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S&W-Smithing Maintenance, Repair, and Enhancement of Smith & Wesson and Other Firearms.


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Old 02-25-2022, 10:10 AM
Patrick L Patrick L is offline
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My first rust blue! My first rust blue! My first rust blue! My first rust blue!  
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Default My first rust blue!

This is a story in itself, but to be brief, last summer I was GIVEN a 99%, absolutely pristine 1963 Browning A5 light 12. It had a factory installed Poly choke on it. While I don't deny they work exactly as advertised, I just never cared for the looks of them. I do realize this was a hot setup in 1963, but hey it's now 2022.

A5 barrels are stupid expensive, both Belgian and Japanese. I managed to find a finish challenged vent barrel for a reasonable price on Ebay. It had a series of checkerboard patterns in the finish the entire length. I subsequently found out those marks are caused by a gun rusting inside an old fake leather gun case. The pattern is the imprint of the fabric lining. The actual rust was removed, but the marks are etched in the steel.





So I decided to take the plunge. I was posting about alternatives to buying very expensive bluing tanks, burners, etc. from Brownells since I needed something to boil the barrel in. I spent a few weeks accumulating stuff, then I started.

Prepping the barrel was the longest part. I stripped the old blue off, and starting at the muzzle, I took a very fine cut file and a needle file and carefully draw filed each spot. Most were very small. the largest was maybe the size of a dime. Then polish with 220 and then 320 wet or dry. Did shoe shine first, then parallel with barrel. This literally took weeks, working a little each evening.



Actually applying the solution was easy, except for the rib. Instructions said not to let it drip, just wet the steel with long lengthwise strokes. I ended up using a model brush to "paint" inside each rib vent. It actually didn't take that long to do that.

I love Mark Novak videos. I got the idea of a garment moving box and a child's room vaporizer (which I had still!!) to make a steam cabinet



After about an hour, I had this. No turning back now!!!



I jury rigged a boiling tank out of a bar organizer tray. I didn't realize when I ordered it that there were openings at the ends, but I also read of someone using red RTV on a boiling tank. I guess I'd learn if it truly was temp resistant! I ended up buying a cheap Coleman camp stove which gave me two burners, then I Rube Goldberged my propane torch at the end for a third. I put the tank on two riser blocks with aluminum channel to shield heat since I didn't think the Coleman could take the weight of the tank and water. Clamp it all in the trusty old Workmate and:



And in actual use



Fifteen minutes later I had this


Carding wheel in my drill press



And I ended up with this, which I was quite pleased with, and it was only the first cycle. To the right of ring has been carded, to the left still velvety


All the videos said keep repeating until you were happy with the color. I ended up doing two more cycles, for a total of three. I didn't think it would get any better than this


So I quit. I think the match to the receiver is pretty good



The only thing I will do differently is the final cure. In his Midway USA video, as a cure Larry Potterfield suggested a liberal application of boiled linseed oil, let set for 24 hours then wipe off. After 24 hours I had a varnish like coating I had to use acetone to remove! Other videos suggested non detergent motor oil, or even used motor oil that had had all the detergents burned out.

Also, I subsequently saw several videos that used a PVC pipe over a steam pot to convert the red rust using steam. I must say that looks interesting, but I had already committed to the boiling approach. Maybe next project I'll try that way.

This has been fun!
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Old 02-25-2022, 10:44 AM
rd97 rd97 is offline
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Excellent job. Lot of work but isn't it satisfying when it comes together.
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Old 02-25-2022, 11:09 AM
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Looks awesome. I’m sure a very rewarding experience. But did u save much money after buying all the supplies?
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Old 02-25-2022, 11:15 AM
skwchock skwchock is offline
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I am truly impressed with you ingenuity!!! Wow!! I hope that I can be as innovative when I need to do such a task. WELL DONE!!
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Old 02-25-2022, 11:36 AM
16thVACav 16thVACav is offline
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Nice job, and an excellent write up!
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Old 02-25-2022, 11:58 AM
Patrick L Patrick L is offline
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Bald1,

No. But I don't live my life dictated by nickels and dimes. Sure, I could have sent the barrel off and had it hot blued for $150. I easily have $200 in all the little paraphernalia, numerous types of gloves, sandpaper, acetone, linseed oil, and those are just the small items.

But the experience and knowledge gained was PRICELESS. Some people just don't get that. "Knows the cost of everything, the value of nothing."

I hope you do.
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Old 02-25-2022, 12:07 PM
mauser9 mauser9 is offline
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Awesome! Great to see redone! Old school myself! Nothing matches the ole walnut and high gloss bluing for great looks!
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Old 02-25-2022, 12:08 PM
Skyhunter Skyhunter is offline
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Awesome job!
Looks like it was well worth the effort.

WYT-P
Skyhunter
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Old 02-25-2022, 12:39 PM
2152hq 2152hq is online now
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Excellent job! Nice work on the polishing and prep too. That can make all the difference in the final results.

What rusting soln did you use for the job?
Distilled water, tap water?

Good tank set up. Use whatever you can get together.
For some time I used a window ledge fibreglas flower planter. I put a hotwater tank elec heater coil into each end and wired them 110v. Fibreglasses the ends up to accept the coils. The planter fit inside a plywood box w/ insullation so it would heat up quicker. Boy did it.
The power cord used to get pretty hot and the plug melted a little.
A Black&Decker 3/8 elec drill w/the carding wheel in the chuck clamped to a wheelbarrow was my carding wheel set up.
All OSHA approved of course..



On a Slow Rust Blue project,,3 to 4 cycles is not uncommon for a complete bluing job.
FN Brownings take rust blue very well too. That helps.

The use of boiled Linseed oil on the finished carded surface is to limit and actually prevent the surface from producing an 'after-rusting' action.
I don't know why it does, but it does.

Some Rust Bluing Soln's are more likely to produce after-rust than others. Some steel is more likely to produce it as well when rust blued with certain rust blue solns.

After rust will be very apparent and easily seen when you go to wipe the finished surface down again a day or two after you have finished. It's already had an oil wipe down and everything seem great, looks great, seems complete.
Then that couple days later light oil wipe down produces a black residue on the cloth, usually quite heavy.
You can even feel the build up on the surface of the steel as you wipe it down.
That's the continued rusting action of the soln and it's chemicles in the steel. It's generally a Nitric or other acid.

You are often told to do one more step after the last carding and that is to dunk the part(s) in an alkali soln to neutralize the acidic remains of any chemical still in or on the steel.
An Ammonia soln is generally said to be the end all of any after rust issues. There are others.

I've used just about everything around and have still had some bbls and parts with after rust..other with none. All using the same rusting soln.
(I use Laurel Mtn for slow rust blue.)

IF I coat the part(s) with Boiled Linseed Oil after the last carding,,just a nice even coating and then let the parts hang for a day or two.
Then wip them down with a soft cloth with plain gun oil,,like CLP or Rem-Oil,, there will be no after rust.

Yes the BLO light coating will harden or nearly so in that 1 to 2 day hang time. But the wipe down with an oily cloth cuts it right off with a bit of effort in places and leaves the surface clear, bright, clean and never to (after) rust again.

Another way to kill after rust while slow rust bluing is to apply one cyle of Express Rust Blue (I use Mark Lee's Express Blue) right over the final carded surface of your Slow rust blue after it is carded.
Then back into the boiling water. Out and carded as usual.
Then you are done.
It won't after rust for some reason unkn to me.
You can still do the BLO coating thing,,,or not.

I just use the BLO coating now but for quite a while used the extra Express blue cycle to kill any chance of after rust.

If you don't check nd check often for after rust, it keeps working on the steel and will heavily matte the surface and then pit it. It's still working on it.
Oiling won't kill the action of an acid.

If there is no after-rust issue,,,,good!
But be aware of it. I can happen and spoil a good job
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Old 02-25-2022, 01:11 PM
Patrick L Patrick L is offline
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Thanks for all that great info!

I just used Brownell's Rust Blue solution. And I boiled in distilled water. Only used about 2 1/2 gallons, that included topping off what boiled away each cycle.
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Old 02-25-2022, 01:47 PM
Pig Hunter Pig Hunter is offline
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Great job for the first time. One suggestion for next time if you don't let the first rusting cycle develop quite as much you can get a brighter final finish as the surface isn't as etched so much. I use the Brownell's solution also. It is "hot" . It looks like you did a great job degreasing the surface during your prep. Have fun and keep working at it.
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Old 02-25-2022, 01:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick L View Post
Bald1,

No. But I don't live my life dictated by nickels and dimes. Sure, I could have sent the barrel off and had it hot blued for $150. I easily have $200 in all the little paraphernalia, numerous types of gloves, sandpaper, acetone, linseed oil, and those are just the small items.

But the experience and knowledge gained was PRICELESS. Some people just don't get that. "Knows the cost of everything, the value of nothing."

I hope you do.
Yeah, but when you do the second barrel, you will be in the green. After I purchased my bead blaster setup for the 3rd Gens S&Ws, I was in the green after the second one. And now have blasted maybe 4-5 of them.

Rosewood
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Old 02-25-2022, 02:02 PM
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Great job and write up! Thanks for sharing.
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Old 02-25-2022, 02:04 PM
Drm50 Drm50 is offline
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Excellent work. Prep is 98% of the process. I just had major argument with a “expert” that my wheels aren’t stainless steel, because that would scratch. Your project was worth the effort & expense. I get guns that have been left in campers, garages, ect. In same type condition. I use bronze, brass and stainless wire wheels to remove rust. I don’t take effort to file out pitts. Just polish, degrease and use Brownells cold blue. These are guns whose worth doesnt justify the quality of work by op.
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Old 02-25-2022, 02:07 PM
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Great job and great post.
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Old 02-25-2022, 02:21 PM
Patrick L Patrick L is offline
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Rosewood,

I'm actually already thinking ahead of my old Ithaca 37. I cold blued the receiver as a kid, so it goes without saying it's just a lovely grey now. I do have a new barrel on it, so it's almost like a "poor man's pinto" as we say on this forum. I was thinking, now that I have all this stuff, maybe this summer...
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Old 02-25-2022, 10:55 PM
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A labor of love that has been rewarded.

No way in the world to convert this to a business model! Some things we do for the pleasure of doing things the old fashioned ways.

Excellent post! Thank you.
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Old 02-25-2022, 11:31 PM
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Nice job!

It looks great!
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Old 02-26-2022, 12:15 AM
67tempest 67tempest is offline
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Nice job in saving that A5. I have an old A5, built in 1927, that was a family trunk gun and was the first shotgun I ever fired. When it was finally handed down to me it was in bad shape. The receiver and barrel had numerous dings and scratches, the stock was cracked at the wrist and the fore end was split. The bolt was locked up and wouldn't open. When I finally got it apart, a job in itself, I found the locking block was cracked and that is what locked it up. I also found the bolt was damaged where the extractor mounted. I decided I wanted to restore it to shooting condition.

My brother had a friend who was able to supply a replacement stock as well as a new bolt and locking piece. I completely disassemble it and spent weeks working on the receiver and barrel removing all the scratches and dings. I restored all the screws, repairing all the screw slots and polished them. While the metal was out being blued I worked on the replacement stock and fore end getting it into shape and refinishing it. When the metal came back I reassembled it all and took it out and fired it to make sure it functioned normally.

From a money standpoint the gun wasn't worth all the time and effort put into it to get it back into shape. Considering the 80+ years of family history though I felt I had to get it back into shooting condition. This one is on the never sell list and will be passed down to the grand kids.
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Old 03-02-2022, 09:24 PM
Patrick L Patrick L is offline
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Well I put the first mar in my beautiful blue job! Shot a round of skeet tonight, and I can see the slightest rub mark from the reciprocating barrel rubbing on fore end. Just a tiny little rub mark, unavoidable on that type of gun. Hit 22, so it shoots as good as it looks!
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