sigma pigtail spring purpose?
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BigRich315
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After examining it for a good while, I still have no idea
Maybe I'll put it under a microscope for further study
. My 40VE likes it gone though.
Maybe I'll put it under a microscope for further study
. My 40VE likes it gone though.
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Joker84
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To make the trigger pull heavier. Considering that they are service pistols and there is no external safety my guess is that S&W did it for those reasons. I think it is useless and after awhile it will start eating into the sear housing.
Boriqua
Member
I took mine out and have fired about 700 rds since then and have never had a problem. For me it didn't seem to significantly change the trigger pull so in hindsight I should have just left it in. Polishing up my sear .. now that was a significant improvement.
I assume, FTF stands for failure to fire and not, failure to feed? sorry if it's a dumb question. Thanks for all the replies folks!
Right. I had one fail to fire with the +p+ ammo.
Never had a FTF with any other ammo and none with the +p+ since I put the pig tail back in.
The only time I have ever had a fail to fire is when I short stroke the trigger. The result is a light strike. It happened one time yesterday shooting Win/Nato. And I knew as soon as I pulled the trigger what it was going to do. The result was a tink and a very slight dimple in the primer.
setxn
Member
Sigma talk
If you hold the slide back and pull the trigger you can feel the pigtail spring , not much compared to striker spring weight.Smoothing internal parts by use or polishing make a big difference.I have had no F-T-Anything with various ammo brands.Trigger has been smoothed in with moly-disulide suspended in a light gun oil and hundreds of dry fires.This little inexpensive pistol does very well for what it was designed to do,and even better with a smooth trigger.I'm sure the $600,700,800,900,1000,100& 1200 and up pistol can make a case against a Sigma,but for affordability,ease of use,accuracy,ergonomics and it's just plain fun and enjoyable to shoot it is money well spent.I bought one to take a concealed carry class,as I normally carry a revolver and didn't want to be limited in my choice of carry guns.I think the SW9VE will move up a spot if I find the right rig.
If you hold the slide back and pull the trigger you can feel the pigtail spring , not much compared to striker spring weight.Smoothing internal parts by use or polishing make a big difference.I have had no F-T-Anything with various ammo brands.Trigger has been smoothed in with moly-disulide suspended in a light gun oil and hundreds of dry fires.This little inexpensive pistol does very well for what it was designed to do,and even better with a smooth trigger.I'm sure the $600,700,800,900,1000,100& 1200 and up pistol can make a case against a Sigma,but for affordability,ease of use,accuracy,ergonomics and it's just plain fun and enjoyable to shoot it is money well spent.I bought one to take a concealed carry class,as I normally carry a revolver and didn't want to be limited in my choice of carry guns.I think the SW9VE will move up a spot if I find the right rig.
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Rick-F
Member
blastfact posted this link in another thread:
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/5386659.pdf
If you look as Fig. 2 and read the text, you will see that S&W calls this (58) torsion spring the sear spring. It will not effect feeding, extraction, or striker force. It may effect setting or reset of the sear, but if the striker is released, the presence or absence of this spring has no relationship to to striker force.
With that said, I'm not advocating the removal of the sear torsion spring. With +P ammo and a rapid fire situation, you may get a failure to reset the sear-- and when the trigger is pulled, nothing will happen, It would be very easy to recover from this failure, but a fraction of a second could mean the difference between life and death. If you use the pistol for SD, removing/altering any spring may not be advisable.
I've removed mine and I polished sear. I keep the pistol loaded and ready to fire in my home; I'm confident it will fire if I ever need it to . . . Am I 100% sure it will?-- no, I am not. I worked as a quality engineer for many years in the areospace and nuclear industries; the only thing you can be 100% sure of . . . is that something will fail sometime.
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/5386659.pdf
If you look as Fig. 2 and read the text, you will see that S&W calls this (58) torsion spring the sear spring. It will not effect feeding, extraction, or striker force. It may effect setting or reset of the sear, but if the striker is released, the presence or absence of this spring has no relationship to to striker force.
With that said, I'm not advocating the removal of the sear torsion spring. With +P ammo and a rapid fire situation, you may get a failure to reset the sear-- and when the trigger is pulled, nothing will happen, It would be very easy to recover from this failure, but a fraction of a second could mean the difference between life and death. If you use the pistol for SD, removing/altering any spring may not be advisable.
I've removed mine and I polished sear. I keep the pistol loaded and ready to fire in my home; I'm confident it will fire if I ever need it to . . . Am I 100% sure it will?-- no, I am not. I worked as a quality engineer for many years in the areospace and nuclear industries; the only thing you can be 100% sure of . . . is that something will fail sometime.
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joshtank87
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Anyone know what purpose this spring is for? It shouldn't effect feeding, extraction, or striker force on primers should it?
i think they had to add more springs cuz of glock
marlin.357
Member
Think that's the wrong patent. Drawings look like a .380 blowback pistol, and (58) appears to be a part of the slide guide on the rear of the frame. Might be a Sigma .380 but still there doesn't seem to be anyting referencing this spring.
Having said that, the spring is certainly part of the sear assembly and it's purpose does appear to be in resetting the sear.
Just saying....
Rick-F
Member
rmcky
Member
Any of you Smithys have any tips on getting the pigtail spring back in? I removed mine during the F&B before I ever shot it and experienced a few light strikes when I finally got to the range. Did a little more polishing on the sear, but would like to test it both ways. Only problem is, I can't seem to figure out how to get the darned thing back in there. I can see how it's supposed to go, but can't seem to load the spring for fitment. Anyone have any tricks to accomplish this? Sure would be appreciated.
KyWstJoe
US Veteran
Buddy, I ain't no "Smithy" and it is tedious for sure. I used needle nose pliers and a paper clip in place of the pin. The paper clip was thinner and seemed to give a little more play room. I then pushed the paper clip out with the pin. Wasn't easy but I did it twice like that. Hope somebody has an easier way.
rmcky
Member
Thanks KyWstJoe. I'll give that a try. Wish I could find some sort of tube that I could compress the spring into that would allow the pin to be inserted. That little spring is a stout little devil. I didn't think much about taking it out, since so many others had success with it, but if it causing my FTFs, my gun may need it. I don't mind the trigger, so a little more tension on it won't be much of a bother. But, I've got to get it in there to tell.
hybridsquirrel
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bumping this thread up, when my friend did the trigger work on my sigma, he removed the pig tail, as well as the bigger of the 2 inside springs (the big one wrapped around the small one) He said thats how he's done trigger work on sigmas in the past, and has had no complaints. Haven't shot it yet, but without those springs and the polishing he did it feels a lot better.
edited: took it out to the range, and didn't have a hiccup with the ammo. Tried to put the springs back in my self and failed miserably. I just couldn't get the pigtail to sit back proper, tried a toothpick, zip tie cut to size, no paper clip. But my hands are bleeding so im leaving it out for the time being. heh
edited: took it out to the range, and didn't have a hiccup with the ammo. Tried to put the springs back in my self and failed miserably. I just couldn't get the pigtail to sit back proper, tried a toothpick, zip tie cut to size, no paper clip. But my hands are bleeding so im leaving it out for the time being. heh
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rmcky
Member
Don't feel bad hybridsquirrel, I couldn't get mine back in, either. Like you, I gave up when the blood from my thumb started getting in the way and making a mess of things. Good news is, I went to the range and ran another 250 flawless rounds through mine with absolutely no problems whatsoever. Like others here, I really don't believe the spring has any effect at all on the striker. It looks as if it only makes the trigger pull slightly harder. I believe the firing pin spring is the only spring that has any effect on the striker. Since I had a few light strikes on the first hundred rounds shot through my gun, I don't believe mine would be a good candidate for the lighter Wolf striker spring, but don't think the removal of the pigtail spring has had any negative effects on my gun. I didn't think it did, but wanted to try it both ways to be sure. I guess I've given up on that idea for the moment, or at least 'til my thumb heals.
hybridsquirrel
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Don't feel bad hybridsquirrel, I couldn't get mine back in, either. Like you, I gave up when the blood from my thumb started getting in the way and making a mess of things. Good news is, I went to the range and ran another 250 flawless rounds through mine with absolutely no problems whatsoever. Like others here, I really don't believe the spring has any effect at all on the striker. It looks as if it only makes the trigger pull slightly harder. I believe the firing pin spring is the only spring that has any effect on the striker. Since I had a few light strikes on the first hundred rounds shot through my gun, I don't believe mine would be a good candidate for the lighter Wolf striker spring, but don't think the removal of the pigtail spring has had any negative effects on my gun. I didn't think it did, but wanted to try it both ways to be sure. I guess I've given up on that idea for the moment, or at least 'til my thumb heals.
heh i got mine in earlier today. I cut a zip tie down to size to hold it in place on the assembly...then put it all back together and pushed it into place, held it there while I shoved the rod that holds the pigtail spring in. It pushed the ziptie out the otherside. Got it on the first try too
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