I was inspired by recent threads about the cylinder swap...decided to do my own with pictures. The barrel and cylinder gap seem fine. I will test fire it tomorrow. I do not have a small scale. Does anybody know how much weight this shaves off? I also switched to a Hogue Monogrip.



Here is the new titanium cylinder:


Pulling off the old cylinder:


Here is the new titanium cylinder...notice, I also changed the stock grips to a Hogue Monogrip.



:cheers:

nice, what did the cylinder cost ya if you dont mind me askin?

It was about $61.00 from Numrich Gun Parts. Bought it online on Friday night...was waiting for me when I got home from work today. Everything looks and feels great. I will punch paper with it tomorrow tp be sure that function is 100%.

It is not the most significant weight difference, but it is noticeable.

You just trying to save weight? I like the two-tone look. Is that screwdriver set a hollow-ground bit set? I've been looking for "the right" tools, but on Midway the different S&W bit sets don't mention being hollow-ground. Thanks...

I am not familiar with the term "hollow-ground," so the only thing I know to do is look at the box. It doesn't say anything about hollow-ground. Hope this helps.

Now that you mention it...the two tone look is not bad.

Instead of the sides contact the screw being tapered like a chisel, they are ground so that they are parallel to each other towards the tip. This way you get move contact service on the screw which help to reduce the chance of the screwdriver slipping and marring the screw.

Standard screw driver is make with a taper finish " taper from big to thin on the end, hollow ground look like a scoop of ice cream was tooken off eack side and the blade is the same thickest all the way down to end. Sorry for the typing - little doped up right now. Hope this helps .

I didn't mean to hijack your thread, friend :/ Sorry about that...you'll have to tell us how the Ti cylinder works out for ya

Not at all. I learned something new. I will post a report this evening when I get home from the range.

Why doesnt S&W just make one of these? They would sell like hotcakes! You just cut off almost 3 Oz. ! That is significant! and you will notice the difference in pocket carry.(or any carry for that matter)!
P.S. we have twins!

If anyone wants a Ti cyl. shoot me a PM. I bought too many...............Ti cyl. is GONE.

Why do I have this sudden urge to put my 642 on a diet?

It is well worth it! IMO. By just changing the cylinder you lose almost 2 ozs. That is the weight of (5) .38 cartridges. So basically it would be like carrying your 642 with no ammo in it. Then change to the bantam grips and lose another ounce over Uncle Mikes.

Here is my 642 titanium cylinder. I also replace the MIM trigger and hammer with forged parts. The scandium models have titanium pivot pins but they are chambered for .357 mag. The 642 with titanium cylinder is .38 plus P so the stock frame pins should be OK

Attached Images

	photo3.jpg (46.0 KB, 467 views)
	photo1.jpg (43.6 KB, 402 views)

Ok, as soon as I saw those pic's, I ordered a ti cylinder for my 442.
How hard is it to change?
Do I need special tools?
I've done the lock removal surgery, and the cylinder swap appears to be less invasive than that. Hopefully a novice, like myself, can do it too. Please fill me in.

It is pretty easy. You only need to remove the yoke screw which is the foremost screw on the right side of the frame. Then when you open the cylinder you can slide the yoke and cylinder off the front of the frame. I used the existing ejector rod and ratchet as it was already fitted to the gun. The ejector rod is left hand thread and you need to be careful not to damage it when unscrewing it. Use a gripping tool with jaws padded with leather, wood, or brass. Or better yet buy an ejector rod tool from Brownells ($22.00) which is made for the purpose. I used the vise portion of a plumbers pipe flaring tool padded with rubber to remove mine, but ordered the Brownells tool for next time.

Thanks Capn.

As soon as I get mine in, I'll be following your instructions.

I like the contrast of the titanium with the black finish of the frame. Also, the silver scratch, that runs the perimeter of the black cylinder, drives me nuts.

The weight difference will be an added bonus, as I pocket carry.

Oh also before you unscrew the ejector rod place empty cartridge cases in the cylinder. This prevents damaging the ejector star and rod from the torque of unscrewing. Post pictures when you are done!

With all the sad stories I've read about heavily used Ti cylinder cracking and/or otherwise biting the dust, I went the other way. Put a stainless steel cylinder in my 296 .44 Spl for practice and use the ti for serious social carry.

__________________
Jim
S&WCA #819

That looks familiar. How do those Ahrends feel? They sure are light, almost a full ounce less than the Uncle Mike's. Weighing different grips on a digital scale, the results were interesting.

Uncle Mike's boot grip - 2.1 oz.
PGS Hideout grip - 2.0 oz.
S&W logo boot grip 1.7 oz.
Ahrends R.B. smooth 1.2 oz.



Mine wasn't a simple swap. It required trimming back the yoke and fitting the headspacing and barrel/cylinder gap. Forum member tomcatt51 was heplful with his wisdom in replying to the following thread:

Questions On Fitting Ti cylinder to M442-2

__________________
NRA - All Day

Hey Capn,

Where did you find the forged parts?
What were the Costs?

Thanks again, I'll upload pic's when the surgery is complete.

Greg

I found the old style forged parts at Brownells. They still stock the trigger, but unfortunately they no longer stock the non-MIM hammer and I don't know another source. The trigger is part # 940-225-950. The trigger costs $43.28. It is grooved and 5/16" wide so it is not the best trigger for a combat model. If you type in the number on their website it will show you a good picture of it.

Very nice AllGlock. Very nice.

My initial range trip was a FAIL. The timing was off because the hammer would not fall every time. So, I used a file to remove metal from the ratchet and things were fine. I put about 100 rounds down range into a hole the size if my hand (not bad for a snub)

capnkirk, there's a forged trigger that's a smooth combat about .330" wide or you can grind and polish the grooves out of yours. Been there, done that. New forged parts are available on Gunbroker from MagnumMark. Search for his auctions by that name or the part name. Parts are available, don't give up. I have other sources also.

__________________
Jim
S&WCA #819

I should have just done that, but decided to fit the new ratchet myself. It wasn't too difficult. I just cut the ratchet profiles to look the same as the old ratchet.

Yes, they are avaiable if you know where to look, or sometimes get lucky.

Never being a fan of MIM parts, I dropped a flash chromed hammer and trigger in my M442 and the matte trigger looked real slick with the Ti cylinder, also threw on a forged blue thumb piece.

Then I decided this particular gun would get a pass on MIM, since it's purpose is to shave as much weight as possible. Replacing hollow MIM parts with heavier forged parts is counterproductive, IMO. Yes, it's only a matter of grams, but a few here and a few there add up. Even the factory practices this, substituting a Ti center pin for steel and shaving the already lightweight frame a little in non-critical areas.

YMMV

__________________
NRA - All Day

Looks good. Did you have any change in the cylinder gap? What was the gap after the cylinder change?

Most of the titanium cylinder/aluminum frame S&W's have titanium pivot pins in the frame. What material are the pivot pins in the 442 made of? I have heard they are aluminum. It seems incomprehensible that S&W would use aluminum for the pivot pins, yet the ones on mine do not attract a magnet. Now some types of stainless steel also do not attract a magnet. Does anyone here know what type of metal is used for the 442 pivot pins? Durability issues could potentially arise when a titanium cylinder is installed if the pins are aluminum as the lighter weight would increase recoil stress on the pivot pins. The factory titanium pins are used on scandium/aluminum models with titanium cylinders for increased durability. But these are chambered in .357. The 442 in .38 special may not need the titanium pins. Thoughts?

The gap is .005. That was a good fit. I had to take some metal off of the ratchet. In retrospect, I should have just used the original ratchet...but I decided to file down the new ratchet to match the profile of the original. It was a learning experience if nothing else. Glad that I did it. The gun weighed in at about 12 oz., maybe a tad lighter. I need an accurate scale.

That is an interesting question...I assume that they are aluminum. I don't think that it would be easy or worthwhile to mate any other material to the aluminum frame. As for durability...we"ll see how it goes.

Interesting idea Beagle, waiting for your range report.

I just got the Ti cylinder in today. (takes more than 2 weeks to deliver to Texas.)

I put it on just like your instructions Capn... easy as pie.

Thanks for the help.

The feel is completely different, and I like the contrast of the Ti on black...sweet.

I've posted the pic's...enjoy.

Attached Images

	DSCN0709.JPG (151.3 KB, 319 views)
	DSCN0711.JPG (149.2 KB, 285 views)
	DSCN0715.JPG (150.8 KB, 255 views)
	DSCN0719.JPG (152.8 KB, 291 views)

Well, my 642 Airweight TI conversion didn't go as smoothly.
The cylinder I got from Numrich is defective.

The hole that the yolk barrel and ejector run through is not square to the cylinder...ie - there is a large amount of run-out when the cylinder rotates.

I'm bummed, I don't want to order another just to find more of the same. Has anybody else had quality issues with these Numrich parts...any chance they are seconds?

BTW - I am a gunsmith, not that it makes me an expert on everything, but I can tell the difference between a bad part and a bent rod. - JM.

Shoots great...now. I had to sculpt the ratchets a bit to correct timing. Afterward, I realized that I could have just used the old ratchet with the new cylinder.

I thought they might be seconds, as the finish on them is random. They have alot of "handling" marks on them. Thats about all I noticed. I did two conversions, and they both shoot fine....

All you can do is call & send back for replacement confirming shipping is on them.

__________________
Jim
S&WCA #819

Good to know. I actually used the old ratchet/star, and the timing appears to be perfect. I'll have no qualms shooting it at the range. I'll report when I do.

I think they're new:
There was no scratch around the perimeter where the cylinder rotates...not until I dry fired it. Also, there are no powder rings from shooting, where the cylinder holes line up w/ the barrel.

The think finish is just proned to scratch and ding. I've noticed small scratches/marks from just cycling/dry firing. But I think it looks better than the silver scratch that the black stainless cylinder has.

I carried it in my pocket today, and it doesn't tug at my belt nearly as bad as it did before. The weight loss is definately noticeable.

My 442 is brand new, but that ti cylinder and Hogue mono-grip might be too much to resist....

looks great...post a range report this weekend

They do. 342 AirLite Ti factory refinished in PD black.

Correction, the did. The 342PD and Airlite Ti haven't been made in years.

__________________
Don't kiss smiling dogs!

I have an extra Ti .357 cyl from a 340 that I'd sell - send me a pm if interested.

I was just referring to any j-frame centennial with a ti cylinder. Personally, I'd like to see an alloy cylinder centennial j-frame.

Performance Center "one off", smith-wessonforum member GHEN.

Thanks to this thread I bought a ti cylinder as well. It will be for my 342 M&P. Basically the same gun as the 442 but with a scandium frame instead of aluminum alloy (about 1.5 ounce lighter). Still has a steel barrel/cylinder. With the ti cylinder I'm shooting for under 12 ounces!!

The 342 also has a slightly different (lighter) barrel, too. However, you will miss the extra 3 ounces when you shoot hot loads, I promise. When I shoot hot loads in my 642, it's difficult, but with the 342, it's like someone is hitting the end of the barrel with a baseball bat. The little sucker tries to get away every shot and it hurts my hand after a few.

Thanks to the op for posting this great looking conversion. I might be trying this out myself soon. Even though my wife took my 442 away from me... still she might enjoy it being lighter, or even better...it might make it too light, increasing recoil to an uncomfortable level...I might even get it back from her

yeah your right.. im hoping that the cylinder will just drop in without problems, so if it does I can switch back to the steel cylinder if I plan on putting a significant amount of rounds through it and keeping the ti cylinder for concealed carry or on duty

What kind of grips do you use? I went for looks with my first j-frame grip purchased and got a beautiful set of black ebony secret service wood grips and they shot just as you described - baseball bat to the bbl. The uncle mike's were better, but the best have been hogue j-frame bantams. I could literaly shoot all day with them no worries.

My second cylinder came in yesterday. This cylinder fitted with little fuss, and didn't have the defect my first cylinder had. The gun with bantom stocks weighs in at 12.2oz unloaded, 14.2 oz loaded with 5 Rem 110gr +P's.

Once I've put a few rounds through it, this gun will be replacing my m38-0 as my BUG. My 38-0 weighs 14.2oz unloaded. That's right, my new 642 "Airlite Ti" loaded weighs the same as my old m38 Airweight unloaded!

I'm a happy camper. - JM.