My first duty gun right there! I never carried a gun that was a better tack driver than the M15.

And they have Airweight ammo too for easy loading...

Martin Milner played a Cub Newspaper Reporter working his way thru college in a great movie about two rich kids from Chicago murdering a young boy in an attempt to pull off the perfect crime. Set during the 1920's IIRC and I believe Orson Welles played their defense attorney. IIRC E.G. Marshall played the state attorney that prosecuted the case.

rick

I'm trying to post a picture of some of my Hoyt Holsters and their corresponding S&W's.

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Great thread, get to see the reruns just about every day.
Those shows were when television was worthwhile watching!

Is this the same holster ? Looks different for some reason.

Since this thread has been resurrected, I will add something to it. It appears that Martin Milner is in ill health. He is in the process of selling much of his memorabilia through Ebay including many of his Adam-12 items. The auction has been going for about a month now. Some of the Adam-12 items include prop badges used on the show (by the other officers), Malloy's handcuffs and his duty belt from the later years. The belt includes the clamshell for the Mod 15, the cuff case and quick loader pouch. Those items are on right now.

Milner's Model 15 is also available, but not on Ebay. If it hasn't sold yet, you can contact the sellers and put in a bid I think. The Model 14 hasn't showed up yet. Look for Martin Milner Private Collection on Ebay or on Facebook. You can see some up close pictures of many of the items. KMA-367

I think you will find that the K-38 (Mod 14) was carried in an open top holster style with a retention strap (at least in the earlier seasons) I believe the clamshell makes the appearance with the Model 15 - 4 inch. Best.

Correct. I think the open top holster with the retention strap was a Bill Jordan style, but don't hold me to that.

The still is from an earlier episode when LAPD was using 6 inch barrels. You can also tell it's early because Malloy is wearing the 8 point hat, which was replaced by the round style around 1970 or 1971.

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Can open, worms everywhere.

Definitely Jordan style, but with a swivel and a two piece retention strap; almost makes it an early thumb break...

There is a good picture of the style on this thread.

New acquisition - Model 10-5

Milner will be 83 years old this year...McCord will be 72. I watch two episodes of Adam 12 on ME TV every weekday...simpler times bring back great memories...AMC Matador Police Cruiser was a real hot rod...I believe they had the 401 cubic inch V8...while I was serving in the USN there were a few in use with base security and Shore Patrol units.

rick

I watched it back then occasionally, and liked it. I watch it now and it leaves me cold. Sort of the same story with Dragnet and Badge 714. Times change, I've changed.

Thanks boys and girls for the new Likes.

I need to check back here more often.

All I'm dealing with seems to be Glocks and AR's now-a-days.

Need to take the K38 out and have some fun.....

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Death? Smile back...

Very nice!

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John

The first year was the Safety Speed swivel with two-piece fold away strap sometimes called a fingertip release. In his 1960 Trend book, Charles Heard credited a special LAPD holster of this design to Arvo Ojala.

Next was the Safariland Mdl. 11 "Roberts Rangemaster" swivel with the full buckleless belt and accessories. I think that must be for "Duke" Roberts. (I have an 11-A with thumb break.)

Then the Safety Speed clamshell.

In that 1960 book, Charles Heard declared the clam shell holster to be dead. Then, in 1970, E. Dixon Larson in Guns declared that ... the clamshell holster was dead. I've seen LAPD officers pictured with them into the 80's. OIF2 may have data on that.

Arvo Ojala ad from 1969.



Bucheimer had one too.



This is the only reference I've ever found to JAT Industries claiming to have a contract to produce Safariland and Safety Speed style leather for LAPD. 1971.

I remember seeing a young Milner playing a minor role in a war movie. I think he asked a vet if he was scared as they were about to land on the beach.

I watched a few episodes on YouTube last week.

I was surprised that Reed and a lady cop went to a restaurant and both were sitting with their backs to the glass door. I sometimes see real cops do that.

I've always wanted to face the door and see who comes in.

I've also seen real cops be very casual when answering burglar alarms.

I hadn't seen the show since it originally aired. I was surprised to see how old fashioned it seemed. But I still enjoy it.

Martin Milner's/Malloy's original Adam-12 holster rig just sold on eBay for a tad over $3000. Safety Speed clamshell holster for a 4" S&W with Safariland accessories.

Auction# 291195863641

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John

I wish I could get $3K for my old rig ... still have all the accessories too. I saw Milner's items at the badge show, but for all the celebrity, I'd much rather have my old shirt and rig than his ...

Halls of Montezuma. (Note: I didn't even have to Google that, how said is that?)

That's where he met Jack Webb and the rest, as they say, is history.

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Can open, worms everywhere.

My father taught me to always sit with my back to a wall, and in a position to scan the room when seated in a restaurant. When we have a choice of seats, my wife has learned to give me deference in that regard without asking where I want to sit. It's also a pretty good idea to check out where the exits are located.

Wild Bill Hickock observed this practice, but the one time he didn't - well, you know the rest of the story.

John

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- Cogito, ergo armatus sum -

The clamshell was authorized up until almost 1990 or so...well into Bernie Park's time as chief. There were several negligent discharges with the holster, usually caused by the gun becoming loose in the holster and then firing when any pressure was put on it, like a car seat when getting in. The department banned the holster, but grandfathered in the people who already had one and let them keep it. The coppers that had one had to register their holster at the Armory and have it inspected at each qualification. Armorers were taught how to repair/tighten the holsters if the revolver was becoming loose inside.
Bob

I do this, almost unconsciously, to this day. I don't tell people I'm doing it, I just do it more or less naturally.

The other thing I do is constantly scan around when I'm talking to people. Some people find it disconcerting when they are talking to me and I'm looking over their shoulders to see what is going on. A few have even turned around to find... nothing. Some think I'm not paying attention even though I am, both to them and to my surroundings.

I guess that makes me weird or something.

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Can open, worms everywhere.

If you are weird then you have a lot of company here. I do the same thing no matter where I am.

"Compulsion" is a 1959 American crime drama film directed by Richard Fleischer. The film is based on the 1956 novel of the same name by Meyer Levin, which in turn was based on the Leopold and Loeb murder trial. It was the first film Richard D. Zanuck produced.

Although the principal roles are played by Dean Stockwell and Bradford Dillman, top billing went to Orson Welles, who does not appear in the film's first hour.

Martin Milner played reporter Sid Brooks. Richard Anderson and Gavin MacLeod also had roles.

I'll keep this going.

One of my favorite episodes featured the terrific Warren Stevens playing an older officer - the best police officer Malloy ever knew - returning from disability after being shot. At the end, he hangs it up again because he feels too old and can't adjust to the new ways of policing.

Gee, do I appreciate that sentiment now.



Looks like that must be "The Dinosaur" from December, 1971.

Did Warren Stevens play one of the British officers on the 77th Bengal Lancers show? His co-star there later played Phillip Marlowe, the private detective. I know the actor's name but can't recall it at the moment. Phillip Carey?

Is that the famed Dead Man's hand?

Who made that Jordan style holster? Are the grips Hogues?

The basketweave is distinctively wider than usual, and I don't think I've seen it.

Very sad to hear of Milner's health - I suppose we all get there some day though.

meTV is where I've been catching it lately - funny, twilight zone is on an hour or so earlier and I caught Milner and "Mills"
on separate episodes last week. If you look many of the houses when on-set appear to be the same between the two shows too.

Of course! Aces and eights, one card face down.

John

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- Cogito, ergo armatus sum -

I spent five years doing an admin job on an IT program for my employer. I was only on the street a couple of times a month.

When I went back to the field full time I found that a lot of things had changed. It took me a couple of months to get back into form and be comfortable doing something I had done for 30 years. I've been retired roughly 18 months and can only guess at how much more difficult it would be if I suddenly had to go back on an ambulance.

For one thing, we have a new computer aided dispatch system and even though I was on the selection committee, I'd have to learn that as well as any new equipment the department has bought since then.

My department used to require EMTs and medics who were off from injury more than a couple of months to do one day of orientation for each month missed. Even at that, people found that there was more rust than they expected when they came back to work.

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Can open, worms everywhere.

Last night on MeTV they ran an episode dealing with Air Support,the officers of which wore a khaki uniform with a black Lewis Police Special K frame 4" holster,cross draw and a double drop pouch. Does anyone know if this was accurate for the time (1969);the Bell Jetranger and 47 seemed to be(Part 2 of this eipsode is on Me TV at 12 CDT tonight).
I've seen a few black Lewis holsters in photos,but none in the flesh...

Regards,
Tecolote

I've been enjoying watching Adam-12 on NetFlix for the past few weeks,I'm watching one right now all the seasons are on here, I just watch a few every night when I get home from work.

This show was well before my time but I've always been a TV and movie nut so I enjoy the classics too

There's tons of classic S&W action, like when Reed is suppressing the rooftop sniper so Malloy can save that kid.....I don't know the name of the episode. I was impressed that Reed is shooting in DA and then uses his dump pouches to reload.

They call this the first "realistic" cop show but Reed and Malloy seem to get into gun fights nearly every episode it's still TV I guess

Couldn't agree more. I remember when I was a kid. It would take ONE cop walking the beat to clear a corner. The toughest punk on the block wouldn't even think about giving lip to a cop. If he did, they'd have a stop at the hospital before the station house. Nowadays, the recidivist felon crack dealer is believed over the cop. The media paints the cops as thugs. And professional rabble rousers stoke the flames and line their pockets.

Don't know if anyone is aware of the "choke death" in NYC. Guy arrested 31 times. 360 pounds. Diabetic. Asthmatic. Selling loose untaxed cigarettes. Cops go to arrest. Guy flat out refuses to be arrested. Given multiple chances. Resists when they make a lawful arrest. One cop does use an Unauthorized chokehold to help bring him down. Guy goes into cardiac arrest and dies. Medical examiner issues press statement, not actual autopsy results, saying chokehold CONTRIBUTED to his death. His morbid obesity and asthma didn't help either. Publi. Is up in arms

31 arrests and on video refusing to comply with a lawful arrest and he's the victim! I would physically prevent my son from becoming a cop today

During Malloy's speech about the police car in the pilot episode, he states that there are two shotguns. One is in front as you describe, the other is in the trunk.

That is the only mention of two shotguns ever on the show. Even at shift change when Reed checks out a shotgun for the cruiser, he only gets one and it goes in the front.

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Can open, worms everywhere.

I've been following this story a bit. The mistake the officer made was using the unauthorized choke hold. The part about it being a lawful arrest has been lost in the narrative about the suspects death.

It is going to be a messy, complicated case. In addition to the alleged police misconduct, the EMS response was questionable at best.

Probably best left for another (if any) thread and not pollute this one.

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Can open, worms everywhere.

The holster is a Bucheimer Clark "Deputy", the grips are early nylon Hogue.

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It is common for the illiterate to refer to the offender as a victim in such circumstances, simply because they died, or got shot, or whatever. They are not victims. They are volunteers and offenders. I have sent some pretty scathing commentary to a couple of newspapers/TV stations over such.

I am pretty sure what NYPD prohibits is the LVNR, which is not a chokehold any more than I am a handsome gymnast. What happened here is that the officer was simply grabbing the nearest part he could to try to control the head of the offender. IF there was any compression of the neck, it was incidental.

Poppin' Fresh died as a consequence of his lifestyle choices (health problems like that are simply a slow motion form of suicide) and his criminal actions. There are no "ties" in fights with LE. Offenders lose. Fights are not pretty. They will involve kicks, palm heel strikes, and lots of other similar techniques. Wrestling an offender is not smart, and wrestling that food blister with legs would have been stupid.

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NHI, 10-8.

Yeah. The medical examiner already ruled no injury to neck or trachea. Though the rabble rousers don't care. Other funny thing is the chokehold is not approved by the job. But using it is not criminal. Cop's gonna be sacrificed to placate the rabble rousers, but he did nothing illegal. Just violated dept policy.

Malloy is referring to shotgun racks; not two shotguns. Ironically, I don't think the trunk mount was ever shown.

From IMDB - "This black and white patrol car has an overhead valve V8 engine. It develops 325 horsepower at 4800 RPM's. It accelerates from 0 to 60 in seven seconds; it has a top speed of 120 miles an hour. It's equipped with a multi channeled DFE radio and an electronic siren capable of admitting three variables, wale, yelp, and alert. It also serves as an outside radio speaker and public address system. The automobile has two shotgun racks, one attached to the bottom portion of the front seat, one in the vehicle trunk. Attached to the middle of the dash, illuminated by a single bulb is a hot sheet desk. Fastened to which you will always make sure is the latest one off the teletype before you ever roll."

It may not be criminal, but if it's outside of protocol is opens the officer to department discipline and the department to civil liability for their failure to adequately train and supervise the officer.

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Can open, worms everywhere.

Oh, I know. He's fired for sure. Better to be unemployed than in prison, though.

Yes, but it's still a shame. It really grates that the family of this guy is going to get a significant settlement from the city for this.

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Can open, worms everywhere.

WAY COOL! From one old badge to another. I cut my teeth on a Model 15 in the academy. Loaded from loops, not speedloaders! I still placed second out of 60 recruits.

Model 15 "no dash":



The timing is a touch off on two adjacent cylinders, but only if cocked extremely slowly. I probably ought to have it looked at.

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Texas Star:

When I was in the Army, we used to call the best defensive seat in the restaurant (the one facing the entry points with your back against the wall) the "gunner's seat". You always placed your best shooter in that seat, and made sure he always had clear line(s) of fire. I've also seen a lot of LEOs sit with their backs to the door, or with their gun hand "trapped" against a wall or booth. A sad lack of situational awareness.

Regards,

Dave

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What is shameful is that the city won't have the fortitude to litigate. It should not get past summary judgment. It is very unlikely that the plaintiffs could prove causation in fact, and as a matter of law, the force used was objectively reasonable. The fact that a badly written policy may have been violated is not relevant.

The reality is that the officers did not use enough force - there should have been a lot of strikes, and not any grappling until he was disabled.

Sorry about the thread hijack - this is stuff I do professionally (LE operational law), and seeing the overwhelming majority of command officers with whom I have had contact screw this up to an amazing extent really gripes me. Most of them need a big cup of shut up.

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NHI, 10-8.

Malloy must have been the 30th officer to be hired after Joe Friday......

LAPD must not have had a lot of turnover back then....