I'm thinking about getting a J-frame to carry. I was wondering if it was worth getting a scandium frame versus an aluminum frame. I would stick to a .38+P and really do not want a 357. What barrel length would be highly recommended? I currently carry the LCP and I like the size and weight of that and my goal is getting something similar but in a revolver. I want to get something I can carry and not worry about the finish. Pocket or IWB is the way I would be carrying. How are the DAO triggers versus the standard triggers? Their is shrouded and non shrouded as well. I just do not know where to begin. This is all new to me when it comes to carrying a revolver.

Thanks, James

Look into the Model 642 or 442. Very popular for what you are looking for.

I agree re: 442/642 which is the stainless finish, better for warmer weather carry. You can spend a great deal extra on the titanium frames but you really only save a couple of ounces. If you don't plan on using .357 I don't see the need for spending the extra money. I carry IWB or pocket and don't notice the difference in weight. You can spend the money you save on extra range ammo or a second 442/642 for a NY Reload.

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Old Cop
LEO (Ret.)

Well put!!
Its a carry, Finish what finish?

I agree with the others the 442/642 is the way to go. If it's a concealed carry gun, you'll only need double action anyway. Having the hammer enclosed prevents snagging the hammer spur during the draw stroke. I carry a 442 daily either in a pocket holster or owb depending on how I'm dressed.

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If you currently have an LCP and like it, why not get an LCR? I've replaced most of my J-frames with LCRs because of their smooth, light trigger pull. I carry N-frames (327SC and 627 PC UDR) most of the time. When I want someting smaller and lighter I carry one or two LCRs in 38 Spl +P.

I carry a 442 IWB (Appendix) when carried as a primary with a BUG being an LCP in weak hand pocket. Sometimes the 442 is the BUG carried in an ankle holster, with the primary being a 3" 1911 IWB at about 4:00
The point is, the 442 is always carried.

I don' t know that the added weight savings of the scandium is worth the cost if you're shooting .38s. That said, the others who have suggested the 442/642 are offering good advice. I have fired a Ruger LCP, and even took it back to 25 yards to see how it did. I fired something like five rounds and hit a torso target five times with it, but that was slow fire and the sights are a bit hard to line up. I can't really say that the J-frame snubbies and the LCP are comparable. The J-frames are a lot more accurate than most shooters realize, while the LCP would be a BUG's BUG, in my opinion. The best way to develop proficiency with a J-frame is to work with it and dry fire a lot. Get comfortable with the trigger and be able to press it straight to the rear without disturbing the front sight picture every time will make you an accurate shooter when live ammunition is applied.

I thought about the LCR and I love Ruger's but for me I have a personal requirements. I believe that all revolvers should be made out of metal and all 1911's should be as well. It is a personal preference. I already have a polymer gun and that is the LCP. I also think Smith makes the best snub-nosed revolvers on the planet. The LCR weighs 13.5 oz and the 442/642 weigh 15oz. My LCP weighs 10oz with the Crimson Trace so I rather have an all metal revolver. The 340 only weighs 13.3oz but is significantly more than the LCR so I can only compare the weight between the two because of the vast difference in price.

How is the trigger pull on the DAO? Is it a shorter stroke to shoot faster? Never fired one before in a revolver. I tried carrying compact polymer guns and I do not like them. Too bulky and heavy, just not my thing. I always had a thing for revolvers especially j-frames.

James

I'm only comparing weight and size of the j-frames to the LCP. I know the revolver will be bigger and I expect that, just wanted to get something close to the size and weight of the LCP. Also I wanted to step it up a notch in firepower as well. I have 6+1 of the .380 right now but with the revolver, I can run .38+P with 5 shots and ballistics as you know favor the .38.

James

You might like the Airweights for concealed carry. I carry. Model 37, and a model 38 hamerless in a Kramer T-shirt holster. They're so light, you forget they are fhere.

THAT is what I'm looking for. When I carry my LCP I forget it is on me They do not make the 38 anymore, do they?

From personal experience with a 442 rusting (on the yoke's inside surface) if I didn't wipe it down every night with a silicone cloth, I would ONLY consider stainless or other non-carbon-steel guns for daily IWB or pocket carry. I switched to a 638 - love the shrouded hammer for fun at the range but no risk of snagging on the draw, and have never had a hint of rust despite carrying it IWB daily and NOT wiping it down every night. Like rockyrider, I forget it's there most of the time.

The best training tool for working on your double action trigger pull is a Crimson Trace laser grip. You probably will be surprised how much that red dot moves around as you pull through the trigger arc, but because you can see it on every trigger pull, you can work on getting better. I have the 405 but if given the chance to do it over I'd pick the 305. Both cover the backstrap, but the 405 is VERY thin and not very comfortable to practice with, especially on aluminum framed guns. I think the 305 would be much more comfortable to shoot, and probably not too much harder to conceal.

Since I already had it hosted, here are the
305's on the top and 405's on the bottom.

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Ogy

Here is the light and the superlight. 37 and a 342Ti. Mix and match. Which ever feels right at the moment.
Stu

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My 642 is my travel gun in a nice old cross draw from DeSantis. I love Airweights and presently have a 642 and 637.

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John

try this thread

concealing a J-frame

A 340PD loaded with Corbon DPX 110 +P's
in a Mike Pocket Holster is about as good as it gets
for pocket carry.

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I carry model 36 3" Square butt. I like the thin grip, it's easy to find and quick to grab and pull. The 3" barrel gives me a little better sight radius. I carry it IWB. I don't worry so much about +P ammo, there's not a lot of difference between standard pressure and +P in a snubby.
The new modern grips are great for the range but the old school grips are quicker on the street. The only problem with the model 36 is that the new ones cost and arm and a leg. The good news is that S&W made tens of thousands of these little guns and you can find them lightly used for good prices.

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Have Gun Will Carry

Does S&W still have issues with their airweights corroding? I remember seeing somewhere on here the coating coming off and the aluminum starting to corrode. I have been pricing the 442/642 and they are around $400-$500, does that sound right?

James

One or the other in my Nemesis for EDC....M&P340 or 340PD.

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GA Carry member
Vietnam Vet

I like the 442 in the pocket because its backstrap is black. Hides well. Mine rubbed some of the black finish off in my desantis ankle holster.

If i were to buy again i would look for a 638 or 438. They are funny looking but you can shoot them DA or SA with the low profile hammer.

Ive never had good luck shooting my 442 beyond 15 yards. It is the ultimate "get off me gun."

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MP40 442 SHIELD9 SHIELD40 MP22

I agree with using a laser as a trigger pull training aid. However, I liked the Pachmayr compact grips on my 442, so I installed a Laserlyte side mount laser. That way I can keep the grips I like and have a laser. Since I don't rely on the laser for aiming, having the actuation button in a little more of a inconvenient position isn't a factor. It is fun putting a hole where the red dot glows at the range.

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I would get the 642 because it is probably more resistant to corrosion. Carry in a pocket holster and use +P ammo for carry and occasional familiarization. Do all other practice with whatever standard 38 Special ammo you can find.

Get a good quality pocket holster, such as the one from Elite Survival Systems:

Elite Pocket Holsters: EliteSurvival.com

Or, if you want more versatility, get the Elite clip on holster, and then you can use it as IWB with the clip or take the clip off and use it as a pocket holster:

Inside The Waistband Clip Holster : IWB Holsters : EliteSurvival.com

Don't forget a speed loader such as the HKS or Safariland.

I know the Crimson Trace grips are not cheap. Does this one bolt to the side cover and how much do they go for? I like the Pach grips as well.

James

Well, you won't get any argument from me about the Pachmayr Compac grips. IMHO they're the best compromise out there between shooting comfort and concealability. That's what I'd be likely to carry daily if I didn't love the laser and the instant-on switch of the CT design. Much as I love Magnas with one of my BK grip adapters (shameless plug) I find I just shoot better with more comfortable grips.

I've only handled the CT 305 grips on store displays, but the last time I grabbed one it sure felt good. It sort of reminded me of the Compacs, although not quite as deep front to back. But the same cushy backstrap and room for the pinky finger. I am being SORELY tempted - if I see 'em on sale I'll probably have to get a set.

It does bolt to the side plate with the included hardware. Just be sure to read the instructions concerning zeroing in the laser. They're on sale at Midway this month.
LaserLyte Side-Mount Laser Sight S&W J Frame Taurus (All Revolvers)

The Model 642 is what I recommend.

1. Get some grips that fit your hand well.
2. Buy a bunch of practice ammo (not +P!)
3. Dry fire the gun a lot!

I would encourage you to shoot the gun a bunch before spending big money on laser grips. You might want to consider either having S&W do an action job on the gun or, if you are mechanically inclined, installing the Apex spring kit.

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Centennial Every Day

Another vote here for the 638. I started with a Ruger LCP and it was great for hiding in my pocket. Shooting, not so much. No matter how I held it the trigger guard hit my finger everytime I fired it. After 1 mag I was done for that range trip. Since I didn't like shooting it, I didn't practice with it and since I didn't practice with it I couldn't expect to get very good with it. Therefore a change was in order. Went to the LCR. Fired exactly ONE cylinder and traded it the same day. Just wasn't for me. Next up was the Scandium framed M&P 340. Loved the weight, loved the XS big dot sight, couldn't hit squat with it. Went to the 638 and what a difference. I know it's only slightly heavier than the 340, has cruder sights, is uglier than me in the morning, yet shoots like a dream for me. I can actually hit what I'm aiming at, enjoy shooting it at the range and the difference in price bought a LOT of primers and powder. I wouldn't trade mine for anything. In a front pocket it's a joy to carry and no one has ever made me with it, even in my everyday slacks and sportcoat or suits.

I have a 360 and the keltec P3AT identical to the LCP. I had the same idea you did. I found the 360 used for close to what a new airweight cost and have the option to shoot 357 mag. It is no fun to shoot +P and 357 mag feels like you caught a baseball bare handed. With the exception of the trigger finger slap from the 380 it is much easier to shoot and carry in the pocket. I personally think there is a marginal gain in 38 over 380 in a short barrel. Get some good ammo and learn to shoot the 380 accurately or get a Kahr in 9mm. Buffalo Bore makes some hot 380 as well. I will say the 360 is very solid and tight. I get no blow back of particles and the shells eject nicely. Actually surprised me how such a light weight gun can take that abuse. The revolver does offer a reliability advantage when exposed to dirt and lint like when carried in the pocket. I carry the Keltec or my NAA 22mag in deep cover, the 360 when I feel the need for more firepower or when I have large pockets. If I IWB carry I use the G27 with a spare G22 mag

After much debate, I ordered a 638!
Haven't seen it yet.......
My decision came from a thread here similar to this one, great stuff!!

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Criminals don't register guns.

Knowledgeable and discerning individuals go with the 638. Great choice! It is my go-to for casino visits.

Kaaskop49
J-hound extraordinaire

I really like my 340sc with either 125gr medium velocity .357 or 135gr .38+P gold dots. It is very light and does not sag in my pocket. I also have a 442 that is a great gun but just a tad heavier. They would both serve me well and are sometimes carried together depending on where I'm going. Of course in the winter with extra clothing a .45 or 9mm work well too. The J-Frame is the ultimate deep concealment piece in the warmer weather. IMHO

642, pocket carry is the way to go. As others have stated, the slightly lighter weight of a Scandium gun is not worth the much greater price. No need for 357 chambering. $400 is a very good price on a 642 these days; shop around.

I'd get a 642 as the scandium guns are way too much money just to gain the ability to shoot .357 magnum which hardly anyone does. I had a 340 M&P and it was so expensive that I was completely OCD about the finish getting scratched etc., plus I hated the night sight which only added to the price.

I also would insist on getting on without the internal lock. I've read about way too many incidents of spontaneous locking/lock failure, especially with the small light guns. The lock is especially silly on the Centennial frames since the locked flag/tab can't even pop up/be visible when locked.

Irregardless, I would not get one with an exposed hammer(chiefs) or even shrouded hammer(bodyguard) as it will serve no purpose and actually could hinder you. Get something with a fully enclosed hammer(centennial) like the 642/442. Here's why...

1. Snubs are close quarter personal defense weapons, not hostage stand-off sniper rifles or competition target guns so there is no need to cock it for a precise shot. Plus cocking a revolver in a crisis situation is flat out irresponsible and dangerous(accidental discharges) when your nervous, scared and adrenaline charged as you would be in a real defense situation. Plus No exposed hammer removes any prosecutorial accusations that you intentionally cocked the weapon creating a hair trigger. It's just overall safer and less to worry about, especially if you pocket carry.

2. You can take a higher grasp on the Centennials compared to the other S&W J models effectively lowering the bore axis giving you more control and grip options.

3. The Centennial line has a smoother trigger pull in double action than the other Smiths J's do.

4. You can effectively fire from inside a jacket pocket or if the gun was otherwise entangled in clothing with an enclosed hammer and it is also more reliable is someone is trying to grab it and disarm you, whereas an exposed hammer would get snagged and jammed. A real possibility if a self-defense scenarios was close quarters and involved grappling.

5. For pocket carry, the enclosed hammer prevents lint and other debris from getting into the action.

442 !!!!!!!

My 1st wheel gun!! Adding to a M&P .40 FS and a .40c, for just those certain occasions..........

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Criminals don't register guns.

All hail the correct J frame.

That looks like it!!!

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Criminals don't register guns.

Model 637 Airweight with the matt silver finish in 38 special and 2 inch bbl. has been working well for me since 2005. I carry as you propose to do and finish is holding up well. It does show some wear along the edges but it's been carried for 8 years now. Tried all sorts of semi-auto's , they were all problematic in one way or another....J-frame in 38 spcl. has come to the top as best for me. Carries easily and is shootable, best of all , reliability can not be bettered.

Gary

gwpercle, thanks for the long range/time frame update. That helps a newbie out.

Finish wear is not an issue for me, the kydex holsters on my 40's shows some "marks" on the slide. As much as I love them, they are not display pieces, they are tools. If I ever decide on 1 of those high $ numbers, then it will come with a wooden case and never see a round through it!!!!

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Criminals don't register guns.

I REALLY like my 442. I pocket carry in a Nemesis holster. I also have a 360, but in 38 +P. The exposed hammer limits it to OWB carry in cooler weather, with more/thicker outer garments providing camoflage. The 442 is my primary choice 24/7/365.

Forgot about this thread. I know have a 442. I installed a set of Hogue Tamer grips on it and I can now get three fingers on it. I bought it used from a member here. It was cheaper than buying it used anywhere else and it was in like new condition.

James

I recommend a 642 or two...

It has the best MIM barrel out there.

Edmo

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TRUTH: Don't delete my posts!

I have had a 442 , 642 , 37, and always end up coming back to my faithful, heavier, model 60. I just like a heavy gun to absorb the recoil a little better. Getting soft in my old age.

No one had recommended the 442 Pro Series. It has the more durable back anodized frame with a stainless barrel and cylinder that are PVD coated, very durable and corrosion resistant finish. Also factory cut for moon clips.

The 442/642 is the most reasonably priced ready-to-carry (pretty much) self-defense revolver out there. You can find them used for $300-350, and new for around 400. That said, while the airweights are great for pocket or ankle carry, I don't think they have an advantage for belt carry. I carry A-IWB and my steel or stainless Chiefs carry just as easy as my airweight.
Lastly FWIW I prefer a bobbed Chief to the Centennials. Don't know why, I just do.