|
|
09-15-2017, 11:45 AM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
|
|
First range day SportII. Problems
Took my new sport2 out to the range to sight it in. I am new to the at-15 platform, and have shot riffles in the past but never sighted one. I was excited! I read about how to do it, watched videos on how to do it, set the sites to "mechanical zero". Arranged for an expierenced friend to go with me to help. Brought 100 rounds of ammo, targets, table and a rest, chair, and headed to the range. I set up targets, shot my EDC. Then I prepared for sighting in the AR. I set up my target, mesured back 25 yards, set up table and rest, loaded 3 rounds and fired. Low and left, adjusted sights accordingly, 3 more rounds, low and left, but closer. Repeat as above and get the vertical aim dead on, it just won't center left to right. I adjust the Magpul rear sight, fire again, nothing, still left. This repeats several times, I cannot see the sight moving, but keep telling myself it has to be moving slightly, it's Brand NEW! Frustration ensues. Now at this point I forgot to mention that my expierenced friend was unable to join me at the range, so I am going it alone.
From expierence I have learned that when you think you are doing everything right and not getting the results you expect you need to step back and evaluate the situation, so I laid the AR down and went back to putting rounds through my EDC.
After 100 rounds through my EDC (s&w SD40VE) I went back to the AR with the same results. More frustration, did some rapid fire, just to let off some steam, reloaded some steel case ammo (different brand, was using brass before) 24 rounds into the steel case (84 total rounds for the day over a 2 hour period) I get a FTE, case jambed on the breech, unable to extract. That ended my day.
So my questions are 2 fold
1. Has anybody had or heard of a bad sight from the factory that won't adjust left to right?
2. Do you think that the round count was high enough to heat the barrel to point that a steel case would jamb in the breech?
Sorry for the long post, especially for a first post.
Yjmoose
|
09-15-2017, 12:09 PM
|
|
US Veteran
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Grays Creek, NC
Posts: 253
Likes: 18
Liked 138 Times in 91 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yjmoose
Took my new sport2 out to the range to sight it in. I am new to the at-15 platform, and have shot riffles in the past but never sighted one. I was excited! I read about how to do it, watched videos on how to do it, set the sites to "mechanical zero". Arranged for an expierenced friend to go with me to help. Brought 100 rounds of ammo, targets, table and a rest, chair, and headed to the range. I set up targets, shot my EDC. Then I prepared for sighting in the AR. I set up my target, mesured back 25 yards, set up table and rest, loaded 3 rounds and fired. Low and left, adjusted sights accordingly, 3 more rounds, low and left, but closer. Repeat as above and get the vertical aim dead on, it just won't center left to right. I adjust the Magpul rear sight, fire again, nothing, still left. This repeats several times, I cannot see the sight moving, but keep telling myself it has to be moving slightly, it's Brand NEW! Frustration ensues. Now at this point I forgot to mention that my expierenced friend was unable to join me at the range, so I am going it alone.
From expierence I have learned that when you think you are doing everything right and not getting the results you expect you need to step back and evaluate the situation, so I laid the AR down and went back to putting rounds through my EDC.
After 100 rounds through my EDC (s&w SD40VE) I went back to the AR with the same results. More frustration, did some rapid fire, just to let off some steam, reloaded some steel case ammo (different brand, was using brass before) 24 rounds into the steel case (84 total rounds for the day over a 2 hour period) I get a FTE, case jambed on the breech, unable to extract. That ended my day.
So my questions are 2 fold
1. Has anybody had or heard of a bad sight from the factory that won't adjust left to right?
2. Do you think that the round count was high enough to heat the barrel to point that a steel case would jamb in the breech?
Sorry for the long post, especially for a first post.
Yjmoose
|
Did you have the rear sight on the small aperture or the large? Tip of the nose on the charging handle?
Steel ammo doesn't work 100% in every rifle, clean her up real good and maybe stick with brass?
__________________
M&P15 sport II, Retired Army
|
09-15-2017, 12:15 PM
|
US Veteran
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Wylie, TX
Posts: 4,670
Likes: 1,075
Liked 3,823 Times in 2,040 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yjmoose
So my questions are 2 fold
1. Has anybody had or heard of a bad sight from the factory that won't adjust left to right?
2. Do you think that the round count was high enough to heat the barrel to point that a steel case would jamb in the breech?
|
1. You should be able to see the sight moving. You said you set mechanical zero... so turn the sight knob 15 clicks right... you should see the sight move from the center marker to the next one (and probably beyond).
2. Did you clean the rifle before going to the range? If not, break it down, clean it, and lube it...
|
09-15-2017, 02:06 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
|
|
ReAr sight small apperature. I did strip and clean and lube prior to the first range trip, as I do all new guns. I am kind of particular that I know how to clean a gun prior to firing it.
I do not see the sight moving at all, I will double check when I get home from work tomorrow.
|
09-15-2017, 02:40 PM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 1,436
Likes: 809
Liked 689 Times in 417 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yjmoose
ReAr sight small apperature. I did strip and clean and lube prior to the first range trip, as I do all new guns. I am kind of particular that I know how to clean a gun prior to firing it.
I do not see the sight moving at all, I will double check when I get home from work tomorrow.
|
You could have a bad rear sight that doesn't move.
Did you by chance max it out to one side whereas it won't move that way anymore? Is the apeture tight up against the side of the rear site? My eyes have my rear sight pretty much 3/4 of the way over to the left side of the sight. Not sure why, but it must be me. Still, it's zero'd for me and I don't normally use the irons anyway. My point is it also could be how your eyes see that rear sight too.
__________________
Still carrying my S&W 642
|
09-15-2017, 02:59 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
|
|
The rear sight was dead center when I started, I only attempted to move it 4 clicks, so it isn't maxed out either way, I should have explained that better I guess.
|
09-15-2017, 03:13 PM
|
|
US Veteran
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Grays Creek, NC
Posts: 253
Likes: 18
Liked 138 Times in 91 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yjmoose
The rear sight was dead center when I started, I only attempted to move it 4 clicks, so it isn't maxed out either way, I should have explained that better I guess.
|
You said you set the sites to "mechanical zero", that might be where we're getting that you moved the rear sight. If the rear was already centered you might have said you set the front sight.
Was your new sort bought new or used? If the rear sight doesn't work you might want to try the place you bought it from and see if they will exchange the rear sight?
__________________
M&P15 sport II, Retired Army
|
09-15-2017, 03:26 PM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Where this month?
Posts: 3,604
Likes: 264
Liked 4,215 Times in 1,714 Posts
|
|
Try moving the sight in both directions to full adjustment available. Much more than 4 clicks. If it fully moves then you are good to go.
When sighting in if your left of target adjust more than 4 clicks to get it past center and now hitting right.. then bring it back.
|
09-15-2017, 06:45 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
|
|
I did purchase it new, in the box even. I will try moving the sight, and then take it back to the local place I bought it from if need be. Thanks everyone for the advice
|
09-15-2017, 09:24 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: North Texas
Posts: 804
Likes: 86
Liked 482 Times in 300 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Yjmoose wrote:
I adjust the Magpul rear sight, fire again, nothing, still left. This repeats several times, I cannot see the sight moving, but keep telling myself it has to be moving slightly
|
What is moving is you, not the sight.
Quote:
So my questions are 2 fold
1. Has anybody had or heard of a bad sight from the factory that won't adjust left to right?
|
Yes, but that's not what's happening here.
Quote:
2. Do you think that the round count was high enough to heat the barrel to point that a steel case would jamb in the breech?
|
No. Going by your own account, you were only 6 rounds in when the problem first manifested.
Your problem is almost certainly that you are not achieving a consistent sight picture because you are too far back from the rear sight. Loosen the screw on the sight and move it back one or two spaces on the upper receiver. When in the proper place, it will be very close to your nose.
Then practice with the rifle bringing it up to your shoulder and getting your cheek at the same place on the stock each time (i.e. cheek weld).
|
09-15-2017, 09:39 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 374
Likes: 1
Liked 233 Times in 135 Posts
|
|
IN GENERAL, each click of the rear sight windage is 1/2 or 1 MOA. At 100 yards, each click will move point of impact roughly 1/2 inch (1/2 MOA) or 1 inch (1 MOA).
If your windage moves 1/2 MOA per click, that means that at 25 yards, you will need to turn the windage knob 8 clicks to change point of impact by one inch. 4 clicks will move point of impact only 1/2 inch at 25 yards
|
09-15-2017, 09:41 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
|
|
Hdwhit, I appreciate the input.
I am having two separate issues. It is possible that I was moving, and i am new to sighting in a riffle.
The Jamming issue has nothing to do with the sight I am certain about that.
|
09-15-2017, 09:44 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 374
Likes: 1
Liked 233 Times in 135 Posts
|
|
Put a couple of hundred rounds of good brass cased ammo through your rifle before shooting it with steel cased
|
09-15-2017, 10:15 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: God's Country
Posts: 4,711
Likes: 1,235
Liked 3,535 Times in 1,770 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by MistWolf
If your windage moves 1/2 MOA per click, that means that at 25 yards, you will need to turn the windage knob 8 clicks to change point of impact by one inch. 4 clicks will move point of impact only 1/2 inch at 25 yards
|
Agreed that the Magpul rear sight is approximately 1/2 inch per four clicks at 25 yards with a carbine length barrel. New shooter, new rifle, untried ammo all add up to not being able to see any movement at 25 yards.
Move the sight all the way to the right and then back to the mechanical zero. That way you will be certain the sight moves.
Last edited by MichiganScott; 09-16-2017 at 09:20 AM.
Reason: clarification
|
09-15-2017, 11:15 PM
|
US Veteran
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Wylie, TX
Posts: 4,670
Likes: 1,075
Liked 3,823 Times in 2,040 Posts
|
|
So what is the verdict... does the sight move?
|
09-16-2017, 12:22 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Texas
Posts: 647
Likes: 896
Liked 420 Times in 271 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yjmoose
I am new to the at-15 platform.....
2. Do you think that the round count was high enough to heat the barrel to point that a steel case would jamb in the breech?
|
Heya moose, welcome. Since everyone else is leaning towards question #1 Im going to give #2 a shot.
As said above...the short answer is NO.
Did you clean and lube before you went to the range?
Another thing you mentioned, hunting rifles. Hunting rifles depend on YOU to put the force into it operating (bolties), the AR has to do it by itself.
I might get flamed for this but....when you clean the BCG, lube it to a WET state on a rag, like crankcase wet, especially the insides. Give it a good wipedown to remove excess. Grease the contact points (bottom railing) and try that.
Once it gets broke in (1-200 rounds) it wont need this excessive lube treatment but in general AR's like to run wet (although many say you can run them dry).
Last edited by Dad_Roman; 09-16-2017 at 12:24 PM.
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
09-16-2017, 02:28 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
|
|
Ok, on the site issue, I just checked and it will move fully all the way left and right, I will have to get back to the range and try again.
I did clean and lube before going to the range, but the BCG was not overly "wet". Of course when the case jammed, I did not have my cleaning supplies with me to remove the stick case and continue. There was a lot of frustration on my part that day, as nothing with my new riffle seemed to be going r right
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
09-16-2017, 03:42 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Texas
Posts: 647
Likes: 896
Liked 420 Times in 271 Posts
|
|
........
Last edited by Dad_Roman; 09-16-2017 at 03:44 PM.
|
09-18-2017, 01:49 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Manassas Va
Posts: 437
Likes: 1
Liked 182 Times in 127 Posts
|
|
I used to shoot a lot of steel ammo and had cases sticking in the chamber. So I bought a 3/16 brass rod at the hardware store and cut it down to about 20 inches. I keep it in my rifle bag and use it to remove stuck cases. I still have a case of steel to work through so I take maybe 4 boxes of steel and 4 of brass w/ me. I shoot the steel first and switch over to brass after I get stuck case. I have also shot MFS brand which is steel but plated w/ zinc. Seems to work more reliably than the Wolf **** and is still inexpensive.
MFS 223 Remington 55 Grain Full Metal Jacket
Now that you have confirmed that your rear sight actually does move I suspect you will be fine.
|
|
Posting Rules
|
|
|
|
|