I have recently purchased new one of each of the above. I really like both, the 40c for HD and the 380 for carry. I have shot about 100 rounds through each so far with absolutely no problems with the 40c and just a few FTF early on with the 380. My question is this (for both guns) when should I begin trying some HP's. My local gun dealer said he wouldn't recommend until running 200-300 rounds of target ammo first. Your thoughts would be appreciated. And thanks for this forum.

Your decision to relegate your 40c to HD is fine, but realize that this is/can be a great CCW weapon as well. Especially in light of the fact that the .380 BG has already proven to be "unreliable".

Also, as long as the 40c has been properly cleaned/lubed and removed of any residual factory lubricants/sealants, I don't see why you would need to "break it in" before trying hollows.

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MotorCityGun

I have both the 40c and the BG380. I think the 40 should be the primary for SD because it shoots so well and I have found with the Comptac in the FBI cant conceals really well (Outside Waistband Holsters - products new home - Paddle Holster). I haven't quite figured out a defined set of guidelines as to when I will carry, so I found that I wasn't at all, particularly as it went into summer (CCW since March). So that prompted me to purchase the BG380 as a pocket carry pistol. However on the range I found I was very inaccurate with it compared to my tight patterns with my 40. Then I discovered if I shoot the 380 with my index finger extended along the receiver and used my middle finger for the trigger, my accuracy increased greatly. My problem with that is imprinting that action for that specific gun (question as to will that become natural with practice and will it interfere with shooting my larger pistols). I carry the 380 either in an ankle holster, or, more frequently, in my Desantis pocket holster. I feel the 380 is a backup weapon for sure, and yet, it is the one I carry the most because of its convenience.
Concerning the use of HP in the 380, I have read several posts here that it's actually better to stay with FMJ with such a small gun giving a greater chance for 2 holes rather than just one and with more velocity. I always practice on the range with FMJ with both, but several have shared that practice should also be done with what you're going to shoot with. I also bought a Stormlake 9 mm conversion barrel for practice for the 40c because of cost.

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Recovering Pacifist

Knochen is dead on.
I have owned several M&Ps and the compact .40 is absolutely rock solid dependable! I own Glocks, 1911s, and Walthers and I'll pick the little M&P .40c every time for carry. Great trigger and incredibly accurate - gives one confidence.
In my opine, the .380 is one notch up from a baseball bat and I'd only carry the Bodygaurd if I wanted weight in my pocket.
I suppose you could throw it at a badguy.

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Morality >religion

MCG,

I have a BG380, and yes, I do recall some of the earlier models had 'issues', I have a more recent model that I'd like to think was manufactured after the initial 'growing pains' were fixed and it's been pretty good and while it's no M&P 40c or Glock 27, I like how it disappears in my pocket. I also haven't had issues firing Hornady Critical Defense HP's, although I carry them for--'Critical Defense" only! (too expensive)

Maybe I just got lucky--I'm not saying you're wrong, but do you have any 'recent' info--say websights, reviews-google stuff etc., to show where a significant number--or any--as even a small % is compelling to me with a self defense gun--have a number of people have found it 'unreliable'?

As said, I like mine just fine, for relatively close in--it's fairly accurate.

BUT, out of responsibility, I should (would like to, please) see any fairly recent (again, six or so months old) data that show's it's not so great after all--if it's not reliable, as I have recommended to a good number of good people!


Fo a gun that's main purpose to be for self defense, for it to be shown as 'unreliable' is very much a 'worse case' scenario, in my book.

If anybody else has any data 'dirt' on the BG380, please feel free to 'pipe in'--it could save some people some grief, money and keep the egg off of my face, possibly!!!

PS--IT is interesting that this gun has gone from an orginal price of $575 and I've seen it under $300 new and commonly for between $349 and $369 these days, but that in and of itself isn't 'proof' or show some amount of recent data that it's relatively unreliable.

First post here! I've been lingering for awhile. I like your choice of weapons. I too recently (in the last year) aquired both an M&P 40 (but in full size) and a BG380. I have some older handguns, but never really caught the bug until recently. Now this site has me drooling over a couple of revolvers.

I like each weapon for their intended purpose (M&P for HD; BG for carry). I have shot ~200 rounds through each without one failure of any kind (knock on wood). I had not heard about breaking in a handgun before shooting HPs. Both of mine had HPs shot through after ~50 rounds of FMJs. Once again, no issues to speak of.

My biggest problem between the two is the difference in the trigger. To go back and forth takes some getting used to. I am much more accurate with the M&P, but I would say I have respectable accuracy with both weapons, especially for a relative novice. At least accurate enough to count if the #$&* ever hits the fan.

I'll have to try your idea of shooting the BG with the middle finger to operate the trigger. I have above average size hands. If I don't have my non-shooting hand positioned just right, it can actually interfere with my trigger finger on the long trigger pull on the BG. I just need to practice with the non-shooting hand in a lower position on both weapons as the repositioning shouldn't affect my M&P shooting. It's just different from how I was brought up shooting.

I love the BG for carry. Heck, it's the middle of summer, I'm wearing t-shirt and shorts, and most of the time my wife doesn't even know I'm carrying.

Sorry for the long post. Happy shooting!

I have the same two guns !! I absolutly LOVE my M&P 40 especially after the apex trigger job and ram install.
Here it is, and if you look at the lower pic you will see my bg380[IMG][/IMG]
--- wait a min, that's not a bg oh yeah almost forgot, I just traded it for a 637 I think they are good lil guns - I mainly got rid of it bec. sometimes when I'd shoot my left hand thumb would trip the slide lock lever - holding it open Just for the record, I can shoot much smaller groups with this one (using double action) for a fair comparison. I also like to have the single action option. Not to mention that .38 vs .380 is a no brainer
[IMG][/IMG]

There is a thead here on Smith-Wessonforum,com : Bodyguard 380: Not Ready for Primetime and it is interesting, but I haven't been fully convinced, athough I'm starting to be glad I don't wear my pants and jeans so tight any more, as I'm looking more at the M&P 40c and Glock 27 in my collection for pocket carry--although they seem a mite bit heavy and I'm not too sure about that.

Any thing fairly recent on google or else where on the BG380 being unreliable, I'd appreciate knowing about. I'm starting to think that after sinking $309 and another $25 in transfer fee, that maybe I'm in denial and I don't mean some river in Egypt, unfortunately.


I haven't fired 100's of rounds with it quite yet and so far it's eaten and spit out everything put in it--but hey--I hate to keep buying pricey ammo, feeling like I'm a 'beta tester' for a gun I knew had issues, but 'thought' they'd been worked out .

Nonetheless, I'm going to fire several hundred rounds of that damn pricey 380 ammo and then make a decision if I want to trust my family's life with that in my pocket. The Ruger was/is cheaper, but I thought aside from the trigger feel, the BG380 was the better gun, sturdier, better grip and standard sights, etc..

If push comes to shove and I don't trust the BG380 after all and find the M&P 40c or Glock 27 (sweet guns, Nickel Boron upper slide, Truglo TFOs and all) too heavy, I don't think I'll go with the baby Ruger after all, nor their new baby 9mm. (Ruger has major issues with a lot of new intros too) That Sig P238 in Equinox finish and/or with the rosewood scales, seems to be whispering in my ear already. That gun, with two tone Equinox type finish with Crimson Trace, a 2.7 inch barrel, weighing in at 15.2 ounces sounds mighty fine for $621, although The two tone, with Sig Sites (tritium nights) at $508 might just have to do the trick, if 'push comes to shove"

We had six inches of rain last night here in South Georgia--a real blessing in our drought conditions--great for the Farmers. Now if five inches were water for the Farmers, seeing how after 5 inches, it runs off instead of soaking in and the extra inch was all $5 and $10's, I'd be delighted about now!

After the jury's in and the verdict too, I just hope in this situation, I'm not like many who end up saying "I coulda, I shoulda, had a Sig!" Arrgh...

I posted the original question. i have recently traded the BG380 for a Sig P238, but it wasn't because of any issues with the gun other than the trigger. I think it tested out at around 12-13#'s. And at the range with the 40c there was so much difference in shooting the two, i had trouble alternating. The p238 trigger is very close to the 40c and I really enjoy shooting both. The p238 is a little heavier than the BG, but the dimensions are very close and it carries just as well. The extra 3 ounces also help in flip. I traded the BG but could have bought the p238 for $500 including a laser included that operates much easier than the BG. Happy camper now.

Thanks Bking,

It really wasn't any secret before I got my BG380 that the trigger was less than optimum, to put in mildly. I liked the trigger better on all the Ruger LCPs I handled and they cost about the same, but aside from that, I felt and still feel, that the Smithy's the better gun of those two.

I fired both for a while before purchasing on-line to save a bundle of money. I'm generally not too critical about triggers in a gun I've sunk just around $300 into. Not 'chump change', but I wasn't expecting a 'Sig 229 Elite" and didn't pay the 'premium for premium'.

This 380 isn't Sig 226. 229, or "Wison Combat" territory--not in quality and it's a galaxy away in price. If a significantly more expensive pistol came to me like this--as a combat, range--target gun, I'd send it back

Now if this BG380 came to me as abolutely awful, with absurd creep, with side to side wiggle and if my wife had trouble pulling the trigger--not the case with the BG380, we recieved, then I'd consider it 'dangerous' and I'd wonder 'what else may be wrong' that I might not know about--not yet anyway, then I'd get rid of it. If I am going to pull out a gun, I HAVE to feel I trust it.

As it turned out, the BG380 I ordered on line came to me with a pull of about 14 pounds.

I'd done my homework fairly well, I think and knew a few 'issues' the earlier model had had been 'fixed' and I made sure my serial number came after the date the first improvements became part of the manufacturing process.

Maybe there's a lesson there about the perils of buying on line, because this isn't the first time I've seen variance in the trigger feel in guns of the same model--or with other 'difference factors' in different versions of the same model as well.

When my gunsmith recieved the gun and did his customary inspection, he suggested a trigger job--wanting to bring it down to about 5 pounds. But that guy's a great smithy, a world class marksman who can empty his semiauto as fast as most full automatics--he's a gun connoisseur, and I just told him-"thanks--but let's just see".

I'm in and out of my pockets all day with a key ring with 8 or so keys, a flash drive etc., and feel 'just in case' something snags--that a heavy trigger is better for a gun kept where stuff's going in and out. Maybe 10 pounds would be optimum, but for me, no lower. Again 'we'll see'.

But when I see the word "UNRELIABLE" in reference to a model of a gun I carry for personal protection, I get serious, asking around all over again, doing my research and firing it as much as possible to make an informed decision.I'm still doing that and hoping to hear more testimony--your's seemed to say it wasn't 'unreliable' for you and I'm still as eyes and ears.

I handled that Sig P238 and no doubt it's a better pistol---better built--more attractive, just more refined all around. However I stll prefer the way the BG380's grip feels in my hands and as said, I'll stay in a holding pattern for now, while listening, shooting and hopefully, learning. The 'jury's still out' so to speak, but I think I'll end up keeping the BG380. Thanks again for sharing your feedback!

Rangel, this type of conversation is what these forums are all about for me. You are correct, I do not feel that the BG380 is unreliable at all. After the first range trip, my gun performed very well as far as loading, firing and ejecting. And the accuracy was good as well. As stated the trigger was just something I could not get used to and I was not aware that there were options out yet for this gun. I am heading out to the range today with the P238 and the 40c. I still wish I could have kept the BG380, but wife isn't yet in the firearms appreciation mode!!! Thanks for your analysis and positive outlook.

Got my BG380 in July and disassembled it and the laser was inoperatable. The little yellow plastic tabs on the sides of the laser off/on button fell off. S&W replaced the laser. Be careful with the laser when you remove from the gun. Haven't fired it yet, wanted to wait till I got the laser back. Does anyone know if Tritium sights for the Bodguard 380 are available?

Like when used with cars, the term "reliability" when applied to guns has two meanings. The first refers to the line as a whole. "Ford Escorts aren't reliable cars" is a statement that might be used when evaluating models for purchase. "My Ford Escort, which I purchased for $1900 in 2002 with 91,000 miles on it, had nearly perfect reliability and still had cold A/C when we gave it away in 2010 with 212,000 miles on it" is a statement about a specific vehicle.

As a group, there have been reports that the Bodyguard 380 suffered (suffers?) from several distinct issues. For many, this makes the risk of purchase too high because the gun is "unreliable" meaning they think the chances are too high that they will get a copy with problems. There's nothing wrong with this approach to purchases, and I do it too.

But for an individual gun, "reliability" is determined by the method you describe: take it to the range and shoot it, and shoot it, and shoot it. My M&P9 has about 2,000 rounds through it and there has been not even one malfunction of any kind. It is a reliable gun. My Bodyguard 380 has about 200 rounds through it, and I have had two FTF's, both of which went bang when I pulled the DAO trigger a second time. Based on this evidence, I consider this specific gun to also be reliable.

I'm sure my Toyota Corolla-driving brother thought I was crazy when I purchased a Ford Escort. A few years later, after his Corolla required a new engine, and the rusty 'Scort was still trucking along, what I describe above was perfectly illustrated: reliability is ultimately a term applied to a specific machine. If you already own a Bodyguard 380, and it shoots reliably, I'd ignore any advice to "get rid of that gun because it's unreliable". In such a case, the reliability issue may be with the reason circuits between the ears of the person uttering the statement.

No plans to get rid of my BG380 any time soon. I like mine. I carry it 99% of the time I'm carrying. Everyonce in while you have to let the others get out of the safe to go for a walk and some fresh air. Still no failures of any type after ~300 rounds.

I had a SR9c and LCP, traded them both for a M&P 45 and a BG .380. The 9 just didn't feel good and the LCP did not feed reliably. The grips on the LCP were also just too small for my hand. The FTF's were the real reason to move it for me. As for the BG, I brought it home, field striped and cleaned. Put about 40 rounds of FMJ and then some gold dot then Sabers. Not a problem, then I mixed the mag with both hp and two types of fmj, still no problems. If I use good technique with solid grip and pull through the trigger I have shot easy 6" groups out to thirty feet. The 45 is just incredible. Died and went to heaven good. Wish the ammo was not so expensive but I knew that going in. For what it is worth, my BG was made early this year so it qualifies as a recent build. All guns have the possibility of failure so I try to practice clearing the guns I have and getting them back on the fight. Carry what you feel comfortable with but personally, I would not stand in front of any one with any gun, 22 to 500. Just my .02, be safe.
Frank.

Smith & Wesson addressed the problems of the first run EAA Bodyguards very quickly, I know I have one. Last week I bought my 2'nd Bodyguard EAR and it is a troublefree reliable pistol. They have tweaked the design over the many runs and the new ones have lighter triggers and the laser button activate much easier than the earlier ones. Gun Tests magazine (the Consumers Reports of gun mags) tested the Bodyguard and declared it "The Cadillac of micro 380s", I agree.

I own the M&P 40 FS and the BG380. I also have a Bersa 380 Thunder DLX. I carry all 3 daily. My 40 is in the door panel of my truck. My Bersa is on my right hip and the BG is in my right pocket. All 3 have been tested with at least 500 rounds each of FMJ and HP's of every type and weight. I even think they would feed a tu** if you could load one.

You do not put your life or your families life on a weapon that has not been proved and all 3 to date have not had any FTF or FTE.

The BG had it's growing pains but the newer ones have earned a place as a pocket gun or bug. It's a good shooter and will hit where aimed. It's not made for long range, 7-15yds. and it's a point and shoot gun. Forget the laser. It's useless, for range use or plinking. You don't have time in SD situation to even turn it on. So just use it as a cat toy.

BG 380 unreliable? I don't think so, reliable? Yes. Just as reliable as my M&P 40 or Bersa 380. I guess I just got a good one.

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Excuse me!

My new M&P .40c that I digicam'd. I had a FS 9mm, but traded for the .40c for more power and concealability.

I've put through nearly 300 rounds with my BG, and with cleaning and oiling, the trigger has loosened up quite a bit. Accuracy has greatly improved I believe because of the trigger situation. I'm glad I didn't react too soon and trade it off for something else at even greater cost. I have had a few misfires (maybe 3 so far out of the 300), but I like the fact you can pull the trigger again and it does it's job.

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Recovering Pacifist

I really like my BG380, but the Sig Sauer 238 (shoots 380, weighs a bit more--also available with built in laser) is mighty fine--if the BG380 is 'The Cadillac', perhaps the Sig is an M Series BMW--the trigger on that Sig is very sweet right out of the box for starters...

I have a Sig P238 (SAS) has been a PERFECT gun. Carry it all the time. I did pay a premium for it but VERY HAPPY. I have shot aprox 600 rounds through it. Not one hic-cup. It has the new flat spring, 3rd gen mag and pretty accurate. At 10 yards I get 3-4 " groups rapid fire. I have a friend that purchased a BG 380, which I have shot, but I can't get by the long heavy trigger. LOVE MY SIG.

No doubt the Sig is sweet as I've pointed out previously, but no sour grapes intended, you can get a nice trigger job done on the BG380 and still save a lot of money versus the 238.

I do like the lighter weight on the S&W. While some 380's are down to close to 8 ounces, they are brutal on the hands if you want to shoot a box or two, to put it mildly. Almost naturally due to physics (although construction is a factor too--ala the 'spring' you mention) the Sig's extra weight helps it to be a bit easier to shoot than the BG380 too.

On the other hand, the BG380 is lighter, carrying at around at around 12 oz, is still managable to shoot and also not only pocket carries a little easier than the 238, but it leaves less of an obvious imprint in your pocket, when looked at from the outside.

The 'perfect gun'? I supose there's a 'perfect gun'--namely 100's of guns 'perfect' for specific needs and conditions, although I'll bet that you meant in terms of buyer satisfaction, the Sig's perfect for you. Sounds quite accurate as well. It also interesting that like so many companies, they've been improving on it--few guns are 'just right' on first issue.

I have some friends who are strongly in what I call the Sig Sauer--HK camp, but they're increasingly interested in the M&P series. I don't see too many Sigs and HKs in formal competitions.

Back at you. >>>>>>>>>>
I hear what you are saying Rangle and agree completely.
Everyone is different. I just happen to like the Sig better
than the BG. I just this minute weighed my P238 on my
postal scale and loaded Hornady Critical Defense it weighs
15 & 1/2 OZ. As you said, ME/I can't take the beating with
the BG .380 I can and do, shoot 50-100 rounds through my
Sig quite often. Actually I think I am close 1000 rounds now.
I carry it all the time in a Crossbreed IWB holster. After just
a few minutes I forget I have it on. As for being a died in
the wool Sig fan >>>>>> NO. I just bought a S&W M&P 9c and
have a Glock 26 (which I really like) and a Colt .380 Govt.
Model. The Colt is kind of a Safe Queen, I just LIKE IT. I
also have a Beretta 92FS in 9mm Really like that gun but
just TOO BIG to carry. OH, and a S&W 1911 LOVE IT. As
you can see, I'm diverse. I read your post and felt like
adding my thoughts. What ever you do will be RIGHT for you.

My 10 year old and I were out at our range this weekend. I had my M&P 40FS and my BG380, he had his M&P15-22 and we had a Ruger 22 also.

We shot hundreds of rounds with not a single hiccup. We had several friends out with us and one had a PX4 that gave him fits. And one Colt AR mangled a shell, nut he was firing it full auto (bumping he called it).

Also had one friend with some Russian 7.62 with goofy flat bottomed rounds that really went KABOOM when he fired it.... Hard to find shells he said... I think they were loaded with dynamite!

I shoot 100+ rounds out of my 380 Bodyguard at a time and
it don't make my hand hurt and it shoot HP bullets just fine
I have shot Hornady XTP , CD Remington 102 GSB PMC HP
and Remington 88 HP I guess I just got a good one.
Also it's as smooth as frogs fur.

I do understand what you are saying but I have arthritis in my hands and that little gun just hurts me. My Sig P238 does not. What can I say. To each his own. I just prefer the Sig. I just shoot ball ammo from it but carry "Hornady Critical Defense"

Hadn't noticed this previously:

LAPD Bodyguard 380 Model (Photos)

Interesting. Like I said above, I have arthritis in my hands. That BG380 just doesn't work for me. BUT, the Sig does. A good friend of mine whose BG380 I shot, likes his very much. Just not for me. What ever you do will be right for you.

I own both pistols (at the time of this posting) I started out with the BG 380 and fired 250 rounds thru it; never couild get comfortable with the trigger pull on the BG or the grip, put a granulated rubber grip from Talon on it - and that did help a little. Purchased my M&P40c 2 months later and have pretty much neglected my BG380 since; have put 1000 rounds thru the M&P40c with no issues at all; I let my wife fire the BG380 and she had no interest in it - wanted to stay with her Airweight 38 Special; Not sure what the future is going to hold for the BG380 - it fired well and was fairly acurate at less than 15 yards. I'm not displeased with it, and it is the newest generation that has the bugs worked out of it. I like the sites much better on the M&P40c, and have not really used the laser on the BG380, don't want to get in a habit of relying on it. My daily carry is the M&P40c, and will probably let the BG380 go.

I also found the BG380's sights less than optimum too, but better than those on a lot of the small back up guns--BUGs. The trigger's reallllly long and heavy, but I think triggers on pocket guns should be on the heavy side.

Don't laugh too loud here, but on a whim, I took out some Liquid Paper "White Out" and put it on the front sight. That was about 10 months ago. I have carried that gun in its pocket holster in my front and back pocket and the White Out is still there!

I'm sure I could remove it and some white enamel paint, which would probably replace it at least as well, but the White Out has also suprisingly lasted quite well! I sort of figured it as a 'trial run' but it's still holding.....

It especially helps in aquiring a target, as the white front really contrasts well to the black rear's.

Speaking of laughing, when I read Knochen's post, which included:

>>Then I discovered if I shoot the 380 with my index finger extended along the reciever and used my middle finger for the trigger, my accuracy increased greatly.<<<

I was increduolous when I read that, but dangnabbit, it really does work, even if it does look 'different'!

I have two LCP's, the first I shot mostly WWB through for the first hundred rounds or so. Not for breakin, but rather it was cheap to shoot. Got some Hornady CD and put 4 mags through it, no problem.

Second LCP, I've only shot JHP though it without a single issue. I believe it was Remington UMC JHP. I found some cheap and wanted to shoot.

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Rod
M&P 22A, 40c, 15A, 15-22