Zeroing rifle

Rastoff said:

Never attempt to zero a firearm with just one shot.

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MichiganScott said:

I'm one that believes in shooting at the center of the target and then adjusting the reticle until the POI coincide with POA. Most of us don't get anywhere as much trigger time as we want, so any excuse to send more lead downrange without just making noise is acceptable.

One shot and then adjusting the reticle to the bullet hole; what fun is that? Besides, unless you shoot a minimum of three shots the point of impact is in question due to statistical variation.

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You may be missing the point, and may not understand how it works in practice.

For getting an initial round on the paper, with the target 10-25 yards downrange, you're looking for a point of impact that is between 1.5" (10 yards) and 1" (25 yards below the point of impact for most center fire rifle rounds, and a scope height (distance between center of bore and center of scope) in the 2" ball park.

At those ranges, group size should be too small to worry about, unless you are an awful shot, and in that case finding the mid point of the "group" can be flawed if one of the three shots was actually well executed. At those ranges, you should be talking 1 hole groups.

Take one shot, then adjust to the appropriate spot below the point of aim. Then take another shot and see if the point of impact is indeed where it is supposed to be. If not, make the necessary adjustment - which should be pretty small, and fire a third shot to confirm.

Even if the scope adjustments are perfect, if the cold bore or a clean bore shot goes some where other than the rest, it'll be a 3 shot process rather than a 2 shot process.

Then take your target to the 100 yards line and shoot a 3 shot group. Adjust that group as needed to get the point of impact you need for your preferred zero and shoot another 3 shot group to confirm it.

In short, you're looking at between 8 and 9 rounds total to got from initial bore sighting to confirming your zero.

Then if you have a suitably long range you can place a target at your actual long range zero (if it is not 100 yards), or if you are using a 100 yard basic zero and are using a BDC reticle or scope adjustments for longer ranges, you can fire a group at that longer range to confirm you're actually getting the results you expect.

Now we're at 12 rounds minimum, and 15 if you've made an adjustment - and each round in meaningful practice, in stead of just guessing your way to an initial bore sight and zero.

MichiganScott said:

I'm one that believes in shooting at the center of the target and then adjusting the reticle until the POI coincide with POA. Most of us don't get anywhere as much trigger time as we want, so any excuse to send more lead downrange without just making noise is acceptable.

One shot and then adjusting the reticle to the bullet hole; what fun is that? Besides, unless you shoot a minimum of three shots the point of impact is in question due to statistical variation.

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I think so.

After initial zeroing, it's likely that the shooter will still end up further fine tuning zero based on general patterns being revealed that weren't apparent during the zero process.

I think the most important thing is familiarity with how the scope adjustments work, direction and amount of movement, and initial target being close. The idea here is to avoid unneeded frustration and enjoy the process, not dread it.

Nearly every scope manufacturer has directions on how to do exactly this. It works perfectly. The also will let you download small targets with squares that will tell you exactly how to at what yardage and what a "click" means to get your crosshairs on target.
Here is a good example.
How to Zero Your Aimpoint Sight

BB57 said:

You may be missing the point, and may not understand how it works in practice.

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You may well be the one missing the point, The way the OP phrased his question it could be assumed that he was talking about final zero. Even if he wasn't I firmly believe that a rifle should be zero'd at a usable range for the rifle/scope/cartridge combination. The 25 or 50 yards zero commonly mentioned is a battlefield zero good for combat but is of limited usefulness for hunting or targets.

It works well to first shoot at 25 yards to find out where impact is or else you may well miss the target completely at longer ranges. More than once I've had to move in to twelve yards to get holes on target because of poor alignment of the scope and barrel. Iron sights on an AR are most commonly 2.6 inches high for removable sights on a carbine and 2.8" high on a fixed carry handle type sight. Most scope mounts on an AR are at a height that mimics the distance above the bore with irons.

Low mount scopes on bolt guns are usually 1.5" above the bore, but as mentioned, may be as high as 2" on higher mount scopes. All of this must be taken into consideration. An inch low at 25 yards may work well with a low mounted scope but will throw bullets high at 100 if you are sighting in an AR.

The OP is obviously a new shooter or one new to AR's. I have seen more than one once a year deer hunter unable to put three shots in a two inch group at 25 yards. The question then becomes exactly where is the actual POI. Everything needs to be verified.

MichiganScott said:

You may well be the one missing the point, The way the OP phrased his question it could be assumed that he was talking about final zero. Even if he wasn't I firmly believe that a rifle should be zero'd at a usable range for the rifle/scope/cartridge combination. The 25 or 50 yards zero commonly mentioned is a battlefield zero good for combat but is of limited usefulness for hunting or targets.

It works well to first shoot at 25 yards to find out where impact is or else you may well miss the target completely at longer ranges. More than once I've had to move in to twelve yards to get holes on target because of poor alignment of the scope and barrel. Iron sights on an AR are most commonly 2.6 inches high for removable sights on a carbine and 2.8" high on a fixed carry handle type sight. Most scope mounts on an AR are at a height that mimics the distance above the bore with irons.

Low mount scopes on bolt guns are usually 1.5" above the bore, but as mentioned, may be as high as 2" on higher mount scopes. All of this must be taken into consideration. An inch low at 25 yards may work well with a low mounted scope but will throw bullets high at 100 if you are sighting in an AR.

The OP is obviously a new shooter or one new to AR's. I have seen more than one once a year deer hunter unable to put three shots in a two inch group at 25 yards. The question then becomes exactly where is the actual POI. Everything needs to be verified.

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^^^ This.

For my AR rifles I have a pattern down on zeroing. I redneck bore sight the upper and optic at home down my long hallway (take out bolt, look down barrel and focus on a small object while upper is set on a fixed surface, adjust optic to the same small object seen down barrel). I then go directly to the 100 yard range and hang up a 3' x 2' white paper piece with my bullseye target in the middle. With the the redneck zero, I can get on the white paper at 100 yards almost always. One shot at at time to start. At my range I can't walk downrange and measure so I eyeball how far my shot is off. I adjust and then shoot again noting my POI movement. Repeat until you are around the bull. This really only usually takes me 5 shots or so. Once I'm sniffing the bull I then go to my 3 shot pattern to fine tune it.

The hardest part can be just getting on paper as @MichiganScott said, once that's done the rest is easy.

Yeah, I guess I'm not getting the point. I mean, sure we all love to shoot, but why waste time and ammo chasing zero?

If you bore-sight the gun properly, there's no need to waste time shooting at 25 or 12 yards. I've shot with plenty of optics, both cheap and really good ones. I've never had any trouble hitting an 8.5"x11" piece of paper with the first three shots. I've zeroed at 50 and 100 yards this way many times.

Ok, one time I did have trouble, but it turns out the barrel needed to be replaced on that gun.

Do we need to go into how to bore sight the gun?

Interesting posts on how various people zero. Having been trained first by the Boy Scouts (WW II vets) and then by the Army I think 25 yard shooting is very important to a shooter developing proper technique. If you can't shoot small groups at 25 yards to get your zero it won't be worth anything at longer distances. Competitive shooters go through huge amounts of ammo perfecting technique and learning what works for them. Practice makes perfect and live fire is the best practice.

Rastoff said:

Yeah, I guess I'm not getting the point. I mean, sure we all love to shoot, but why waste time and ammo chasing zero?

If you bore-sight the gun properly, there's no need to waste time shooting at 25 or 12 yards.

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This old Tennessee boy takes aim at a piece of debris, rock or weed on a dirt bank at 50yds. Click. See dirt splat and adjust accordingly. Next shot on paper. Costs about 30 cents and takes no time. For me, I consider bore sighting (looking through the bore, lasers or those bore sight scope thingies) an unnecessary step, waste of time/money. For others, it may be a very useful, efficient and cost effective step in zeroing their rifle.

This goes full circle to the OP's original question of only one correct way to do something.

ChattanoogaPhil said:

This old Tennessee boy takes aim at a piece of debris, rock or weed on a dirt bank at 50yds. Click. See dirt splat and adjust accordingly. Next shot on paper. Costs about 30 cents and takes no time. For me, I consider bore sighting (looking through the bore, lasers or those bore sight scope thingies) an unnecessary step, waste of time/money. For others, it may be a very useful, efficient and cost effective step in zeroing their rifle.

This goes full circle to the OP's original question of only one correct way to do something.

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This gets a double "Like".