models. The disgusting tragedy is the ugly filing some moron did to the m27 yoke and frame (3rd photo, difficult to see due to lighting, but trust me it is awful). The gun would have been in good shape except for that. How somebody could carelessly ruin this article of fine crafstmanship is beyond me.
m27-2 serial number N361XX (difficult to tell if there is a 6th number due to the horrible filing job)
m28-2 serial number S2909XX
Appreciate any info you guys could provide (date of manufacture, etc.)
For now I am enjoying cleaning and inspecting them.
Regards,
-Eric
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11-03-2009, 03:08 AM
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Model 27-2.....1975 / 1976
Model 28-2......1967 / 1968
Enjoy them!
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11-03-2009, 09:31 AM
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Enjoy them both as they are two great N frames.
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11-03-2009, 12:10 PM
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Eric,
You are gathering up quite a nice collection of S&W's. The grips on that 27 could easily be correct. Since it has the target trigger and hammer, it probably shipped with the target stocks as well. It is from the right time frame for them.
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11-03-2009, 12:33 PM
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Two very nice guns. I really like those on your model 27. Don
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"Don't worry be happy"
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11-03-2009, 02:34 PM
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Thank you all for the replies, especially Big Lou with the dates. I still have not procured that reference book with the dates but want to pick up one if I can find it.
Overall, I am really happy I got these twins and looking forward to visiting the range soon to test accuracy.
I am thinking of moving those nice grips to the model 28 since the 28 is in better overall condition but not sure if those grips would be appropriate for the m28 in the 1967-68 timeframe.
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11-04-2009, 08:34 AM
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dates ??
if the 27 only has 5 digits to the right of the N wouldn't that indicate 69-72 mfg time frame?
what's the number on the butt of the gun, that's where you'll tell for sure, if that's been filed off, you've got trouble, I'd hot foot it back to that pawn shop and get my $$ back before it's too late.
if there is a 6th number on the butt, then I don't know off hand, I don't have my book here with me at the moment
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11-04-2009, 09:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deuterij
..... I still have not procured that reference book with the dates but want to pick up one if I can find it.
.......
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Amazon is where I got mine. $28.37 shipped. Click here.
It's a great book to have.
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Barry, youngest son of Claud
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11-04-2009, 06:28 PM
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GA Johnny, that is an excellent point. In fact I thought of just that S/N problem on the drive home. Forgot about the butt numbering. I will check that as soon as I get home tonight and report back.
Forgive my ignorance and I do know that it is a no-no, but if a S/N is partially filed off, what exactly is the problem? It appears the person tried to correct a yoke closing issue because the yoke is also filed down in the mating area. Then again that could have been a purposeful attempt to mask evil intent.
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11-04-2009, 07:36 PM
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there was a post on here a couple of weeks ago, and several folks posted/pasted copies of the laws that altering a guns serial number breaks, maybe you can search and find it, or someone else will chime in here
if the number on the butt of the gun has not been tampered with, there should be no need to worry, well........other than what caused the gun to "need" the frame/yoke to be filed on in the first place.
I know I would not want to explain to the police why I have a gun with the serial numbers filed off, receipt from the pawn shop or not.
As for the DOM if you've got N361xxx, it's listed as 1975-76, N361xx 1969-1972
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11-04-2009, 09:12 PM
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Yeah this is where it gets interesting. Ga Johnny was right, there ARE 6 numbers. The numbers on the butt are clearly visible and untouched. But the last number on the frame under the yoke is 90% filed off - I can just barely make out the tip of that number. So what do you reckon I should do, try to return it to the pawn shop or keep it?
What do you suppose S&W would do if I sent this gun in to them for a tune-up? Would they freak about the missing digit on the S/N? Or worse, could they confiscate it?
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11-04-2009, 10:43 PM
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photo of grinding
I meant "digits" when I wrote "numbers" in my previous post.
I am trying to add a better photo of the bad area. I wonder how S&W would react to this if I sent it in for repair.
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11-04-2009, 10:46 PM
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well if it was me with the serial number secure on the butt of the gun, my concerns would then center on what caused someone to think the gun needed to be filed on to begin with.
With that said, again if it were me I'd try to see about getting my money back, I mean we're talking about a shooter grade 6" 27, those are not that hard to come by, I'd get my money back and try again later.
The very first question I'd ask when I went back in the pawn shop is what number did they run on the police report when they took the gun in,
I have first hand experence with a pawn shop purchase of a smith with the number on the butt only, the pawn guys did not know to remove the grips to see the real serial number, so they ran the production number stamped on the yoke on the daily police report when they took it in, thinking of course that was the correct number.
Well if the gun were stolen or otherwise "wanted" for some reason, the police had no way of knowing it had come through that pawn shop, and if it were hot somehow, it would turn up as such if I were to ever sell/trade the gun to a FFL shop, or sell it somebody on a forum and process it through my FFL for shipment. Way more trouble than Johnny ever wants to try and unravel.
I picked up on the fact they had ran the wrong number when I got home and was logging it in to my records, I noticed on the receipt they listed a serial different than the one on the butt of the gun, after looking it over I realized what they had done.
I went back the very next day and pitched a fit about, I wound up having to pawn the gun back into the store so the proper number could be ran through the system to ensure the gun was clean, which luckily it was.
Even if the right number has gone through and passed muster, I still think I'd rather find another one with less chance for trouble
Just some food for thought
BTW............I have no idea what they'd say or do if you were to send it back to the mothership for repair work
Last edited by Ga Johnny; 11-04-2009 at 10:51 PM.
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11-05-2009, 12:00 AM
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Well I think I'll try to take it (the 27-2) back to the pawn shop tomorrow. I don't like any doubt about a gun's S/N and I hope they understand. After what you said, I noticed on the receipt they had the S/N wrong (missing the last digit), so if they did run that number through any system, it would not pull up the right data.
I also searched for that serial number legality thread but did not find it. Perhaps I suck at searching, but I'd be interested in that info.
Thanks for the discussion. You've helped me decide what to do.
-Eric
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11-05-2009, 04:51 PM
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FINAL UPDATE: Returned the m27-2 to the pawn shop. They were initially reluctant but after some discussion and my showing them the correct S/N on the frame butt, they agreed.
It sure helps to be an educated customer. Thanks again GA Johnny. I did ask the police report question and they had used the incorrect S/N (missing the last digit). Anyway I am glad to have that one out of my hands and learned a lesson about the importance of the S/N areas.
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11-05-2009, 05:15 PM
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Thought the following exchange with S&W customer support might be educational to others.
Questions sent to S&W:
Dear Sir or Madam,
I have a question regarding serial numbers. Let us say that a particular gun has the following problem with its serial numbering: Somebody has filed on the yoke and frame under yoke (ostensibly to fix a yoke clearance problem) such that the last digit of the serial number there is rubbed off. The serial number on the butt of the frame is fine and unaffected. What sort of problems could this create for the owner?
If a gun with this serial numbering issue were sent to S&W for repair, would you work on it? Could you even re-stamp the serial number on the frame under the yoke?
Answers from S&W CS:
I would check with BATF on the first questions.
No, we would not re-stamp the serial number.
If the gun were sent in we would probably work on it because the serial number is wholly visible on the butt.
Situations as you describe are a case by case basis.
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11-05-2009, 05:32 PM
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Personally, if I liked the gun and it was bought for a decent price, I would have a gunsmith clean up the yoke area and restamp the last digit. As long as it matches the frame butt, I would not be concerned. Again, this is all based on the pawn shop running the correct serial number and it not coming up stolen.
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