frame size comparison: Ruger six/Smith K

Looking at a Ruger Speed Six and from searching here it -appears- that the frame size of the Ruger lies somewhere between a J+ to a K- ???

Thanks in advance to anyone who can provide info

gsn said:

Looking at a Ruger Speed Six and from searching here it -appears- that the frame size of the Ruger lies somewhere between a J+ to a K- ???

Thanks in advance to anyone who can provide info

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I have a original Security Six bought in 1972 (4")and it fits holsters for K frame Smith's very well.

Yep....

Same size IMO. Ruger designed them to fit in the K-frame holsters that the police were using at the time. Ruger probably figured that it would be a good selling point to LE. They even use the same speed loaders. The Rugers are slightly stronger due to different construction which eliminates the side plate and uses a slightly thicker top strap. The Six series of guns has stood the test of time, and I wish Ruger would re-introduce them again. I believe that there is a market for them in this day and time.

I had a Ruger Security Six for a few years. It is close in size to the K frame but K frame speed loaders don't work very well. Neither do the L frame speed loaders. It uses the same speed loaders as the Colt Mark III's. They are nice revolvers. The only reason I sold mine was because I got a 66 4" and a friend wanted the Ruger.

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I have had three Security sixes and still have one. Nice revolvers and I always used K frame holsters for mine. I don't know if it is true but I have read somewhere that Ruger lost money on them and there were manufacturing difficulties is why they were phased out for the GP100. Can't say how much truth there is in that .

Thank you all for the info.

Does anyone know if it is true (I have sent an email but will have to wait a few days or so for the reply) that Ruger has bailed out on support for the Six series, or for that matter most of the guns they have made a mere 30 years or so ago?

S&W1006 said:

I had a Ruger Security Six for a few years. It is close in size to the K frame but K frame speed loaders don't work very well. Neither do the L frame speed loaders. It uses the same speed loaders as the Colt Mark III's. They are nice revolvers. The only reason I sold mine was because I got a 66 4" and a friend wanted the Ruger.

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At one time I owned a SS 4" Security Six and a 4" 66 ND, same speed loader worked perfect on both of them.

bearman49709 said:

At one time I owned a SS 4" Security Six and a 4" 66 ND, same speed loader worked perfect on both of them.

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I use the Safariland Comp 2 and the K frame version wouldn't push in far enough to release. The HKS might work.

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Got a very prompt reply back from Ruger, they have bailed on all service for the Six series with the only offer being a replacement gun at a 'discounted' price.

Don't get why they don't want to know anything about a gun that was made not all that long ago-their previous products should have very very little value.

Unless of course Smith operates the same way??

gsn said:

Got a very prompt reply back from Ruger, they have bailed on all service for the Six series with the only offer being a replacement gun at a 'discounted' price.

Don't get why they don't want to know anything about a gun that was made not all that long ago-their previous products should have very very little value.

Unless of course Smith operates the same way??

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Ruger sold all of their remaining parts inventory when they moved their revolver plant to New Hampshire from Connecticut. Remington sold off all the Marlin parts after they purchased the company and moved production. Unfortunately, this is very common these days, with firearms, appliances, equipment and even automobiles.

I've owned my police service six w/ 2 3/4" barrel since 1976. Never needed one part yet. I own a security six w/6" barrel also. I still own both I'll never part with my rugers.

For Ruger to abandon guns made as recently as '88 is outrageous-no expensive orphans for me.

Perhaps I should have typed that Ruger abandoning their -customers- is outrageous.

I've been partial to Ruger products since I shot my first .22 Single Six over 4 decades ago. Ive owned several including 10/22s, Super Blackhawks, Gp100, SP 101, Sec Six, Speed Six, in calibers from .22, .38, .357, and .44 mag. I've enjoyed them all, parts are readily available though I haven't broken one with normal use. There may not be an option to send one back to the factory for repair at this point, but there will be at least one Ruger, probably several, to be handed down when I take the big dirt nap.

The Ruger's are built like a tank, made to last. Buy Two, that way you always have spare parts. But one thing is for sure you don't hear much about one breaking. I have a family of Ruger's and a larger family of Smiths. Not a lot of collector value in ruger's like there is in Smith and wesson. IMO.

One more thing at least ruger sells a paddle lock with their guns and doesn't mess them up with an internal lock system.

gsn said:

Perhaps I should have typed that Ruger abandoning their -customers- is outrageous.

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Perhaps you should check on S&W's support of their 3rd gen auto, which came AFTER Ruger stopped making their SS series revolvers.

In terms of sales, marketing, consumer preferences---a whole host of reasons--once the L frame Smith/GP 100 frame Ruger were introduced, Smith and Ruger basically abandoned the K-frame sized revolvers.

Although Smith still makes some K-frame guns, try finding any in stores or ordering them. For all the love affair for the Model 19 on this forum, where are the Classic 19s? The 586 became a Classic model, however---the "Practical Python."

gsn said:

Looking at a Ruger Speed Six and from searching here it -appears- that the frame size of the Ruger lies somewhere between a J+ to a K- ???

Thanks in advance to anyone who can provide info

Click to expand...

The Six series frame is better described as being between the K and L frame, although much closer in weight to the K frame.

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The K frame .357 magnum revolvers were designed in an era where officers practiced with .38 Special and then carried .357 magnum, with the result that most of them were shot the vast majority of the time with .38 Special.

However, in the mid to late 1960s many police departments got sued for "under training" their police officers and most police departments and law enforcement agencies switched to training with .357 Magnum loads.

At the same time, 125 gr loads became very popular with law enforcement, and with about 25% more slow burning colloidal ball powder under them compared to a 158 gr load, they produced commensurately more throat erosion in the relatively thin forcing cones of the Model 19, etc.

This led to a number of cracked forcing cones in these K frame .357s. It was a low number, but none the less enough to be considered a problem.

That's when Ruger got on board with the Six series DA revolvers, building them in a K frame sized package but with a stronger frame and heavier forcing cone to avoid the issues that were appearing in the Model 19, 13, etc.

S&W's response was the L frame revolver, using a K grip frame with a slightly heavier frame and forcing cone.

I don't have the measurements handy (I've posted them before) but in general the frame height and cylinder diameter differences between the K frame and Six series revolvers are on the order of .05" and the Six series revolvers will usually fit a K frame holster with no issues.

The L frame revolvers tends to be that much again larger, and in many cases they will still fit a K frame holster.

There is a fair amount of weight difference between the K and L frame, but not as much as you'd think between the K frame and Six series revolvers, when all other factors are controlled for.


Top to bottom on the left are a 2 1/2" S&W Model 686+ (L frame revolver), 2 3/4" Ruger Speed Six, and a 2 1/2" S&W Model 66 (K frame revolver). Top to bottom on the right are a 3" Ruger SP101 and a 3" S&W Model 60.




Weights (unloaded and loaded)

Model 60 = 23.35 oz, 25.64 oz
SP101 = 27.09 oz, 29.35 oz
Model 66 = 34.18 oz, 36.90 oz
Speed Six = 34.81 oz, 37.53 oz
Model 686+ = 36.90 oz, 40.07 oz.

Thus, even with a 1/4" longer barrel, the Speed Six weighs only 0.6 oz more than the S&W K frame Model 66, when both are wearing the same model Pachmayr Compact grip.

The Speed Six is about 2 oz lighter than the L frame 686. Even if you add the extra weight of the Security Six's adjustable rear sight and larger front sight, it's still no heaver than a comparable L frame revolver.

That's significant as the Speed Six has a heavier forcing cone that holds up to full power .357 Magnum loads much better than the K frame .357 revolvers, which is why S&W developed the L frame revolvers in the first place.

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In terms of overall feel, the trigger on the Ruger revolvers feels more mechanical as you feel the hand and bolt engage more than you do on a S&W.

Ruger used injection molded frames and fire control parts and as such the fire control parts tend to be much larger/heavier than on a K-frame. On the plus side however, the Ruger frames and fire control parts are very durable and it's almost unheard of to find a Ruger with broken or non serviceable fire control parts.

In terms of actual trigger weights, both S&W and Ruger revolvers from that era vary a bit, but the Ruger revolvers vary more than the S&Ws. In both brands you can find examples with exceptionally good triggers, and you can find some that are not so hot.

Ruger replaced the Six series DA revolvers with the GP 100, which added a crane lock. It's arguably stronger, but then again it's arguably overkill as no one was been breaking the Six series revolvers in the first place.

So is member gsn going to puke on every thread with his anti-Ruger rants?

Back on topic, yes, Ruger Six Series double actions work and fit fine in holsters designed for K Frame Smiths.

And GP100's match well in the L Frame designed holsters too.