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02-22-2012, 10:37 PM
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The Glock stops here.
All right! I finally was able to corner my boss and get him to understand that I needed to carry a revolver to be in accordance with CLEET requirements. He already contacted the district office, and I'm going to turn in my Glock 22 tomorrow. I believe I'll be drawing a Smith & Wesson 686 in return. Yay-y-y-y-y-y-y!!
Yes, I am ready for all the "Six shooter, huh? Lot of old timers carry those."
ECS
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Luke 22:36
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02-22-2012, 10:42 PM
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I hope the boss gives you more then one round! Congrats..
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Life is good!
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02-22-2012, 10:46 PM
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Sounds like you're stepping up.
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02-22-2012, 10:57 PM
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You'll be much happier. Good for you!
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02-22-2012, 11:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MDMarauder
I hope the boss gives you more then one round! Congrats..
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Four speedloaders of .357 Mag, two speed strips of .38 Spl, and a loaded Model 37 in my pocket!
ECS
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Luke 22:36
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02-22-2012, 11:42 PM
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What ever you are more comfortable with is what you should be allowed to carry. Here's the Positives and Negatives of the two.
357 revolver -
Positives = More power (you typically don't need double taps), more penetration if needed (BG forget taking cover behind the wall), Greater accuracy at distance, One shot philosophy, Old school, better in winter with heavy clothes (greater FPS)
Negatives- Less capacity, greater muzzle flip, slower to get on target, requires your finger to operate the action so its typically slow for follow up shots, slower reloads
Glock Semi Auto -
Positives = Your Tacti-cool, High Capacity, lights & laser attachments, less likely to over penetrate, Faster follow ups, faster reloads
Negatives = Double taps needed?, less power, must rely on premium ammo to expand for one shot stops, less accurate at distances typically (unless your hickock45), Possable the winter clothes causes ammo to prematurely expand for less penetration.
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02-23-2012, 12:15 AM
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"CLEET"?
Is this some kind of 'equal rights' thing? If so I approve.
Welcome to the realm of the Dinosaur.
Yes, I'm called a Dinosaur by the plastic fantastics.
We Dinosaurs shoot groups, not patterns.
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02-23-2012, 01:52 AM
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We did the opposite in 1995: 686 to G22.
I always felt pretty well equipped with the revolver (and am more accurate with it as well), but I had to use what they handed me. The semi-autos definitely have their advantages, however.
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02-23-2012, 03:53 AM
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Although I like my 686 and the 357 magnum's performance, I would rather carry a Glock 22 for my self-defense sidearm. For an upgrade in ballistic performance over the 40 S&W in your Glock 22, ask for a Glock 21 in 45 ACP!
When was this "CLEET requirement" to carry a revolver last updated? Mid 1960s?
Edmo
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02-23-2012, 12:08 PM
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I fully support revolvers and want to own one soon but the Glock 22 is by far my favorite weapon. It is also the most accurate of the weapons I own!
(Please dont ban me lol)
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02-23-2012, 12:14 PM
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I don't understand how the Council on Law Enforcement Education and Training (CLEET) rules would cause you to have to carry a revolver unless you either chose only to qualify with a revolver, or failed to qualify with a semi-auto.
That's why I advise everyone to qualify with a semi-auto, then you have more choices.
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02-23-2012, 01:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OKFC05
I don't understand how the Council on Law Enforcement Education and Training (CLEET) rules would cause you to have to carry a revolver unless you either chose only to qualify with a revolver, or failed to qualify with a semi-auto.
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I chose to take the Armed Security Officer Course with a revolver. I used my 3 inch Model 13-3 and outshot everyone in my class during qualification. I was the only revolver shooter and beat out all the 9mm and .40 S&W shooters using Glocks, Berettas, S&W M&Ps, and Springfield XDs. No one brought a .45 ACP.
Quote:
That's why I advise everyone to qualify with a semi-auto, then you have more choices.
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According to CLEET regulations, if you want to have your choice of carrying a semi-automatic or a revolver, you have to take the class twice. It's not like the Concealed Carry class where you qualify with a semi-automatic then carry whatever you like.
ECS
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Luke 22:36
Last edited by elm_creek_smith; 02-23-2012 at 01:04 PM.
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02-23-2012, 01:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edmo
Although I like my 686 and the 357 magnum's performance, I would rather carry a Glock 22 for my self-defense sidearm.
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I wouldn't. I out shot all the bottom feeders with my old-fashioned "six-shooter."
Quote:
For an upgrade in ballistic performance over the 40 S&W in your Glock 22, ask for a Glock 21 in 45 ACP!
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That's like going from a 1 quart tupperware bowl to a 1½ quart tupperware bowl. It's still tupperware.
Quote:
When was this "CLEET requirement" to carry a revolver last updated? Mid 1960s?
Edmo
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Nope. You can carry a revolver or a semi-automatic if you take the class with one. If you want your choice, you have to take the class twice - once with each type. I personally think the "instructor's lobby" had something to do with that.
ECS
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02-23-2012, 05:45 PM
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I have both S&W revolvers and a Glock 22 so my opinion is,and that is just what it is, go with the Glock. As much as I love my Smith's, my Glock is lighter, has more 'firepower' and , do I dare say it, is more reliable. Pretty, nope, in fact one could make a case the Glock is butt ugly, but when the chips are down, that is what I am reaching for.
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02-23-2012, 05:50 PM
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Just be sure to pack extra ammo since you'll not be able to grab a mag from a fellow Officer in order to reload.
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ATI 1911a1, 4.25"
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02-23-2012, 06:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elm_creek_smith
Four speedloaders of .357 Mag, two speed strips of .38 Spl, and a loaded Model 37 in my pocket!
ECS
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I envy you. They would never go for that here, and i'm the range master!
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02-23-2012, 06:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elm_creek_smith
...
Yes, I am ready for all the "Six shooter, huh? Lot of old timers carry those."
ECS
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Heh-heh-heh ...
Riggs: "Six-shooter, huh?"
Murtaugh: "Mmm-hmm..."
Riggs: "Lotta old timers carry those."
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02-23-2012, 08:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blujax01
Heh-heh-heh ...
Riggs: "Six-shooter, huh?"
Murtaugh: "Mmm-hmm..."
Riggs: "Lotta old timers carry those."
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And tend to hit what they aim at! Dale
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02-23-2012, 08:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elm_creek_smith
...That's like going from a 1 quart tupperware bowl to a 1½ quart tupperware bowl. It's still tupperware...
ECS
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Tupperware is good...
All six of mine have all been extremely accurate, tough, and 100% reliable.
Edmo
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02-24-2012, 08:35 AM
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Good for you. Carry what you feel most comfortable with.
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But then, what do I know?
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02-24-2012, 10:56 AM
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While I much prefer revolvers for my private use, I would never go back to carrying a revolver on duty.
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02-24-2012, 05:33 PM
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>>I fully support revolvers and want to own one soon but the Glock 22 is by far my favorite weapon<<
My sentiments exactly. My G22 is still my "go to" gun.
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02-24-2012, 06:17 PM
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Nostalgia is great and everything, but come on.
If I were working the streets with the kinds of slugs that are walking around among us now a days I wouldn't want just 6 rounds before I have to reload.
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02-24-2012, 08:29 PM
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Welcome to the forum, You will find alot of great accurate information in this forum, Take a look in the ammo forum and do some research on Internal, External and Terminal ballistics.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silver_Bullet_00
What ever you are more comfortable with is what you should be allowed to carry. Here's the Positives and Negatives of the two.
357 revolver -
Positives = More power (you typically don't need double taps), more penetration if needed (BG forget taking cover behind the wall), Greater accuracy at distance, One shot philosophy, Old school, better in winter with heavy clothes (greater FPS)
Terminal ballistic performance in short is dictated by the weight, configuration and construction (I.E. Bonded) of a projectile not what type of weapon it is fired from. Accuracy is dependant upon the skillset of the individual as the OP stated he was "topgun" in the semi-automatic pistol dominated class.
Negatives- Less capacity, greater muzzle flip, slower to get on target, requires your finger to operate the action so its typically slow for follow up shots, slower reloads
Less capacity yes, percieved recoil is dictated by the type of loading and caliber as well as the overall weight of the weapon and barrel length. The muzzle flip of a 4" barrel K,L or N frame .357 magnum revolver is minimal even with +P loadings, the same would of course not be true out of a
1 7/8" barreled J frame airweight.
The speed of weapon presentation from the holster to on target is dependant upon the individuals training and skill level not the type of weapon carried. As far as the speed one can achieve with revolver follow up shots and reloads check out the Jerry Miculek video I linked below, and again these skills are dependant upon the individuals manual dexterity and training.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLk1v5bSFPw
Glock Semi Auto -
Positives = Your Tacti-cool, High Capacity, lights & laser attachments, less likely to over penetrate, Faster follow ups, faster reloads
Tacticool is in the eye of the beholder, Capacity and Ease of reloading is why the Semi-Automatic Pistol has become the Law enforcement Standard. Advancments in Materials and Manufacturing techniques have made distinct improvments in overall ergonomics and the modularity of the modern semi auto pistol.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CAFxg...eature=related
Overpenetration (See terminal ballistics) is not determined by Semi-Auto or Revolver.
Negatives = Double taps needed?, less power, must rely on premium ammo to expand for one shot stops, less accurate at distances typically (unless your hickock45), Possable the winter clothes causes ammo to prematurely expand for less penetration.
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Need for Double Taps has nothing to do with types of weapons and everything to do with shot placement and terminal ballistics. Accuracy as stated before is dictated by the individual and their skillset. Any Semi-Automatic or Revolver self defense/law enforcement ammunition is going to be a so called "premium ammunition" due to quality control standards, configuration and construction.
The most important aspect to consider when selecting a weapon is the simplest rule which you initially stated....................
CARRY AND USE WHAT YOU ARE MOST COMFORTABLE WITH, unfortunatly some LE agencies do not allow their personell this option.
Last edited by BigBoku; 02-24-2012 at 08:38 PM.
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