EDIT: I'VE GOT IT!



I've avoided get one thus far, mostly because I wasn't exactly enthusiastic about getting the "Assault Rifle" that the all the anti-gunners have been gunning for since, well...Forever. However, I've realized that it makes little sense to deprive myself of a firearm for such a reason. Besides, those creeps haven't succeeded yet, despite their best attempts with no shortage of scum-bags using them for all manner of violent crimes nor coffins of shooting victims for them to use as soapboxes to shamelessly push their agenda.

Besides, I'll most likely be using it as my Designated Boat Defense Battle Rifle, for use against Water Moccasins, Pirates, and Great White Sharks, so I may end up losing it regardless in some form of unfortunate accident. What's important is that I have it with me when it counts, better for it to go down with the ship after frantically shooting holes in the boat to get the Water Moccasins, fall overboard after a battle with Pirates, or end up in the belly of a Great White Shark than for me to lose my life over any of the aforementioned threats because I didn't have a proper rifle to defend myself.

Anyway, I've got a couple of appointments coming up this month for a teeth cleaning as well as an eye exam, so once those are over I figure I'll treat myself afterwards buy buying a rifle, but the question is; which one?

Obviously, I'm a big fan of Smith & Wesson, so an M&P15 is the first one that comes to mind. Not only are they affordably priced, but they're frequently available at a discounted price because there are often Police trade-ins floating around. However, I'm unfamiliar with ARs, so I'm curious to hear from others.

NOTE: I know that it's widely considered to be best to build one yourself, but I'm really not interested in doing so, I'd rather just buy one pre-built. I'm not looking for anything too special anyway, just a basic AR Pattern Rifle.

EDIT: The choice has been made! I have placed an order for a police trade-in M&P15X!

More details on Post #111

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Shooting Comfort is bilateral.

The American government says you don't need an AR-15.


Get two.

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RM Vivas
SWCA#1482L, SWHF#837

The M&P 15s are decent rifles. If you can find them for good prices, all the better. Building one is fun and you can tailor it however you want, but for a basic AR the Smiths are fine.

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The best I can with what I got

Smith & Wesson M&P15T vs Colt LE6920 Help | Sniper's Hide Forum

A lot of good opinions in that older thread. My purpose of posting it was to show you that you really can't go wrong with one GOOD maker over another.
You can add to yours, or not as you like.

My advice would be to figure out what you think you would want to use it for, and then figure out what attributes the rifle will need to work best in that role.

My advice is worth exactly what you pay for it. But for an all-purpose AR, something with a 5.56 chamber with a 16" barrel and mid length gas system usually fits the bill. I tend to suggest something with a free float rail and flip up sights vs a fixed front sight post, as it makes switching things down the road easier.

Now, there are lots of options that meet that criteria, so the price you are willing to spend will narrow it down to the best options for you.

Visually things don't look too different as you go up the price range usually, but the materials used and testing they are put through improves. There usually is a sweet spot in the mid tier range where you get quality components, without just paying for a name.

Then they should follow Joe Biden's advice by arming the Secret Service with 12 Gauge Side-by-sides then firing two blasts in the air to scare off any terrorists who come after them.

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Shooting Comfort is bilateral.

This is exactly the reason you SHOULD get one. I held off until 2013 when the POTUS at the time started calling for a ban after Sandy Hook. Now I own 5 ARs including the 2 pistol ARs.

S&W M&P 15 Sport II is an excellent choice for your first one.

Get one or half a dozen. I have Colts, PSA’s, and a Smith.

I use them for hunting and plinking.

Every well stocked gun owner should have at least one AR-15 or M4.

Watch out, they tend to multiply in the safe. I built my first AR right before Obama got elected the first time. I started with an M&P stripped lower receiver. I would agree with what others have said, the M&P is a great rifle, if all you are wanting is a basic rifle. My guess is if you like it at all, it won't be long before you will want to start making some changes - or adding some different caliber uppers to it. It is the barbi doll of guns afterall. I'd have to go check to see exactly how many I'm up to, seriously, they multiply.

I was of the exact same mindset myself just 3-4 years ago.
Then I finally came to the conclusion that I wanted one SPECIFICALLY because the Anti-2A crowd DIDN'T want me to have one. They might try to take it away, but why should I cave to THEM?
So I bought a lower and a PSA upper with a lower builid kit.
For just about $350 I got to put one together and learn them inside & out.
You might want to reconsider building your own. No better way to get intimately familiar with how they work and are put together.
JMO...

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Send lawyers, guns & money...

True story!

The kits are fun to put together and will give you an understanding of how everything works. You can put together a kit with an assembled upper without any special tools.

Assembled rifles are just as fun!

12 ga slugs are best for big sharks.

Had handguns and long guns since I was legally able to purchase them, but never had any interest in any military rifles or civilian copies.

Then the democratic Maryland governor, Martin O’mally stated he was going to outlaw certain “assault weapons.

I went out and bought a Colt AR15 that week. Changed the stock and forearm and added a red dot optic. Sighted in with standard NATO ammo, it’s very accurate to 100 yards.

Truth be told, I don’t shoot it anymore. It sits in the safe until my brothers and nephews beg to bring it to range.

If you want one, really know what you will use it for. Then look at the options in that category. Example, home defense, hunting, long range shooting ect.

Oh, and as others mentioned, the 12 ga shotgun is the choice for a boat gun. Center fire bullets can ricochet off the water surface and travel over a long distance.
Good luck

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2B1ASK1

I’m not AR fan either but have nothing against them. I just could see no reason for me to have one. I have rifles from 22s to 45/70, 375H&H. Nice classic rifles that are deadly accurate. People always amazed that I didn’t have AR-AK ect.
Little over year ago caught good deal on forum and bought PSA carbine. Back aways I got good bit of trigger time on M16. This 16” PSA is like a brick compared to original M16a1 we were issued
Flat top, little pugey had guards. I didn’t like it. Put M16 style stock and handle on it. Doesn’t shoot bad but weighs to much for what it is.
PSA is suppose to have bought H&R, which was the maker of the M16a1 we had in RVn. If they do I will sell my carbine and get AR on M16a1 pattern. Finished gun should be in 5lb area. Longer barrel version and drop foreward assist would shave weight. That was the beauty of the rifle, light and accurate. I know quite a few guys who would buy stockers, they have no interest in bells and whistles. They only want one for nostalgia value and if it’s needed will still be as good as a tricked out version.

That kind of thing doesn’t interest me too much.

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I periodically think about getting an AR platform.

Then I realize that I can’t imagine what I’d use it for.

New owners tip;

30 round magazines are easily available and often on sale on-line from places like Brownells. One doesn’t have to look back very far for past magazine panics and how States like Colorado are banning them

Storage tip;

A 50 caliber military surplus ammo can will hold 10 30 round magazines such as Magpul with room for loose ammunition or preload the mags. The cans are water and air tight, can withstand very rough handling and are convenient to store in a closet or on a boat.

Boaters tip;

The ammo cans will most definitively not float.

For the same reason you have a fire extinguisher in your home. When a fire occurs that is not the time to go out and buy a fire extinguisher.

Amen.
Bought a Del-Ton AR three years ago. Paid $439 out the door.
Bought six 30 round mags, enough ammo to fill’em. Fired a mag full thru it to make sure bullets come out.
Cleaned it, put it back in the safe and haven’t fired it since.
BUT, I have it should I need it and who knows what those boneheads in Washington may or may not do despite the support we’ve been recently getting from SCOTUS.

I bought mine strictly as a tool for civic engineering if things come to that. Sighted in and bought 2k ammo. If somebody would dangle a nice classic rifle of interest to me they could talk me out of it easy.

Never liked them. Bought one in case of civil emergency because of common usage, fired it enough to make sure it worked, and now it is mothballed. Not even sure which safe I left it in to collect dust.

The US passing over the FAL for the inferior Armalite was the greatest injustice and mistake of small arms history.

Colt, Smith, BCM, Aero Precision, all make good rifles.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The Colt LE6920 (M4) is pretty much the standard all others are judged by. I prefer the LE6720 due to the lighter barrel. I have a S&W M&P15 too and it’s a “good enough” carbine.

While I have several AR’s is various configurations I haven’t (and won’t) assemble my own and trust my life to it. The closest I’ve come to that is when I bought an assembled BCM lower, replaced the trigger (with a Geissele) and purchased a fully assembled BCM mid-length upper (fully floating barrel) and it is the most accurate AR I own. BCM makes good stuff.

I currently have two AR-15s. A Rock River LAR-15 and a S&W M&P-15 Optics Ready Sport II. I like both of them, but if I was only going to take one of them to the range, the S&W would win out due to not having the fixed front sight in front of the scope.

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Dave Brown
SWCA #3279

An excellent reason to get one or more!
I bought a Radical Arms AR, made in Texas. I went in my local FFL to browse, my wife (who formerly was a bit paranoid about guns prior to the so called "mostly peaceful demonstrations" and push for defunding the police), strongly encouraged me to get the AR while we can.
Good for home defense along with the pistols.

You can put together one that suits your needs. My eyes can't see anything without magnification. I have a couple 6920's, this is more useful. Joe

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Wisdom chases me; I'm faster

Based on your lengthy post, a basic S&W should meet your desire.

Many AR buyers choose to replace the standard mil-spec furniture with various other brands. It can cost $100.00+/- to put a Magpul brand stock/grip/hand guard/trigger guard on an AR. Matrix Diversified Industries six piece kits of Magpul furniture can be found in various colors and patterns starting around $56.00 + shipping.

The first and third have MDI kits.

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I only have one, a S&W that I bought around a dozen years ago. Put a 4x scope and decent trigger on it. Sighted it in and stuck it back in the safe with six loaded magazines.

Early this spring a buddies cousin came over from Ireland so we went to the range and he got to play American citizen with an AR. He loved it and is now showing all his " mates" videos of him shooting it.

I was a bit surprised it was still grouping tight at 50 yds. POA/POI. Plus all the pre loaded mags functioned perfectly. Reloaded the mags, cleaned the gun and back in the safe. A friend from 60 years back will be visiting from New Jersey this winter. We plan on a range trip so he can make believe he's still an American citizen.

Still only have one AR in the safe but the J frames are reproducing.

Several years ago, realizing I had no experience with ARs of any kind, I became curious. The trite and adolescent reasoning "because the government says I shouldn't have one" didn't play into my decision to purchase three new Colt ARs. As a long-time handloader, a completely new venture into load development was what motivated me.

I bought Colt products because they've been making ARs longer than all the rest of the companies, small and large, who have been merely making copies of the Colt products. I figured the Colts would hold value better than the rest should I want to sell them if I lost interest in ARs.

I wouldn't consider assembling one on my own. Some of these may be excellent guns, some may be junk, but resale value overall is likely the poorest of any ARs.

For six months, I worked with my basically unaltered out-of-the-box ARs (except for scopes on two and an aperture sight on one that came without a rear sight). All these guns turned out to be quite accurate and functioned as they should with no problems. I fired several thousand rounds of handloads through these guns. I tried samples of about ten or twelve factory ammos and found them all to be a waste of money for anyone with a serious interest in accuracy with the exception of two or three expensive match ammos which generally equalled the accuracy of well-developed handloads.

In conclusion, I found the ARs offered nothing whatsoever over a good bolt-action .223 except the shooter can fire aimed shots a little faster and they have a greater magazine capacity. I'm not going to war and don't fantasize about it. Bolt-actions are more than adequate for me but may not be for others.

My ARs will eventually be sold as I don't shoot them. If I was to consider keeping one, it would be the A4 version with the fixed stock and no scope. It has a far more useful 20" barrel which gives better velocity and handles well, much better than the shorter barrel guns. I think these guns have superior looks without optical sights of any kind, just as they were originally designed.

I'll not criticize AR folks as our tastes are all different, but for a newcomer wanting to try out ARs, spend a bit more and go with a Colt product for reasons already listed.

I loaded 250 rds of GI dupe / 55gr FMJ. Only because I had split 500 bull bullets several years back. Charged with BL C2. Then decided didn’t want to use up powder & primers on them so just bough 2k Mil spec.
I’m not going to match shoot and my loads aren’t going to make any gain in long run. In my experience there was never any accuracy problems with GI ammo. We didn’t shoot bullseye with m16, pop ups. I would say 60% shot Sharp Shooter, 20% Marksman and 20% expert.

For many, that level of accuracy is sufficient. Spending a litle more for good bullets and doing careful load development will usually show a very significant increase in accuracy, even with a new straight-out-of-the-box gun, alleged horrible trigger and all.

A lot of experienced bolt-action guys demand good accuracy and expect any gun, semi-auto or otherwise to do the same. Others just don't have a need or interest and that's fine, too.

I’m what you might call one of those experience bolt guys, along with the various other actions from Hornet to 375H&H-45/70. Like I said I have no intention of hunting or Target shooting with it.
The purpose and degree of accuracy called for is provided by good brand of Milspec.
I weight each charge for rifle cartridges on scale. Set charge light and trickle 0. Handgun - check every 10th charge dropped.
Not willing to do all that for AR. I might if I had a fancy Target job
Would rather use the time loading for a bolt gun.
Hell, I know a guy loading for a Colt AR that is dumping out Sierra bullets and weighing each one on a Lee Balance beam Scale and culling out the “bad” ones. He ask me if I had anything he could barrow to check bullets for “round”. Ridiculous. You may gain a little tighter group and that may be a factor in Target shooting the average AR shooter ain’t bullseye shooting.

I have several Colt AR/M4 carbines of various styles...all are perfectly reliable and accurate. I have a Remington 788 in .223 which is incredibly accurate and consistent with white box ammo. It's a 1:12" rate of twist so 55 grain is what it shoots...the others with tighter twists use heavier bullets so it's not a fair comparison. The 788 has a reputation for shooting above its price class and this one certainly does.

Comments about assembled guns are well taken. A proper selection in parts and careful assembly is required. You don't just buy a bunch of parts from various manufacturers and expect them to just go together and shoot well. Different tolerances...different quality control...all affect how the final product will perform.

There are a lot of AR/M4 carbines on the market from any numbers of companies...some out of business. During the panic buying the last decade there were a number of start-ups trying to take advantage of the high prices and were buying excess capacity parts from suppliers that sometimes had sketchy quality control. Once the buying spree ran out some of these companies closed their doors leaving anyone who had a problem gun out in the cold.

Be careful out there when it comes to guns with little known names on them...you might be buying a problem but you also might get a good one.

I didn't 'need' one. Until I shot an AK and didn't care for it. Then I shot an AR and was HIGHLY impressed with the comfort and ergonomics. So I got two. It's now on the list of one of my 'funnest' guns and accompanies me on most range visits. It's economical for a rifle, too. I shoot .223 because at 25 to 100 yards (Max) it's plenty powerful enough.

Note: Another kicker was when they said they were going to 'ban' them. I put together the two lowers and for expediency bought the assembled uppers. Now I'd like to go back and do an 'upper'.

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"He was kinda funny lookin'"

I'll say this, you most definitely should have at least one. As far as the S&W ARs, you can't go wrong with them. I have three different versions of M&P15 rifles and have never had a single issue with any of them.

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Find a way or make one.

I made the acquaintance of the AR family way back in the last century and while I didn't like it, I carried it where, when and as issued. Naturally, this also involved a few from different makers. Product improvement and mission creep changed what had been a light handy rifle, to one heavier, more robust and reliable. Over the decades I came to appreciate it's good points.

So, the M&P15 (NOT the Sport) will run right along side a properly built Colt (they've had their QC issues over decades). Based upon watching a variety of makes perform-or fail to-in various training settings, I have an extremely short list of makers I'm willing to spend my own money on. I also personally prefer the mid-length gas system to the carbine, assists reliability. The S&W is a good product, go for it! My preferences in furniture are a Mag-Pul hand guard and a BCM pistol grip that has both the filler at the rear and an angle similar to that of a 1911.

BTW, get some of both the 20 & 30 round mags. The 20's are a bit handier and if you use a couple different types of ammo, you tell which is which by what magazine you've got in your hand.

Every serious gun owner should have, among other guns, an AR-15 of some sort, along with an AK-47 of some sort, a .30 something caliber bolt action rifle, a .22 something bolt action rifle, a 9 mm and .45 ACP pistol, a 12 gauge shotgun, a .38/.357 magnum revolver, and a .22 revolver . . .

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Wisdom comes thru fear . . .

The first black rifle I owned was a Arsenal SGL21-61 (AK clone based on a stamped Russian receiver). I loved shooting it for the shear reliablity and simplicity. However, I was just never quite satisfied with the accuracy which was, at best about 2 to 3 MOA (not bad for an AK). So very late in life, I bought a Colt M4 after bad mouthing the AR platform for a few years, and was pleasantly surprised with the inherent accuracy with just iron sights and coexistent Vortex red dot sight. After that, I was hooked and have since acquired and built several AR rifles (no pistols yet). My favorite is this one pictured. Anderson receivers, Spike's Tactical parts, Giessele G2s trigger, Midwest Industries MLOK rail and Odin Works stainless barrel in .223 Wylde. All this put together by yours truly at the ripe old age of 69. I reccomend doing it much earlier in life. Nevertheless, it shoots like a dream sighted per the Vortex Spitfire prism scope instructions at 100 yards. Ammunition was Hornady .223 55 grain V-Max.

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There are about half a dozen in my safe - not including the 15-22s. Smith, DelTon, ATI, and a couple assembled from parts. There's also a 9mm "sort-of" AR by PSA. They all work reliably with hundreds to thousands of rounds through them.

Have somewhere around 24 magazines and plenty of ammo stocked. My son says we could fight off an army with what I have. Maybe, but only a poorly trained one and not for long.

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Or something like that . . .

I can agree on building an ar instead of buying. I have one store bought ar15 and it's a rock river armory. I have not had a single issue with it. I have 4 that I've built though and with the exception of my .50 Beowulf, they've been great. The 7.62×39mm may need a better firing pin, but otherwise, they all cycle and fire as they should. As long as you're getting a "common" caliber(.223/.556, .300aac), most build kits will be decent quality and function well without any tuning necessary. If you're set on buying one though, I've heard great things about the ruger, FN, S&W, Springfield offerings.

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Please no more EZs...

Back in 1972 Uncle Sam put a M-16A1 in my hands. I didn't particularly like it. Swore I'd never own one.
But in 2018 the antis were screaming about banning them again. I caught a M&P-15 on sale at Buds, so I bought one simply to have one and piss 'em off.
Then two years ago I stumbled across a really good deal on a used Colt A2 Sporter. I just couldn't turn it down. I put a set of triangular handguards on it and now it kinda fills the nostalgia spot for my old Army days.
Honestly, I don't shoot them much. And more often than not, when I do, its with the CMMG .22lr conversion in it.
Anyway, I have two ARs and no real desire to add any more. But I dare anybody to try to take 'em.
So I guess I'm saying that every gun owner should have one if for no other reason than they don't want you to.

Funny thing, an old friend called me the other day to tell me he finally bought an AR and he said he got "the good one". I'm thinking, "DO WHAT?"! He's very proud of the fact that he bought a Colt. I was amused.

Bushmaster
Stag

Two more good makers right there, never mind getting one built to your own specifications or DIY (not me, not handy enough, my personal problem )....

I was fixing to buy a fancy shotgun a few years ago but it go sold before I got there so I had a Bushmaster M4 customized....



It's upside down; I don't know how to fix that.

Anyway, some time later I loaned it to a friend........oops..... after he put a night scope on it he wanted to keep it. Okay, then, $$$ happened and then this happened:

Bushmaster X15 ES2

Too good a deal to pass up........



There are plenty of "good ones" out there........



But, sorry Muss, I can't talk myself into an AK-47, I don't see the point of having one of those.....and they define ugly!

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Come and take it!!

Get one or two. You do not need to have a reason to get one. Just like peple who own luxury cars. Its your money spend it how you please. They have reasonable price now. I would not get one with to many bells and whistles on it. A red dot sight to start with. You can figure out what you want as you become more familiar with it.

I forgot to mention Stag. Stag and Aero…both come out of the same warehouse, both are owned by the same capital group.

I’ve got a 20” Stag myself.

I have reasons why I don’t build my own AR’s. For starters it requires a few special tools in order to do it right. It also requires knowledge on how to do it right (& I have no interest to assembling them for others). In addition I wouldn’t trust my life to a firearm that wasn’t built by a professional. The closest I’ll get is buying assembled proven quality uppers and lowers separately and putting them together.

Yeah, FWIW its a pretty mature platform, in technological terms.
Putting one together isn't rocket science.
But to each his own....

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Send lawyers, guns & money...

I'm on record as being agin DIY. Besides the special tools & gauges-some of which aren't available to the general public- there's the QA/QC thing. Everybody makes a part or few that just aren't quite right. Might not be a significant issue, might be. When you buy from a quality maker, you get better QA/QC (They randomly check parts they get in to make sure they're getting what they paid for.) and if something goes wrong, it's their problem and THEY fix it. You put it together, it's your problem and more of your $$$$.

What's supposed to happen with parts that don't meet all specs is that they get scrapped. OTOH, when the money's tight, some that don't meet all the really picky specs might get shipped. Then, if the money's tighter, what's considered an insignificant deviation can get flexible and the price might get really friendly (such a deal I've got for you) to a maker who's "flexible". Also, there's the scrap dealers who can get a lot more $$$ from some manufacturer who's in need.

I've watched a few DIYs come apart in competition. Fortunately, no one got hurt, but the potential was there. As just one example, watching what happens when a set screw fastened gas block blows forward was interesting. If you're betting your butt on it, you want cross pins on that gas block.

Our training regime was considered "abusive" by a number of AR makers. I've noted the names of at least one mentioned above as a "quality" maker. Not really. I won't mention names in the hopes they've cleaned up their act since. When one walked away from their warranty we turned their products into MILES guns. Only pride was at stake then.

I own two . One is my personal weapon and the other is " Unfired , new in the box ." I bought it on sale and plan on making a healthy profit on it the next time the .gov scares people and causes a panic buy .