What adjustable sight for a M&P Compact?

Szumi

Szumi

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I have a compact in .40 S&W, it shoots low. It isn't me pushing as far as I can tell. It just shoots low.

I'd like an adjustable rear sight, it could only be elevation adjustable only and I could deal with it.

Any no machining solutions that would work well with what is a carry firearm that will get shot in IDPA.

Thanks in advance,

Szumi
 
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Szumi said:
I have a compact in .40 S&W, it shoots low. It isn't me pushing as far as I can tell. It just shoots low.

I'd like an adjustable rear sight, it could only be elevation adjustable only and I could deal with it.

Any no machining solutions that would work well with what is a carry firearm that will get shot in IDPA.

Thanks in advance,

Szumi
Click to expand...

Szumi, no offense, but it always amazes me when someone posts and claims that their firearm is shooting "fill in the blank". Unless you are a "professional" shooter with 10's of thousands of rounds under your belt, with various firearms, my guess would be that yours may (and I do mean "may") be a case of operator error. You may or may not realize that your firearm (and the production/factory load ammo, if that's what your shooting) is a very well engineered and manufactured piece of equipment, and to be frank, you are not. Therefore, I would lean more towards the source of variability and variation, i.e. shooting low, attributable to you, the shooter, before I would the pistol.

1. Are you shooting from a "resting" (vs. a free standing) position?
2. At what distance(s) are you finding your gun to be shooting low?
3. Have you had a more experienced shooter fire your pistol? If so, is s/he getting the same (low) results?

Let's start with these questions and work our way from there.
 
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When I first shot with my M&P40C it shot low. My other full size pistols shot point of aim ( G17 & M&P45 ).
I was shooting low, due to poor trigger control and anticipating recoil too much. I also played with grip insert ( went from small to medium ), which helped.
I think due to the shorter barrel, small movement is amplified more than with full size pistols, when the pistol is fired. Just my guess.
Anyways, I got better with practice.
 
I have about 350 rounds through it so far. It isn't my only handgun with fixed sights but it is the only one that shoots low.

As I have worked with it my groups have tightened a lot but they stay low.

Two and a half inches higher at 15 yards and I'd be really happy.

Szumi
 
Maybe you are gripping it differently than your other handguns? Rarely is the issue of shooting left and low, or even right and high the problem with the gun's sights. My compact is dead on ... when I am. I am cross dominant and learned a nasty habit of punching the trigger learning to shoot with a S&W 638 that had way too heavy of a trigger pull for me. My M&P9c has a much lighter trigger, and I have to focus so that I don't resort back to my bad habit.
 
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ptiller said:
When I first shot with my M&P40C it shot low. My other full size pistols shot point of aim ( G17 & M&P45 ).
I was shooting low, due to poor trigger control and anticipating recoil too much. I also played with grip insert ( went from small to medium ), which helped.
I think due to the shorter barrel, small movement is amplified more than with full size pistols, when the pistol is fired. Just my guess.
Anyways, I got better with practice.
Click to expand...

One way for Szumi to detect if he is, in fact, anticipating recoil, is to take two guns (his 40c and, preferably, a .22) to his next range visit. He should start by shooting a couple of mags worth with his 40c, then immediately pick up and fire the .22, and see what happens. If he "flinches" on the first couple of .22 rounds, then he most likely is anticipating recoil with his 40c.

And oh, if you're reading this Szumi, Semper Fi, buddy. No, I'm not a (former) Marine, but I do have friends and family who are.
 
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MotorCityGun,

Rifle or handgun shooting, I always take a rim fire of appropriate type and of known accuracy to validate my ability to shoot that day.

I know what pushing looks like. I know I have pushed this particular firearm at times. This combination of light weight and a fair amount of power is a bit challenging for me. When I push, it is about 5" low.

One thing that Marine range instructors drill into your head is to call your shots. That instantaneous picture you see when the firearm goes off.

A little drill I use is fire at target. If you called it good, leave the target un-pasted. If you called it bad, paste over the hole. This is a test of how am I shooting when I don't screw up.

Szumi
 
Sometimes tolerances stack and a handgun will shoot low. You may want to contact S&W and see if they have taller rear sights. You could also contact Novak and see if they can supply you with a rear sight a few thousandths taller. I have found the folks at Novak's very helpful.

KAC
 
I was taught to put a mix of dummy rounds with my regular ammo in the mags, which will help to detect if any flinching. Also, put a casing on the end of the barrel and do five consecutive dry fires without the casing falling off.
 
Dawson makes some great adjustable sights. I have seen them on other guys guns at IDPA shoots. When I got my M&P9c, I bench rested it and using Winchester white box, shot 5 inches high at 25 yards, into 3 inch or less groups. I had a fiber optic sight sent to me by them that is .030 higher than stock and at 25 yards, now shoots to POA. Hotter ammo shoots a couple of inches lower.
 
Dawson Precision makes great sights. They will have them for your M&P. Front sight in black, or fiber, and several different styles of rear sights, including fully adjustable, windage and elavation.
 
I've continued on with this firearm. I installed the Apex USB and sear that improved the trigger a lot. I now have no idea when it will break now. I'm not sure that is a good thing since most guns I could figure out were I was about to push the sear over the edge.

Anyway, this is a gun easy to push. As I continue working with it my groups are moving up to the aim point.

For some reason this gun tends to give me a flinch reflex after a short period of shooting it. Shooting my .22 target pistol confirms that on most days I can it shoot a lot better than my .40c.

I've been shooting isosceles, should I switch to a weaver stance?

I want to beat this thing into submission.

Szumi
 
I don't know what bullet weight you are using but switching to a slightly heavier bullet will usually raise the point of impact. If you're already using 180s, this may not be a solution.
 
You may want to set an empty case on top of your front sight and practice dry firing your pistol. The objective is that the case stays put with little or no movement. Larry Vickers suggest this approach to improve your follow through and reset. This may help.
 
Szumi said:
I've continued on with this firearm. I installed the Apex USB and sear that improved the trigger a lot. I now have no idea when it will break now. I'm not sure that is a good thing since most guns I could figure out were I was about to push the sear over the edge.

Anyway, this is a gun easy to push. As I continue working with it my groups are moving up to the aim point.

For some reason this gun tends to give me a flinch reflex after a short period of shooting it. Shooting my .22 target pistol confirms that on most days I can it shoot a lot better than my .40c.

I've been shooting isosceles, should I switch to a weaver stance?

I want to beat this thing into submission.

Szumi
Click to expand...

Shoot it off a pistol rest, never assume the the gun is at fault. The pro's don't just assume they are the perfect shooter's. Its the only way to get your sights dead on.
 
If anyone has some Dawson Precision adjustable sights on their m&p, I'd appreciate a sight picture.....picture.... I am going to buy some and can't decide if I want to use the .100 width or the .125 width front sights. Also, I can't decide if I want to use the front w/ fiber insert, or plain black. What I do know is that I am NOT using 3 dots...I hate them...even blacked them out w/ flat black on my pistola. The website doesn't show "sight picture" photos...just a photo of the sight off the gun... grrrr. Thanks for any help.

By the way, I know a short defensive handgun is not a target pistol, but it is my mission to practice lots and get as darn close to rabbit/squirrel killing / target accuracy as possible with my 9c. Hitting a human at arms length when I am crapping my pants probably won't depend as much on what kind of sights I have..so I want to install something that gives me the opportunity for precision practice at small objects. It (I/ME) shoots high even at 10 yds now. I know I can change bullet wt/ speed etc...and get the fixed sight to point of impact, but.... I had rather select the load the gun likes best and then adjust the sights to match... enough rambling. Thanks in advance guys...

By the way, my trusty 9mm compact has already dispatched a rabid dog, a chicken snake, and a rat. :)
 
2.5 inches at 15 yards ii an adjustment of about 0.02" at the sight. Easy to file off that much from the front sight with a couple of strokes.

But shoot some standard ammo (180gr) it at 25 yards off a sand bag and see where she shoots before doing anything. 25 yards is the typical "standard zero range."

-- Chuck
 
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