DAO with exterior safety?

I like the SD9 feel and trigger pull. Is there one with an exterior safety? Do you feel the need for one? Thanks

b1812 said:

I like the SD9 feel and trigger pull. Is there one with an exterior safety? Do you feel the need for one? Thanks

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Most self-defense (SD) carry guns do not have an external safety. In a self-defense situation, forgetting the safety is on can mean the difference between life or death. They are designed to be drawn and fired.

To compensate, they generally have a heavier, longer trigger pull to reduce the chances of an accidental discharge, as you have to WANT to pull the trigger for them to fire.

None of the guns I carry have an external safety. My brain is the safety.

No drop is going to accidentally fire a striker fired pistol. It will ONLY fire if you pull the trigger. No safety necessary.

b1812 said:

I like the SD9 feel and trigger pull. Is there one with an exterior safety? Do you feel the need for one? Thanks

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The exterior safety on a pistol like this is an answer to a question nobody asked.

Regards.

Bob

b1812 said:

I like the SD9 feel and trigger pull. Is there one with an exterior safety? Do you feel the need for one? Thanks

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Even the MA-compliant one doesn't have a thumb safety! But of course some would say it doesn't need one with a 25-pound "moonbat approved" trigger pull! It's impossible to fire anyway!

An exterior safety on a pistol is something one can refer to as a "proprietary to the user" safety, meaning, should someone other than the user get his hands on your gun, he may not be familiar enough with it to immediately shoot you with it. I knew one police officer that worked around here who carried his S&W Model 39 on safety. He was jumped,, beaten down, disarmed and left for dead because by the time the punks had figured out and flipped the thumb safety on his gun, they had also pushed the magazine release and dumped the mag, which bounced under their car. The M-39 also has a magazine safety, so the gun can't be fired when there is no mag in, regardless if the chamber has a round in it. The thumb safety saved his life, in this case.

Wouldn't happen to you, someone getting your gun? Don't be so sure. One in five American cops are killed with either their own gun or the gun taken from another cop.

Miami's P.D. did some research on this in the 1970's. The rangemaster grabbed people wandering their building and took them into the range. He had a loaded .38 Special revolver and a Colt 1911, loaded with the safety on, sitting on a table and a target hanging a few yards downrange. He told them, at the signal, to pick up the revolver and shoot it. The average time was under 2 seconds. Same drill with the 1911, the average time was 17 seconds. Sure, some of the shooters knew what a 1911 was and got the shot off quickly but others never figured it out and never got off a shot. But there was an average difference of 15 seconds. 15 seconds is time enough to put a second plan into action. If nothing else, even at my age, I can run a long ways in 15 seconds!

Some think a thumb safety will slow you down. It shouldn't. It takes much less time to the flick the safety off than it does to draw and raise your pistol, and since you can do both at the same time, working the safety while drawing the gun, it shouldn't slow you down at all, unless you are incredibly ham-fisted, in which case...

It's a simple device, a thumb safety. It takes very little practice to make it part of your draw stroke. Do you have to remember to put your finger on the trigger when your muzzle covers the target? Do you have to remember to move your foot from the gas pedal to the brake pedal when you want to stop your car? No, a little training and practice make it natural. Learning a thumb safety is in the same class of difficulty to learn. It's not rocket science.

Does this matter? Mebbe, mebbe not. What will YOUR gunfight be like?

In any event, you can have a choice in the matter when you pick your sidearm. Choice is good.

Before Glock graced the world with its presence, the vast majority of semi auto pistols had safeties, and people were able to adequately defend themselves just fine. Save the "my safety is between my ears". It's a stupid old cliche and repeated on the Internet ad nauseum because those who say it think it gives them credibility.

Safeties have saved lives. There is no debating that. There is no evidence that their presence has caused a death or injury. For every one case that you can find me that they have caused a death or injury, I'll find you 100 where they have been a benefit. Why don't rifles and shotguns get the same attitude that a safety can get you killed? Don't we use shotguns and rifles for defense as well?

My Ruger SR9 has a safety. It was bought for that exact reason. I shoot it often. And never have I forgotten to disengage it. It's so intuitive I don't even think about it. Just like I don't think about stepping on the brake pedal before I shift out of park. I don't look at the gear shift either as I shift gears.

The odds of any of us actually using a weapon in self defense are astronomical. Yet we all routinely handle weapons. Odds are much better of a negligent discharge with a safety less weapon.

Thank you. I have a sw915 and like having the safety but I am leary of the DA/SA; also I usually carry a sw640. The SD9VE double action is "lighter" than the sw640 trigger and much lighter than the DA on the 915. I am more concerned with accidental discharge with the SD915, ie. pulling from a holster, grabbing for it in a glove box. I like the SD9VE double action and am thinking of buying it but just want some feed back on the accidental discharge. Really really appreaciate all the comments I am getting. Bottom line is I need to get to the range a least once a month. So, accidental discharge is my main concern, have no idea if that is a valid concern with the SD9 or not and would love to hear from those loving and owning the SD9 regarding that. Thanks for all the comments and information, very helpful!
BH

I prefer DA/SA pistols. The safety is also used as a decocking lever. I always carry with the safety off. I chided some of my fellow deputies who carried our 4506 with the safety on, telling them it could get you killed. The firearm is safe to carry with the safety off, as are all of my DA/SA weapons. That is why I like them.

DAO guns don't have safeties

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kbm6893 said:

Before Glock graced the world with its presence, the vast majority of semi auto pistols had safeties, and people were able to adequately defend themselves just fine. Save the "my safety is between my ears". It's a stupid old cliche and repeated on the Internet ad nauseum because those who say it think it gives them credibility.

Safeties have saved lives. There is no debating that. There is no evidence that their presence has caused a death or injury. For every one case that you can find me that they have caused a death or injury, I'll find you 100 where they have been a benefit. Why don't rifles and shotguns get the same attitude that a safety can get you killed? Don't we use shotguns and rifles for defense as well?

My Ruger SR9 has a safety. It was bought for that exact reason. I shoot it often. And never have I forgotten to disengage it. It's so intuitive I don't even think about it. Just like I don't think about stepping on the brake pedal before I shift out of park. I don't look at the gear shift either as I shift gears.

The odds of any of us actually using a weapon in self defense are astronomical. Yet we all routinely handle weapons. Odds are much better of a negligent discharge with a safety less weapon.

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It's not a cliche. It's is a fact. You are the safety. Only you can pull the trigger, it will not shoot all on its own. Just as they have saved lives, idiots have also managed to bypass them. Don't believe me? Google it! Many videos of guys bypassing TWO safeties (3 if you count the person) and shoot themselves.

Some of my guns have safeties, some dont. They are optional and I bought the gun cause I like the gun and not for the safety. So far I have never used one and my guns have not gone off. Not once. Wonder why?

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I had the 915 out today, dry firing. Going back to the range...the SA pull has slack to it which is good for me....yes KSDeputy, I have carried it with safety off and felt fine with that. I need to get back to the range monthly.

kbm6893 said:

Why don't rifles and shotguns get the same attitude that a safety can get you killed? Don't we use shotguns and rifles for defense as well?

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Because in the midst of an attack, nobody is drawing a rifle or shotgun from their waistband...

Arik said:

It's not a cliche. It's is a fact. You are the safety. Only you can pull the trigger, it will not shoot all on its own. Just as they have saved lives, idiots have also managed to bypass them. Don't believe me? Google it! Many videos of guys bypassing TWO safeties (3 if you count the person) and shoot themselves.

Some of my guns have safeties, some dont. They are optional and I bought the gun cause I like the gun and not for the safety. So far I have never used one and my guns have not gone off. Not once. Wonder why?

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Yeah. You are the safety. A human being who is capable of having a brain fart and letting a round to that you didn't mean to. Professional shooters have had them. Cops have had them. Soldiers have had them. Think you can't? Think again. A manual safety doesn't negate the possibility of an ND. But it lowers it. And there is no debating that.

Not to mention unauthorized users getting their hands on the gun and not firing a shot. Remember the woman in Walmart who had her gun (M&P Shield) in the little holster pocket in her purse, taken out by her 3 year old who then shot and killed the mother? I highly doubt the woman had the safety on that gun. She probably had the no safety version, or if she had the standard model the safety was off. I don't see a 3 year old having the ability of strength to take the safety off that weapon. Pulling the trigger is intuitive. Maybe a big 1911 trigger might draw your attention. But the little bitty nub of a safety lever on the Shield? I doubt it.

Yes. The woman was negligent in taking her eyes off that gun and her child. But she was human. She made a mistake. Just like you or I can make.

Sidnne said:

Because in the midst of an attack, nobody is drawing a rifle or shotgun from their waistband...

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Oh. So only CARRY guns should be safety less? So I guess you would advocate somebody who keeps a gun in the house to have a safety?

Why don't we take a poll? How many here have actually pulled their weapon AND fired a shot?

Sorry, the SD9VE doesn't come with a safety.
You could have a qualified gunsmith add one but it's going to cost you more than a new SW M&P with one already.

As for safeties, the 8 lb trigger pull seems to be heavy enough to negate any accidental discharge. Just don't get a hair trigger and you will be fine.

I have safeties on my carry guns. Since I carry AIWB. My decision.

Do you often see a 1911 without one?

kbm6893 said:

Oh. So only CARRY guns should be safety less? So I guess you would advocate somebody who keeps a gun in the house to have a safety?

Why don't we take a poll? How many here have actually pulled their weapon AND fired a shot?

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Not sure what any of this silly rant has to do with the question you asked previously, or the answer I gave.

You're all over the place. Best of luck to you.

A little courtesy all around would help.

Sidnne said:

Not sure what any of this silly rant has to do with the question you asked previously, or the answer I gave.

You're all over the place. Best of luck to you.

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It's not a rant. And I'm not all over the place. The OP wanted to know if a DAO handgun (which the SD9 is not, but we know what he meant) could be found with a manual safety. Then rather than just answer the question, many here went into the whole "my safety is between my ears" and "a safety will get you killed" routine, so the discussion changed. I gave my opinion. I don't see them as liabilities. Before Glock came along, most semi auto pistols had them, and nobody felt like they were dead men walking because of them. There have been numerous documented cases where having a safety saved lives, and god knows how many undocumented cases because nobody got hurt and the cops weren't called.

Then when I asked why they aren't such liabilities with defensive rifles or shotguns, you said because defensive rifles or shotguns aren't carried in your waistband and called into action with little or no warning. As if nobody has ever used a long gun in self defense with little or no warning. How many here keep a long gun in the closet or by the bed, ready to be grabbed from a dead sleep after hearing glass breaking in your house. Can't get much more surprised than that.

I've been hearing "safeties will get you killed" for over 25 years. Right about the time Glock got really popular. Find me a case where that happened. I'll find you a hundred where they saved a life. Wonder why we have the term "Glock Leg"?

B1812, if you want a striker fired gun with a manual safety, they can be had. The M&P can be had with a safety, and I highly recommend the Ruger SR9. It has a nice positive manual safety, and it also has a mag disconnect, which I also like. But the mag safety can be easily taken out if you want. Very nice trigger pull too. I haven't heard much about the trigger on the sd9, but if you are carrying it as a defensive weapon, you're not gonna notice the trigger anyway. It's not a target gun.

And I'd keep that 915. No sense selling a good working gun. And if accidental discharges are your main concern, I can't imagine why you would want a striker fired gun with no safety. What's the trigger pull weight on your SD9? Glock and most other striker fired guns ship with about 5.5 pound trigger pulls. So a very light trigger pull, no hammer to rest your finger on to help prevent AD's, and no safety? Google the term Glock Leg. People putting holes in their legs as they holster their no safety striker fired guns. Plaxico Burris would not have gone to prison if he was carrying your 915 with safety on over instead of his Glock.

KSDeputy said:

I prefer DA/SA pistols. The safety is also used as a decocking lever. I always carry with the safety off. I chided some of my fellow deputies who carried our 4506 with the safety on, telling them it could get you killed. The firearm is safe to carry with the safety off, as are all of my DA/SA weapons. That is why I like them.

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I don't know about that. The safety on the 4506 is in the perfect position for a duty gun. As you approach a car or whatever and you have your hand on your gun just flick it off. It's off by the time you have it out. If you just always leave it off, it could be accidentally engaged and you would assume it is off. For me, if you're gonna carry a gun with the safety off, you either gotta use it or train yourself to flick it off as you draw even if it is already off. Assuming it is always off when it could have been bumped into on could be a problem.