Greetings to the S&W forum. I've been lurking here for a few months since I purchased a M&P 15-22 MOE and find this site to be a wealth of information. I searched this site but couldn't find an answer so thought I'd post the question. Had a Geissele G2S trigger installed in my gun and now the trigger pin is walking out. Mr. Geissele says not to use the KNS pins because they are too soft. Has anyone here had any problems with the KNS pins used with a Geissele trigger? I'd really like to keep this trigger, other than the trigger pin not staying put this is a fantastic product and really makes a difference in the gun.

Did he state too soft for what? Those pins are used on all sorts of ARs, including the 15-22, so I wonder what is so special about his trigger?

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FIDELITAS ET FORTITUDO

I use KNS pins in all of my AR style rifles, including the 15-22.

I also use the ALG ACT triggers in them. Although ALG is owned by his wife, they are Geissele parts.

I have had no trouble with the KNS pins wearing down prematurely on any platform.

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Uva Uvam Vivendo Varia Fit

Did it start as soon as you got it back from having the trigger installed? The pin should not be moving, the hammer spring holds the trigger pin in place.

Yes, first trip to the range with the new trigger is when it started. The trigger pin walked out to the left, I noticed it when the trigger stopped working. Shoved the pin back in and the trigger worked fine, but still kept trying to walk out.

Make sure the legs of the hammer spring are on top (looking down into receiver) of the trigger pin and riding in the grooves of the trigger pin as well. If the trigger pin doesnt have side grooves, switch it with the hammer pin. Trigger pin uses side grooves to secure and hammer pin uses the center groove.

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SaveLivesKeepCiviliansArmed

As for the KNS pins...

I use them with my ALG ACT with no problems. Ive heard reports on AR15dotcom that a few had the KNS pins bind up there Geissele triggers. As for soft metal, i think it will only wear with full auto firing.

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SaveLivesKeepCiviliansArmed

You wont know/understand unless you use one.

Geissele is the only triggers i run in my ARs now... They spoiled me.

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SaveLivesKeepCiviliansArmed

If they are so special, why are they the only trigger that has an issue with the KNS pins? That is what I'm asking. I'm sure it is a nice trigger. I shoot with CMC & Timney.

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FIDELITAS ET FORTITUDO

Thanks everyone for the suggestions. I verified that the pins are in the correct spots and that the legs of the hammer spring are on top of the trigger pin. When I center the trigger pin it "snaps" into place like it should stay put. I'll go to the range tomorrow to test again. Perhaps the trigger pin wasn't originally installed quite right. If the problem persists I'll try some KNS pins.

Just ignore what he said and get a set of the dedicated KNS AR15-22 pins. I don't see how they can be soft when they are stainless steel. I use the same Geissele S3G trigger in my 3-gun AR and my speed competition AR15-22, both use the appropriate set of KNS pins. After 2 years in the AR15-22 and one in the AR everything is working fine.

Get the KNS pins but tell S&W about it. This problem is becoming common on this thread and at my local store.

Why? The problem started when he added a 3rd party trigger. Why would S&W need to know or what would you expect them to do about it?

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FIDELITAS ET FORTITUDO

Geissele triggers are awesome.

Any AR that "needs" the KNS pins has other issues. They are a solution to a non existant problem.

Not true. Your drop in trigger modules, such as CMC, need pins that lock from the outside of the frame, as there is no spring pressure put on the pins. CMC includes pins with E clips to lock them in place, but I used JP anti-walk pins.

On top of that, there have been numerous complaints of stock trigger pins walking on stock triggers. Anti-walk pins insure that will never happen again.

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FIDELITAS ET FORTITUDO

First I've heard of this unless your talking about the 15-22 (which is a S&W problem and they DO need notified about their stock FCGs)... can you provide some info/facts on it that pertain to the AR please?

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SaveLivesKeepCiviliansArmed

I've been shooting AR's for more than 20 years...never needed anti-walk pins..never needed CMC when there was a Geissele trigger available...to each his own, I guess, but the Geissele triggers are acknowledged to be the best available..never had a stock pin "walk"....lucky I guess...

I'm talking about the 15-22 & agree that S&W needs to be notified when a stock part acts up... but not when a 3rd party one does.

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FIDELITAS ET FORTITUDO

I too have never had a stock pin walk on my AR and not on my 15-22 either, but then again, I didn't keep the stock trigger in long as it was rather crummy.

I'm sure Geissele is a fine trigger and might just be the best. CMC works for me as I'm not a competition shooter & don't need the "best" trigger money can buy... especially on a cheap plinker like a 15-22. I personally prefer CMC because they are very nice, compared to stock triggers, plus being a drop in module, even an idiot like me can install with no problem. But each to their own.

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FIDELITAS ET FORTITUDO

Went to the range today, 300 rounds rapid fire, no trigger pin walking. I'm guessing the pin wasn't originally installed quite right and just needed to be reinstalled. I love my Geissele trigger.

We all know the trigger hammer pins are too short for the 15-22 lower receiver. S&W saved $ on their design by using OEM AR FCG parts. The KNS pins are longer and made exclusively for the extra wide 15-22 lower receiver. My J spring was defective from the first shot. My pins started walking on the 15-22 from day one. I've been reading about how a dozen people here have had the same problem. I wonder how many people, who do not post here, have experienced walking pins. The KNS pins work and are cheaper, faster, more convenient and a better long term solution than sending your rifle back to S&W IMHO.

Three 15-22s in the family - mine and my two grandson's. None have had any problem with walking pins or broken anything. I have a single stage Jard adjustable in mine and the other two are stock FCG. Mine has 12K plus through it.

The KNS pins are a solution IF there is a problem. but I'm of the school that doesn't spend money to solve a problem I don't have.