Fixing bad trigger job.

mcanders · Jul 25, 2009

So I took a gun in trade today. Model 67 no dash stainless .38spl k frame. Gun looks good, I did the quick check before the swap and everything looked good. I even cocked the hammer back all the way and tried to push it forward- to make sure it was safe.
Got home and started testing the action on some snap caps, thought wow this is a nice trigger, very light. I cocked the hammer back and pushed on it slightly, and wham the hammer goes forward.
The revolver is unsafe. I have the kunhausen book on K-frames. It looks like the previous 'smith' only removed material from the trigger angles, not the hammer so I might be able to get another trigger and drop it in.

My question is, can this be fixed by polishing the trigger angles back to factory. Not by me, a real gunsmith would do the work.

HEADKNOCKER · Jul 25, 2009

Here's a post from a while back that shows what may need to be done to fix your troubles..
http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-smithing/90100-push-off-fix.html

bountyhunter · Jul 26, 2009

mcanders said:
So I took a gun in trade today. Model 67 no dash stainless .38spl k frame. Gun looks good, I did the quick check before the swap and everything looked good. I even cocked the hammer back all the way and tried to push it forward- to make sure it was safe.
Got home and started testing the action on some snap caps, thought wow this is a nice trigger, very light. I cocked the hammer back and pushed on it slightly, and wham the hammer goes forward.
The revolver is unsafe. I have the kunhausen book on K-frames. It looks like the previous 'smith' only removed material from the trigger angles, not the hammer so I might be able to get another trigger and drop it in.

My question is, can this be fixed by polishing the trigger angles back to factory. Not by me, a real gunsmith would do the work.

Maybe, but the surfaces of the trigger that have to be cut on to fix it should be rehardened to keep it from going south again. It's possible to do, but most gunsmiths won't do it. They would require a new trigger be installed because of safety and legal reasons. I think triggers run about $40 (?) these days, I would probably want a new one in my gun.

mcanders · Jul 26, 2009

i used the 6inch stone method to get the trigger safe again. need to look into hardening or buying a replacement trigger. surprise surprise, they messed up the cylinder stop timing as well. at least i got to play with one that was buggered up instead of messing one up.

bountyhunter · Jul 27, 2009

The good news is that cylinder stops are cheap and easy to fit.

You might shoot it a while and see if the stoning job "holds". It's hard to tell by eye if the previous cutting went through the hardened surface. If not, it may work OK. If it did, you can flame it and use the Kasenit stuff or just chuck the trigger for a new one.

mcanders · Jul 27, 2009

The revolver is stainless and I believe the trigger is stainless also. A friend told me that stainless can't be case hardened and should be the same hardness all the way throughout? Is this true?

sceva · Jul 27, 2009

S&W put the same triggers in the stainless guns as the Blued ones. Some of the early Stainless revolvers had the hammer and trigger flash chromed to match the stainless but they quit doing that fairly early on. Unless yoy have an early one your hammer and trigger should be color case hardened, if it looks like stainless it may be an early one or someone has polished it or plated it.

mcanders · Jul 27, 2009

My mod 67 is a no dash. The trigger and hammer are identical to this picture.

http://lonelymachines.org/guns/67/sw_67_ahrends.jpg

Bert Man · Jul 27, 2009

mcanders said:
i used the 6inch stone method to get the trigger safe again. need to look into hardening or buying a replacement trigger. surprise surprise, they messed up the cylinder stop timing as well. at least i got to play with one that was buggered up instead of messing one up.

If I remember correctly the earliest no-dash stainless models had stainless hammers and triggers and had a galling problem affecting their mating surfaces so S&W discontinued those and thereafter used carbon steel finished to match the rest of the revolver. The updated parts were case hardened on their mating surfaces the same as other carbon steel parts. The hardening is only a few thousanths deep on both. If your stoning job holds up then the butchering didn't go all the way through and you should be o.k. If it doesen't hold up the best course is to secure a new trigger just as the other posters advised.

bountyhunter · Jul 27, 2009

mcanders said:
The revolver is stainless and I believe the trigger is stainless also. A friend told me that stainless can't be case hardened and should be the same herdness all the way throughout? Is this true?

Not sure, it's possible. I know they recommend specific formulae of steel to be used with the hardening agents.

I have trouble believing the idea that the hammers and triggers would be the same hardness through because they would be awfully brittle and prone to shatter or crack. The surfaces are REALLY hard. I tried to file down the sharp ridges on the front of a trigger once because they were bugging my finger, and I wore out about six new files on them and hardly even polished them.

All the stainless guns I have seen have had the mottled color triggers and hammers, even the MIM ones which means they went through some kind of heat treated hardening after they were made. I think they are not stainless because I have seen fine rust on some of the hammers where I thumb them. I would think stainless would not rust so easily.

Twist · Jul 28, 2009

Trigger

Before you go stoning and polishing.... replace the rebound spring. A very light or too short a (clipped) spring can cause the problem you describe.

tomcatt51 · Jul 28, 2009

Twist said:
Before you go stoning and polishing.... replace the rebound spring. A very light or too short a (clipped) spring can cause the problem you describe.

If you have good SA sear surfaces (hammer & trigger) the gun won't push off even with the rebound spring removed. A heavier rebound spring may help hide the problem but it's never caused by the rebound slide spring.

mcanders · Jul 28, 2009

Thanks for the suggestion, the rebound spring was checked first, yep- cut down to 15 coils. Was replaced with a factory length rebound spring, trigger would not push off as easy but still fell. After a several times stoning a couple strokes and rechecking the push off I was able to obtain a safe SA trigger. It feels very heavy compared to a factory model 10 in SA. I need to check it with a trigger pull gauge to see where it is at.

As far as the trigger material goes, I looked last night and there is a 'S' stamped into the back of the trigger just like the rest of the stainless parts on the frame.

tomcatt51 · Jul 28, 2009

mcanders said:
As far as the trigger material goes, I looked last night and there is a 'S' stamped into the back of the trigger just like the rest of the stainless parts on the frame.

There are older guns with SS internals, there are good reasons they quit doing them that way.

Fixing bad trigger job.

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