586 cylinder lock problems

[roland5color]

The front latch that's located in the under lug that locks the cylinder in place by popping into the end of the ejection rod is stuck completely back into its recess. So when I close the cylinder the rear is locked but not the front. Has anyone ever had this problem? I have a punch to knock the pin out that retains the locking pin but I have no idea how I'm going to get it to pop out.

I've tried strong magnets and tapping the barrel with soft mallet and it won't budge. I can't get a pair of needle nose on it because it's to far back. Before this it was stuck in the lock position and I couldn't get the cylinder opened. I used a small screw driver to gentle pry it back so I could open the cylinder and it's been stuck in that position since. Hoping someone else has had this problem and knows how to get this out. Once I get it out and clean the pin and its recess I believe it will be fine.
If by some chance I can't get it out to fix it would it be safe to shot the gun this way? How much does this latch actually help hold the cylinder closed while firing the gun? Any help will be greatly appreciated.

[ginzo]

Welcome to the forum.

Are you the original owner. Even if not, Smith usually will fix any issues. LIFETIME WARRANTY!!!

Has the ejector rod loosened up maybe? I think it turns counter clockwise to tighten. Some smarter, more experienced members will be along shortly to get your problem solved.

Just a thought, hope it helps. I WOULD NOT shoot the gun this way!

[rwsmith]

The gun smithing guys are the best ones to ask.

[Gunhacker]

Sounds like it's bound up by accumulated powder residue and oil. Get a spray can gun cleaner and try blasting it out.

[lhump1961]

Originally Posted by Gunhacker

Sounds like it's bound up by accumulated powder residue and oil. Get a spray can gun cleaner and try blasting it out.

That ^^^ right there. Spray a lube of choice in there and let it soak. Repeat. I would blast it a few times and I bet in a couple of days you can have it loosened up. Just doesn't seem like there can be too much wrong going on there. JMHO.

[roland5color]

That's what I thought as well I sprayed it and let it soak and nothing. Maybe I could try some pb blaster. I will give it another try and see what happens. I'm guessing the original owner never cleaned it and it's gunked up like you guys say.

[Kernel Crittenden]

I'd take it apart. Something sounds hung up in there. One thing though. That's a 0.04" pin, so a 1/16" pin punch will be too big. Brownells sells a 0.04" pin punch, otherwise they're kinda hard to find.

[Mike, SC Hunter]

Originally Posted by Kernel Crittenden

I'd take it apart and see what the hang-up is. Something sounds hung up in there. One thing though. That's a 0.04" pin, so a 1/16" pin punch will be too big. Brownells sells a 0.04" pin punch, otherwise they're kinda hard to find.

Sometimes a bit from a letter or # drill bit set can be use as a punch. Tap on the cutting end and use the flat end for the punch.

[roland5color]

That's just it I can't get it apart. I have a drift to knock the retaining pin out but it does me no good because the latch is frozen In its bore.

[roland5color]

[armorer951]

You might try putting some penetrant in the "weep" hole located in the barrel lug just in front of the locking bolt area. Stand the gun upside down on the sights and let it soak for awhile. Also, sometimes you can access the very end of the locking bolt through this hole and push it forward a bit.

[roland5color]

I've tried using cleaner in this hole and tried to push the locking bolt out but no luck. Tonight I will try the penetrating oil and see if that works. Thanks for all the comments guys I appreciate it. This is the only pistol I currently own so I need to get it it fixed ASAP. I feel like I'm walking around naked without it lol.

[Waywatcher]

Maybe try setting the barrel on a piece of leather and hitting the barrel with a rubber mallet? Might jar it loose.

I'd definitely rig something up so the barrel could sit in solvent overnight--maybe a solvent-filled jar that's tall enough, taped to an upright, with the muzzle sticking in it.

[roland5color]

Before I soak this thing in pb blaster over night does anyone know if it will hurt the finish? As for the mallet I've already tried that and no luck. I'm thinking of soaking it for a few days then shooting some 357 magnum through it to see if that will jar it loose. I'm running out of good ideas so maybe I will try some of the bad ones lol.

[arjay]

It won't hurt the blue,Ive soaked a filthy cylinder in it over night.

[roland5color]

Originally Posted by arjay

It won't hurt the blue,Ive soaked a filthy cylinder in it over night.

Thanks that's the answer I was looking for.

[ginzo]

LOL!

That's how I was 5 guns ago when my FS .40 had to go back for a looksee at S&W. Now, not so much..........

Originally Posted by roland5color

I've tried using cleaner in this hole and tried to push the locking bolt out but no luck. Tonight I will try the penetrating oil and see if that works. Thanks for all the comments guys I appreciate it. This is the only pistol I currently own so I need to get it it fixed ASAP. I feel like I'm walking around naked without it lol.

[Kernel Crittenden]

Did you get the pin out yet? I found this diagram of what the locking bolt looks like. I don't see anything about the bolt that would hang-up the pin, regardless of what position the bolt is in. I also found a post that said it didn't matter which side you drove the pin out from. Left to right, or right to left. It's not a tapered pin.

[roland5color]

I haven't taken the pin out yet because I can't get the bolt to move. I will take it today and see if that helps free it up any. Thanks for the diagram.

[dmixdorf]

The cylinder on my 586 locked shut at the firing range and I could not open the cylinder. If the ejection rod is loose it will back up and become stuck in the recess in the under lug. I needed to thread the rod back into the cylinder. The threads are left hand.
I do not know if this is your problem but it's worth checking. Also if this is the problem clean the threads and use a little blue thread sealer on them. Hope this helps.

[rbert0005]

Looks to me like the pin is buggered up on the end.
Looks like a job for a professional. Send it in before there is some real damage done

Leave the screwdriver in the drawer.

Bob

[Mike, SC Hunter]

After soaking you may heat the area with a hair dryer or heat gun to expand the shroud.

[roland5color]

Originally Posted by Mike, SC Hunter

After soaking you may heat the area with a hair dryer or heat gun to expand the shroud.

Thanks for the idea. I was trying to think of a way to heat it up without damaging it and forgot all about a hair dryer lol. I'm sure I will get it out soon I just need to really sit down and work on it when I get the time. I was just hoping that someone had this exact same problem and had a quick fix. Thanks for all the replies guys will let you know when I get it out.

[Muss Muggins]

Take it to a Smith and Wesson revolver armorer.

[roland5color]

Originally Posted by rbert0005

Looks to me like the pin is buggered up on the end.
Looks like a job for a professional. Send it in before there is some real damage done

Leave the screwdriver in the drawer.

Bob

Thanks for the suggestion. There is no damage to the locking bolt. It's just the flash of the camera and the penetrating oil making it look that way. Its just stuck from years of not being cleaned properly by the previous owner over its 30 years of existence. As for the screw driver comment your right. I should have used a hammer and chisel instead.

[Gunhacker]

Comparing this diagram that Kernel Crittenden posted from the S&W armorers manual, and how far the locking bolt is retracted in the pic posted... it makes me wonder whether or not the bolt has over travelled a bit past the pin cutout and the front shoulder of the bolt is now wedged in place under the pin?.

That pin is not that difficult to distort, but for that to have happened, the bolt would have to of been forcibly driven past the stop cutout to get stuck. Hopefully you or someone else didn't hammer on the front end of the bolt with a punch trying to free it up when it started to bind.

How long had you had this gun? Did you just buy it and discovered that it has this problem, or has it been ok up to now and it started to exhibit difficulties before becoming stuck or did it just "appeared" out of the blue?

You may have no option but to send it back to S&W.

If you've already tried to drift that pin out and it isn't moving... I'd be willing to say that could very well be what's wrong, it's slightly bent (arched upwards) and allowed the top of the bolt to slip under the pin, jamming the bolt in that retracted position.

Now we're talking about some potential fun getting that pin out

edit: oh-oh... I just re-read your original post: "I used a small screw driver to gentle pry it back so I could open the cylinder and it's been stuck in that position since"

Me thinks you did what I think has happened.

[Muss Muggins]

Originally Posted by roland5color

Thanks for the suggestion. There is no damage to the locking bolt. It's just the flash of the camera and the penetrating oil making it look that way. Its just stuck from years of not being cleaned properly by the previous owner over its 30 years of existence. As for the screw driver comment your right. I should have used a hammer and chisel instead.

Dremel tool . . .

[roland5color]

Originally Posted by Gunhacker

Comparing this diagram that Kernel Crittenden posted from the S&W armorers manual, and how far the locking bolt is retracted in the pic posted... it makes me wonder whether or not the bolt has over travelled a bit past the pin cutout and the front shoulder of the bolt is now wedged in place under the pin?.

That pin is not that difficult to distort, but for that to have happened, the bolt would have to of been forcibly driven past the stop cutout to get stuck. Hopefully you or someone else didn't hammer on the front end of the bolt with a punch trying to free it up when it started to bind.

How long had you had this gun? Did you just buy it and discovered that it has this problem, or has it been ok up to now and it started to exhibit difficulties before becoming stuck or did it just "appeared" out of the blue?

You may have no option but to send it back to S&W.

If you've already tried to drift that pin out and it isn't moving... I'd be willing to say that could very well be what's wrong, it's slightly bent (arched upwards) and allowed the top of the bolt to slip under the pin, jamming the bolt in that retracted position.

Now we're talking about some potential fun getting that pin out

edit: oh-oh... I just re-read your original post: "I used a small screw driver to gentle pry it back so I could open the cylinder and it's been stuck in that position since"

Me thinks you did what I think has happened.

I see what your saying gunhacker and it could be that the pin is bent a little. I've had the gun around 2 months or so. It's sticking since I got it. So I sprayed some cleaner in the weep hole to try and free it up. It just made it worse and caused it to stick open so that I couldn't get the cylinder open.
It only took a little help from the screw driver to get it open. I didn't pound on it. Or pry on it like I was trying to open a paint can. I know you guys don't know me or my background but I know not to force something like this open. Once I had the cylinder open I pushed on the locking bolt with my finger to see if it was now free. Well it went in but didn't come back out. So it was still moving after I got it open. As for the retaining pin it moves freely. I started to remove it but stopped thinking maybe I should try and free the locking bolt first just in case it had to be in the out position to remove the pin.
So tonight I will remove the retaining pin the rest of the way and use compressed air and penetrating oil to try and free it. Thanks again for everyones comments.

[roland5color]

I got the retaining pin out and it looks like new. Straight as an arrow. Now to get that darn locking bolt out . It has to just be full of crud that broke loose when I tried to clean it. It will be out by the end of the night lol.

[Gunhacker]

Good show! Can't imagine what all is holding it in place... I mean wow... I guess there's crud and then there's CRUD.

[scooter123]

If you have an electric engraver you can use that to Vibrate the pin. If you problem is simply crud a good soaking with Kroil and some vibration should have that pin "walking" out of that hole.

[roland5color]

Originally Posted by Gunhacker

Good show! Can't imagine what all is holding it in place... I mean wow... I guess there's crud and then there's CRUD.

I would guess it's 30 years of the second crud you speak of lol. I've used enough pb blaster to losen every bolt on a chicago tow truck. For those of you who have never worked on one that's a lot. Didnt even phase this crud.

[roland5color]

Originally Posted by scooter123

If you have an electric engraver you can use that to Vibrate the pin. If you problem is simply crud a good soaking with Kroil and some vibration should have that pin "walking" out of that hole.

I don't have an engraver unfortunately. I've never heard of Kroil. Where can I buy some? I'm going to try the hair dryer next and see if I can't get the heat to losen it up a bit.

[howiema]

That locking bolt is spring loaded don't lose the spring I think that is what is binding it up.

Just my .02

Pete

[roland5color]

Originally Posted by howiema

That locking bolt is spring loaded don't lose the spring I think that is what is binding it up.

Just my .02

Pete

Yeah I have to agree. I believe all that crud is jammed in the spring and possibly some rust in the bore to. If I could just get it to move enough to get a grip on it with some needle nose I could get it out. Maybe I'll throw it in the dryer and let it bang around for awhile

[Kernel Crittenden]

Dang. I was hoping once you got the pin out everything else would follow. I'm betting it's sand. Tiny grains of sand.

[roland5color]

Originally Posted by Kernel Crittenden

Dang. I was hoping once you got the pin out everything else would follow. I'm betting it's sand. Tiny grains of sand.

I was to kernel. Whatever is in there im going to patent it and sell it as an epoxy for metal lol.

[Gunhacker]

Well... your escapades prompted me to pull my M16-4 out which has a full underlug and weep hole like your 586... I checked the bolt and it's a bit slugglish, so I spayed in some CLP. It got better, so I decided to spray some into the weep hole... no-go. A strong flash light showed that sucker was plugged solid.

After some probing with a nylon "dental pick", I was pulling out stuff that, holly mother of God, looked like the solidified grease crud I used to scoop out of the grease traps in my cousin's restaurant.. yum. And this is with someone that has been pretty diligent when it comes to cleaning guns.

I stripped the jacket off of a wire twist tie, the kind the wife brings home holding the produce baggies closed. Was able to gently work it into to cavity that the weep hole leads into, and gently roto-rooter more of the solidified funk out.

Once I got it that cavity cleared out and injected in more CLP, I discovered that when I pushed the bolt in the movement pumped oil out the weep hole. Ah-ha... there is a relationship.

When I held the bolt in and pushed the end the "dental pick: in the weep hole and held it there, when I stopped pushing on the bolt, guess what... it stayed in that retracted position until I stopped pushing with the "dental pick", and the bolt popped back out.

So what it's worth, that might give you some clue to what you may need to do also, see if you have the same issue with that "weep hole cavity". That might be the source of the super crud (were past the plain crud stage) that's binding the spring and or bolt from moving.

[roland5color]

I wish it was that easy for me lol. My weep hole is clean as a whistle. The penetrating oil actually flows from the lock bolt end all the way through and out the weep hole. So my problem has to be past the weep hole on the rear of the pin where the spring rides. I'm sure glad that at least something good came out of this. Maybe others will check there's now and catch any crude before it jams up on them.

[roland5color]

Well I give up for tonight. Tomorrow is another day. I've learned to walk away over the years so that I don't damage something out of anger or from being tired. Tomorrow I'm going to tape the 586 to my saws all and cut some metal. I'm hoping all that vibration will work it loose.😜

[Gunhacker]

Originally Posted by roland5color

Maybe others will check there's now and catch any crude before it jams up on them.

Yep.... it sure opened my eyes, tomorrow night it's going to be "L-Frame" night for me, dragging out the multitude of 586's & 686's lurking in my safe, and do some "weep hole" inspections.

Why did typing that just make me feel like a proctologist???

Makes you wonder why the full underlug barrels have those holes and the older half lug barrels don't?

Seems like all they are good for is getting packed with crud.

[chief38]

I'd guess either a burr on the piece or a sharp end on the spring.

I just put a new Recoil Spring on my Colt 1911 this evening and the end of the spring was so sharp that it got stuck in the spring tube. A few seconds with an Arkansas Stone and it's now good to go.

[steelslaver]

I just looked at my one full lug gun and have a suggestion. Get a grease gun and ask for a needle tip. They are used to access difficult zerts and are used by pressing the needle tip against the zerts ball and pressing it in to fill with grease. Then take a piece of thick leather and use vice grips to clamp it over the pin holes. Then pump grease into the weep hole with the needle tip and it should force the lug out. Might be a little messy, but should work and any good solvent will clean up the grease.

Can't hurt to try and if you don't have a grease gun most hardware stores have small ones that take little tubes pretty cheap. You might get away without the needle by making a piece of leather with a small hole and using it as a gasket between the weep hole and the guns tip and with the gun trapped in position hold the gun gasket and grease tip tightly together. Grease guns put out a huge amount of pressure.

Good luck

[Waywatcher]

Originally Posted by Gunhacker

Yep.... it sure opened my eyes, tomorrow night it's going to be "L-Frame" night for me, dragging out the multitude of 586's & 686's lurking in my safe, and do some "weep hole" inspections.

Why did typing that just make me feel like a proctologist???

Makes you wonder why the full underlug barrels have those holes and the older half lug barrels don't?

Seems like all they are good for is getting packed with crud.

Half lug barrels (or no lug) have the 'weep hole' out the front which isn't a good option on full lug barrels.

If thinking about a weep hole makes you think about a proctologist, you probably should see one!

[roland5color]

Originally Posted by steelslaver

I just looked at my one full lug gun and have a suggestion. Get a grease gun and ask for a needle tip. They are used to access difficult zerts and are used by pressing the needle tip against the zerts ball and pressing it in to fill with grease. Then take a piece of thick leather and use vice grips to clamp it over the pin holes. Then pump grease into the weep hole with the needle tip and it should force the lug out. Might be a little messy, but should work and any good solvent will clean up the grease.

Can't hurt to try and if you don't have a grease gun most hardware stores have small ones that take little tubes pretty cheap. You might get away without the needle by making a piece of leather with a small hole and using it as a gasket between the weep hole and the guns tip and with the gun trapped in position hold the gun gasket and grease tip tightly together. Grease guns put out a huge amount of pressure.

Good luck

This is worth a try. Only thing is I'm not sure that enough grease can get in behind the lock bolt to push it out but will definitely give it a try.

[roland5color]

Well after trying every thing known to man and possibly alien life forms I gave up and sent the gun into S&W. Nah just kidding 😜. I did try every thing with no luck so I finally used my machinist skills to drill the locking bolt so that I could fit a drift into the end of it and twist and pull until it came out. Looks like the bolt is Gauld up from years of dirt and grim. I will now purchase a new spring and locking bolt and be back in business soon. Thanks for all the ideas and suggestions fellas. Excuse the dirty thumb nail I just finished changing out the fuel filter on my truck beore I did this lol.

[Ronald1]

Why didn't you send it back? S&W has a lifetime warranty and doing what you did voids any future waranty clams. Ron

[roland5color]

The gun is 30 years old and the only reason the part failed was because of previous owners neglect. Personally I don't believe that S&W should have to repair it. It was a simple easy fix and I didn't damage the weapon in any way. I just removed a defective part and I'm going to replace it with a good one. I haven't modified the gun in any way. I don't see how that voids the warranty but if it does so be it.

If anything else fails I will replace that as well. If I wanted a gun with a warranty I would have bought a new one. I guess it's just a personal problem that I have with people working on stuff that I can fix myself. Now if I bought a brand new gun and it had some horrible failure within a reasonable time after purchasing it then I would ask them to repair it.

[Ronald1]

Hello
I fully understand. I didn't mean or intend for my post to be rude or sarcastic and if it came across that way, I apologize. Ron

[roland5color]

Originally Posted by Ronald1

Hello
I fully understand. I didn't mean or intend for my post to be rude or sarcastic and if it came across that way, I apologize. Ron

No worries buddy. I didn't take it that way and my response wasn't ment to be either.