.44 spl. snub-nose expansion: M69

American1776 · Apr 30, 2020

I'm no expert. I love my M69 2.75" barrel.

From my reading about .44 spl, the typical factory ammo velocities from a snub are very low velocity. 600-750 ft/s range. It seems that many hollowpoints, even softer lead, do not reliably expand at these velocities.

I figure since I carry my M69 to double as both 2 and 4 legged defense in my somewhat rural area (the occasional large and aggressive dog, or a coyote or the rare black bear), a wadcutter or even FMJ round in the 900 ft/s range might as well work best.

I just got some Underwood .44 spl. which lists a 245 gr. FMJ flat point @ 950 ft/s. Even if it loses velocity with the snub, that'll still put out a 245 grain flat nose slug at .45 auto velocities.

This doesn't seem like a bad option, given that factory .44 spl loads are typically anemic and don't expand.

Thoughts on the .44 spl on just getting a heavy flat-nosed bullet at moderate velocities?

Thanks.

Groo01 · Apr 30, 2020

Groo here
I also have one.
I have shot it with full pressure 240gr loads [Magtec]
I find the gun works just as well with keith 44 spec loads or lighter.
I like the GT 190 gr SWC Hp bullet for smaller things and GT says
the hp will work at 700fps or faster "impact" speeds.
Also , a WC at 700 to 800 should handle most SD or
things up to big dog just fine...

Shark Bait · Apr 30, 2020

Buffalo Bore make some nice 44 Special loads that my 69 really likes

ContinentalOp · Apr 30, 2020

My own preference is for HP ammo, but my primary concern is 2-legged attackers.

I don't have a .44 Special revolver, but have always wanted one. If I did, I would look hard at Buffalo Bore's 190gr LSWCHP, which hits about 1,000fps from a 3" barrel. The bullet is supposedly designed to expand at velocities as low as 750fps.

Not my first choice because it's a deep penetrating round, but BB also makes a 200gr hardcast WC that gets about 950fps from a 3" barrel. Might be a good option for a woods gun.

Biggest downside is that BB ammo is not cheap.

Just my opinion.

Just out of curiosity, is there any particular reason why you're not considering .44 Magnum ammo?

American1776 · Apr 30, 2020

ContinentalOp said:
My own preference is for HP ammo, but my primary concern is 2-legged attackers.

I don't have a .44 Special revolver, but have always wanted one. If I did, I would look hard at Buffalo Bore's 190gr LSWCHP, which hits about 1,000fps from a 3" barrel. The bullet is supposedly designed to expand at velocities as low as 750fps.

Not my first choice because it's a deep penetrating round, but BB also makes a 200gr hardcast WC that gets about 950fps from a 3" barrel. Might be a good option for a woods gun.

Biggest downside is that BB ammo is not cheap.

Just my opinion.

Just out of curiosity, is there any particular reason why you're not considering .44 Magnum ammo?

Thanks for the suggestions. BB and Underwood make comparable loadings.

My carry round was the Winchester Silvertip .44 magnum (210 gr. @ 1250). I shot 20 rounds of it at the range. It's hard hitting.

I'd prefer to have a .44 load to carry when I think the magnums are a little too much. I also think the specials are easier to make followup shots with. Plus, they don't beat up the gun.

ContinentalOp · Apr 30, 2020

American1776 said:
I'd prefer to have a .44 load to carry when I think the magnums are a little too much. I also think the specials are easier to make followup shots with. Plus, they don't beat up the gun.

I can understand that.

Back when I had steel K-frames, a 3" 65 and a 2" 64, I compared both of BB's FBI loads, the 158gr LSWCHP in both standard pressure and +P. I could handle the +P loads fine, but I did notice I had faster follow-up shots with the standard pressure version. I stuck with the standard pressure version for that reason.

lrrifleman · Apr 30, 2020

American1776,

I was in a dilemma between a 69 and a 629 3", and I ended up putting a 629 on layaway. While it is Magnum capable, my intention is to fire Specials almost exclusively.

My intention is to quench cast a Lyman 240-245gr SWC and use the old Skeeter load. I see three advantages to the cast SWC:
1) the flat bullet metplat can induce a high degree of debilitating shock,
2) the SWC bullet design punches a nice clean hole to facilitate blood loss,
3) if the cast SWC hits bone, it has an increased chance of shattering bone, which could neutralize a threat within seconds depending on bullet placement.

Honestly, I will take a Special over a Magnum almost any day, since a hit with a Special can be more disabling than a near miss with a Magnum!

Warren Sear · Apr 30, 2020

Pretty hard to go wrong with a semi-wad cutter of standard weight for the caliber. It needn't be hard or soft; whatever you have on hand is fine. A good stiff charge of (Unique) powder.

I am not sold on the concept of hollow point ammo being needed for .41 to .45 caliber handguns.

The SWC has a long and proven track record.

torizus · Apr 30, 2020

If there s just one more handgun I want, it is the 69.
Haven't looked into it in depth but I am seeing just one barrel length under 4" and that is the 2,75", am I correct ?

Having seen many pics, that 2.75" at times appears to be a full lug,other times not. Is there some design changes on the barrel configuration and ejector housing since its initial release ?

Definitely gotta have one,cant convince myself that either of two 624's I have or the 629 mountain are good enough because they just aren't L frames.

44Spl is my only round also,both in 44 & 44 mag brass.

Borderboss · Apr 30, 2020

There was a good discussion only recently on this subject, talking about ammo for the M69. You can find it here.

S&W ucla · Apr 30, 2020

I have the 4.25" M69 and really like it. During hunting season I carry it with full magnum loads. Rest of the year I usually have HSM 240gr LSWC loads. Warm (@850fps) 44 spl load shoots great in mine.

torizus · Apr 30, 2020

Anyone tried the Speer Short Barrel (SB) ammo for 44 Spl ?

LittleCooner · Apr 30, 2020

Most people with a 44 special never shoot the factory stuff, except may be the Hornaday defense loads. You can get the 200 grain 44 special barnes bullets and load some really nice 44 special loads or If you load them in the 44 mag, I have some that are running exactly 1400 in my 4 inch barrels.

Dave Lively · Apr 30, 2020

American1776 said:
I just got some Underwood .44 spl. which lists a 245 gr. FMJ flat point @ 950 ft/s. Even if it loses velocity with the snub, that'll still put out a 245 grain flat nose slug at .45 auto velocities.

If you are happy with that load you could save some money by buying some weak 44 magnum ammo instead of paying a premium for hot loaded 44 special.

In particular Georgia Arms sells a 44 magnum load with a 240 grain FMJ bullet rated at 1000 fps for $27/bag of 50 ( .44 Rem Mag 240gr Full Metal Jacket NEW - Georgia Arms ). That 50 fps difference in velocity will not make much of a difference in recoil but I find the 30% reduction in cost very noticeable.

I don't carry my M69 for defense against two legged threats and mostly use it as range gun. My favorite ammo for it is the GA load listed above. Strong enough to be interesting but not so punishing I want to quit after a cylinder or two.

Borderboss · Apr 30, 2020

torizus said:
Anyone tried the Speer Short Barrel (SB) ammo for 44 Spl ?

I didn't know they had Short Barrel ammo for .44Spl. I carry their Short Barrel .44Mag in my M69 2.75", having bought a bunch when they discontinued it.

I emailed Speer about performance of their .44Spl Critical Defense stuff, wondering what kind of chronograph results they had from short barrel guns. They told me that they only chrono and publish info on their law enforcement rounds, which I guess they don't consider the .44Spl to be. The guy did say that the bullet is designed to expand at speeds as low as 750fps.

Pizza Bob · Apr 30, 2020

The "Skeeter" load that irrifleman references is 7.5 Gris of Unique under a 245 - 250 gr Keith style bullet, like the Lyman 429421.

Adios,

Pizza Bob

Univibe · Apr 30, 2020

I have seen bullets that have killed people.

Expansion in people- as opposed to test media - is dubious in all handgun loads. Even the vaunted .357 mag and .357 sig. Hollow point bullets that have killed people frequently show little expansion, and look more smeared and beat up than mushroomy.

mtgianni · May 1, 2020

Univibe said:
I have seen bullets that have killed people.

Expansion in people- as opposed to test media - is dubious in all handgun loads. Even the vaunted .357 mag and .357 sig. Hollow point bullets that have killed people frequently show little expansion, and look more smeared and beat up than mushroomy.

Add to that the difference in clothing worn in our four seasons I go with a solid.

HamHands · May 1, 2020

CCI's... the 200 grain Gold Dot "Flying Ashtray" is a heck of a round shot out of a 3" M24... .44Special. It certainly expands at 750fps and in reality comes out of a 3" barrel well, well over 800fps at the muzzle. It's what I carry for 2 legged buttholes...

For hard hitting and deep penetrating .44Specials... Underwoods 255grain hard cast Keith's run 1,000fps out of a 3" Revolver. It's a fantastic round that is the jack of all trades (load dependent) for sure!

StrawHat · May 1, 2020

I don’t carry a 43 caliber revolver. I do carry a 45 caliber revolver chamber for the ACP cartridge. My bullet of choice is a 230 grain full wadcutter over enough Bullseye to get to 850 fps. I would thick a 43 caliber wadcutter of the same description would be an eqally great load.

Kevin

.44 spl. snub-nose expansion: M69

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