CS-40 in 10 m.m. - DONE - CS-40/CS-45 Extended Magazines

bad_man_ one · Jun 15, 2011

See post #20 for the latest

OMG,
I don't know why I didn't see this sooner.

Allot of you guys and girls know that I'm always trying different things, I came across this;

I was going over some dimensions today,
I realized that the ejection port on a CS-40 is the same as the CS-45 and 10XX series,
as is the 4013 Single Stack series that I have been doing the conversions to 10 m.m.

Long story - short version, it can be made into a 10 m.m. by re-chambering and doing a magazine modification.
The only problem is a heavier recoil spring is no where to be found.
I spoke to Dave (Technical Support) @ Wolff and he said "Good Luck".
Because of my dealings in Aerospace Manufacturing for many years, I think I might have a source.
I will know better in a few days.

I tried my 8 round magazines from a 4506 in my CS-40 and CS-45, they are dimensionally the same and work like a charm.
Then, just by chance I used 4516 bases and the extensions from my ProMag 10 rd. mags on them and they made just the right fit.

For the .40 S&W;
I had to epoxy in a spacer that was removed from all the 10 m.m. - 4013 magazines that I reworked, into the back of the magazine and used the 4013 red follower
for the .40 S&W rounds to space the rounds forward and on top of each other properly and also tweak the feed lips as an added precaution.
To add to the bite of the epoxy I ground detents in the spacer and drilled some holes and detents in the magazine to lock into.
Also used spring from a 9 rd. 3906 magazine.

I may carry them in a mag holder in the winter time but for now I'll test them at the range,
fits 10 rounds of .40 S&W in them with a minor modification to the follower for the CS-40.
Regards,
BM1

In this first and second picture they had not been finished milled to fit yet, the mag is not locked in all the way, I was just playing around.
The gap at the back should not be there in the finished product.
I never thought that I was going to use this picture so much.

cmr0323 · Jun 15, 2011

CS40 & CS45 10mm Conversions

Please don't post anything else on this subject!!!

I've far over spent my budget for new pistols this year, but every time you post on this subject I start thinking about a CS45 conversion. I like 40 cal & 10mm pistols, but have no particular use for the 45ACP (no flames, please

) so I'm happy keeping all of my 40 cal pistols as 40's. But, if I were to convert a CS45, then I would have four different sizes of 10mm: 1006, 1066, 1016/4516 & CS10/45.

Hmmm..., I wonder where I could find a nice CS45 to convert.

(Can we get stronger springs for the CS10/45?)

bad_man_ one · Jun 16, 2011

CMR,
If I get a chance, I will check to see if the CS-40 Barrel is dimensionally the same as the CS-45 barrel, except for the bore of course.
By chance, if it is, then we would be all set.
It's a long shot.
I will post my findings.

The spring looks like it's going to be the problem here,
I thought I had a source, No Good.

Regards,
BM1

cmr0323 said:
Please don't post anything else on this subject!!!

I've far over spent my budget for new pistols this year, but every time you post on this subject I start thinking about a CS45 conversion. I like 40 cal & 10mm pistols, but have no particular use for the 45ACP (no flames, please ) so I'm happy keeping all of my 40 cal pistols as 40's. But, if I were to convert a CS45, then I would have four different sizes of 10mm: 1006, 1066, 1016/4516 & CS10/45.

Hmmm..., I wonder where I could find a nice CS45 to convert.

(Can we get stronger springs for the CS10/45?)

Desert Dog · Jun 16, 2011

More fun stuff... BM1 keep up the good work!

Any chance we could do something similar with the spacers for using 4506 mags with 4516/4536 pistols?

colt_saa · Jun 16, 2011

A 10MM CS40 would be a cool piece to carry.

I will have to keep my eyes open for a donor pistol.

bad_man_ one · Jun 16, 2011

The CS-40 Barrel for the .40 S&W is dimensionally the same as the CS-45 barrel,
except for the caliber bore and chamber, but it has a narrower hood.

The CS-40 barrel fits in the CS-45 because of the narrower hood.
So, theoretically it would work, it could be re-bored to 10 m.m. and it would fit in the CS-45.

My CS-45 looks like it has a more stout spring.
That shouldn't be because they take the same part number.

I have a lead on a flat spring, keep your fingers crossed, I'll know better tomorrow.
Regards,

BM1

bad_man_ one · Jun 23, 2011

Well,
It turns out that the barrel CS-40 barrel is no longer available from Smith and Wesson.

So,
If anyone has a spare that they would like to part with, please let me know.
I would like to do some testing with one before I use any of the longer spares that I have for the 10 m.m./.40 S&W barrel conversion project.

I thought getting a heavy duty spring was going to be the main concern.
I have some "Sample" flat coil springs coming in the mail.

Regards,
BM1

Desert Dog said:
More fun stuff... BM1 keep up the good work!

Any chance we could do something similar with the spacers for using 4506 mags with 4516/4536 pistols?

Email and pictures sent.
Waiting for ProMag to reply with a price on the two styles, the older, flat back and the newer tapered front, rounded back style.
I ordered more 4516/4536 "Pinkie" magazine bases today.

Shadow1006 · Jun 23, 2011

Interesting to see if that works out! I hope you have been able to get some time on the CNC machines for the conversion barrels.
Best regards!

bad_man_ one · Jun 23, 2011

Shadow1006 said:
Interesting to see if that works out! I hope you have been able to get some time on the CNC machines for the conversion barrels.
Best regards!

Shadow1006,
A CNC rough milling operation is being set up as we speak.

Regards,
BM1

Shadow1006 · Jun 23, 2011

bad_man_ one said:
Shadow1006,
A CNC rough milling operation is being set up as we speak.

Regards,
BM1

That sounds great, I wish I were closer to see that or even help out!
Thanks!

cmr0323 · Jun 23, 2011

We Want Pictures!

bad_man_ one said:
Shadow1006,
A CNC rough milling operation is being set up as we speak.

Regards,
BM1

You know, some pictures of the manufacturing process would be really great!

bad_man_ one · Jun 25, 2011

bad_man_ one said:
Well,
It turns out that the barrel CS-40 barrel is no longer available from Smith and Wesson.
So,
If anyone has a spare that they would like to part with, please let me know.
I would like to do some testing with one before I use any of the longer spares that I have for the 10 m.m./.40 S&W barrel conversion project.

I thought getting a heavy duty spring was going to be the main concern.
I have some "Sample" flat coil springs coming in the mail.
Regards,
BM1

Hey all you CS-40 owners,
I received a couple of samples of flat wire heavy duty springs today.
They are dimensionally similar (I.D and O.D.) to the stock ones, but much, much stronger.
Looks like I'll be able to do CS-40/10 m.m. conversions like the 4013/10 m.m. conversions that were done.
The difference is the magazines do not have to be modified as much as the 4013 ones had to be.
But, because there are no barrels to be found, you would have to dedicate your CS-40 to becoming a 10 m.m.

I will look into using some of the conversion barrel project barrels.
I would use barrels that have not been spoken for, because some people have not followed up with their contact informatoon.
I think I will able to maybe produce a couple/few.

Regards,
BM1

bad_man_ one · Jun 27, 2011

Found some barrels ! ! !

Update - Found some barrels ! ! !

It took some doing, lots of emails and phone calls and an "insider" at S&W.

Yes, some barrels for the CS-40 forgotten about at a very old obscure repair center and they have my name all over them.

Here is a picture of the sample springs I received.
Regards,
BM1

Shadow1006 · Jun 27, 2011

bad_man_ one said:
Update - Found some barrels ! ! !

It took some doing, lots of emails and phone calls and an "insider" at S&W.

Yes, some barrels for the CS-40 forgotten about at a very old obscure repair center and they have my name all over them.

Here is a picture of the sample springs I received.
Regards,
BM1

Sounds like you hit the jackpot! Good luck!

Scotter260 · Jun 28, 2011

You're a dangerous (in a good way) man.

Sadly I've never gotten into the 10mm but your posts are extremely interesting and it's great to see someone taking care of those who are into it.

Onisius · Jun 28, 2011

A CS10??? /faints

I want, I want.

bad_man_ one · Jun 28, 2011

Hey All,
The replies to this have been absolutely phenomenal.
I have been overwhelmed with e-mails and PM's.

I will tell ya', if you want to get in on one of these, let me know now and I will put you on a list, based on the date and time of confirmation.
Like those infomercials tell you, "Supplies are limited, so act now".
I'm hoping to get a total count today on just how many barrels there are available.
After they are gone, it will only be re-chambering your existing barrel, then it's dedicated to the 10 m.m.

It's only in the beginning stages at the moment.
I have to get the barrels and re-chamber one and do some testing with the new springs and also do a modification to the magazine and follower.
It will probably be a couple weeks, I will post some results.
I want to make sure everything will feed and function flawlessly with this little "Pocket Rocket".
Please be patient.
Regards,
BM1

P.S.
Don't forget of the capability of the extended magazines with the two styles of grip extenders.
In this picture it had not been finished milled to fit yet, the mag is not locked in all the way, I was just playing around.
The gap at the back should not be there in the finished product.
I never thought that I was going to use this picture so much.

Shown using the 4516/4536 just to show the finished newer style mag extender.

bad_man_ one · Jun 28, 2011

So today I'm trying to seal the deal on the barrels with the old repair center that had the barrels.
I'm told they had to call Smith and Wesson to "Get Pricing".

Well, this is where it started to suck.
S&W tells them that they own the barrels and not to sell them because they need them to have in stock for warranty repairs.
THEY ARE NOT FOR SALE, INTERNAL WARRANTY USE ONLY.
My heart almost fell out of my chest.

So I will re-chamber mine and do some testing with the springs.
Stay tuned,
With sad heart,
BM1

bad_man_ one · Jun 30, 2011

CS-40 and CS-45/10 m.m. UPDATE

Here we go again, digging a deeper hole, again.

I will be taking seven (7) more .40/10m.m. barrel blanks from the "Barrel Project" and shortening them to produce barrels for the CS-40 and CS-45 in 10 m.m.

It will be first come, first serve.
Those of you that have discussed it with me are already in.

BUT,
Please confirm by PM or email using ([email protected])

Regards,
BM1

bad_man_ one · Jul 9, 2011

DONE - CS-40 in 10 m.m.

Here is the latest, picked up a second CS-40 yesterday to do some testing.
CNC re-bored the chamber to ANSI/SAAMI Spec for 10 m.m.
Removed the spacer in the aft of the magazine, what a bear that was.
Added a white 10 m.m. follower and a Buffer Technologies buffer, had to shave it a little to allow lock back on empty mag.
Cut down the two samples of the test springs I received last week.
Made an extended magazine with a Pro-Mag adapter from an 8 rd. 4506 mag, had to "tweak" the feed lips and modify the follower.

I will be switching out the single sided safety to an ambidextrous safety/decocker with my other CS-40,
I need it to get a grip on both sides to rack this "Pocket Rocket"

Will try to get to the range next week.
I will keep you informed.

On a side note, I received quite a few inquiries on the 10 m.m. barrels for the CS-40/45.
But,
I'm Sorry there it not enough of a commitment to go through all the different set-ups and CNC program changes for just a couple.

Regards,
BM1

CS-40 in 10 m.m. - DONE - CS-40/CS-45 Extended Magazines

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