Thanks, Les. Just goes to show you ... even " I " can make a mistake. I can blame it on my age or eyesight but I won't because I just plain mis-read it.

If I recall correctly there was (and still should be) a basic background check prior to application being approved. I don't think it's anything super investigative but there should be some sort of qualification protocol in place.

What that protocol may currently be, I'm not sure but presume (not assume) that in the wake of all the wild fire shootings lately, I would like to think the S&WCA does due diligence in screening applicants.

Back in the day, when an applicant had to be referred by and vouched for / recommend by a tenured member of the club, it may not have been "as" intensive as it may be now.

Up until about a year ago ( if I recall correctly) a prospective member had to either be a FFL, a LEO, a current (or honorably discharged) US Veteran, or be recommended by a tenured member (member longer than probationary 1st year, i think) who signed the application to verify he has personally know the applicant for X amount of years.

I think the older way was a better method but at the 2017 Symposium it was approved that the Club would now solicit and be open for membership to the public removing the age and referral prerequisites.

There are some children members of the club now. Go figure.

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ANTIQUESMITHS
LM1300 SWHF425

I thought this was a Thread about a two digit marked Model 39.
The new membership procedure has been accepted by the general membership. Mike

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Mike 2796
SoFo Bunch member

Hoping it works out beneficially for you. It would be an interesting letter to see. Hang in there ! I think you have a nice customized piece there no matter who may have customized or done the work on it.

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ANTIQUESMITHS
LM1300 SWHF425

I agree thats one of the great options but im hopein the letter comes back with some better news than that.

I meant that perhaps it was a special order (the SN alone would be a customization) in the time frame it was likely built.

I'm still of the opinion the serial number is misplaced for S&W to number it in that fashion but, as anyone who seriously collects S&Ws knows ... if anything is true about S&W ... almost anything is possible. All depends on who knew who at the factory, I feel.

There are many, MANY, S&W anomalies out there that should not exist. Most times they are exactly what they appear to be. Other times, you just don't know.

Camfour Distributors, just a few miles from the S&W Factory, was the preferred shipping destination for employee ordered guns.

The owner of Camfour liked special order and odd featured S&Ws, he just didn't want to pay a premium price for them, so he'd order them and the employees that frequented his store would build them (knowing they were going to Camfour) with added features that weren't on the invoice.

Some real odd-balls come through Camfour. I have a double stack Steel Frame 9mm in the 62xxx serial number range, shipped to Camfour in 1966. It is stamped 39-2 with a regular 39 upper and a pair of 39 wood stocks professionally shaved to a straight back. It is essentially a 147A steel frame but 10 or more years before the 147A was released and about 50,000 serial numbers before the production model 39-2 (single stack) was released.

That only came to light in the past few years since the S&WHF has scanned in most of the old records.

Another member has one almost like this, shipped to Camfour, too. His is a much newer SN in the A147xxx, shipped in 1971 as a Mark 22 "mock up" of the Hush Puppy (Mark 22 Mod.0). This means it resembled the illusive "hush puppy" but was not a Hush Puppy. It is also Model 39-2 stamped but with the 39-2 slide, High front sight, Guarded Rear Sight and model 59 grips panels.

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ANTIQUESMITHS
LM1300 SWHF425

Wow,that is one beautifull pistol, wanna,trade????

I had lunch Wednesday with a 17 month old SWCA member. I’m sure, when she inherits her dad’s collection (which will hopefully be many decades in the furure), she’ll have a lot to contribute.

I found that in the old GunList Magazine, in the pre-internet days, about 25 or more years ago. Back then, GunList was one of the premier gun publications. It was delivered every other Friday morning before 10AM, if you ordered overnight FedEx. Naturally, on the east coast it is 10AM before it is 10AM in any other time zone. I had been taking off every other Friday morning for a few hours, at least until noon or 1PM. The S&W Section was all that mattered to me.

Many members of the S&WCA, including myself, had fractional page size advertising. Mine was about the size of a business card ( I think that was 1/16 of a page). Gary Garbrecht (RIP), at least twice as big (apx 1/8 page), and Ray Brazille (RIP) was about 2x larger than Gary's at about 1/4 page.

I saw this strange description and called the Jeweler / Gun Dealer in Springfield, Mass. immediately. He re-affirmed it was exactly as he described, not altered in any way and came from a retired and elderly S&W employee.

I was the first one that called and agreed to purchase on the spot. I called back an hour later to tell him the cashiers check was on the way via FedEx, overnight, when he explained that he'd received several other calls on it since I called. Two collectors, more persistent than the others, would not take no for an answer, offering him double, and then triple, the price to sell it to them instead of me.

So, I asked ... what now ? (figuring he'd want more money) but he said, "I told them it was sold and if they wanted it they would have to speak to you. I'll put their names and numbers in the box in case you want to sell it to one of them." And he did exactly what he said.

After that I arranged an inside line with him on any employee or odd configuration S&Ws that came his way, to call me before he listed them. That relationship lasted many years until he passed away, too, about 10 or so years ago.

S&W collector / friends are the best asset a S&W collector can attain. That and the internet access has opened a world of information that was never before known. You can contact anyone in the world with the touch of a button to learn more in a few months (if you studied aggressively) than most older, pre-internet, collectors would have learned in a lifetime. Amazing !

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ANTIQUESMITHS
LM1300 SWHF425

That is very cool. I'm assuming the mag is a 59 pattern?

It could more accurately be stated, by date of manufacture, the much later produced 59 magazine is an evolution of this 39-2 double-stack magazine but essentially ... yes.

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ANTIQUESMITHS
LM1300 SWHF425

Love it. Thanks!

Might your double-stack Model 39 be the same one featured in Dwayne Charron's book?

John?

I tried contacting Dwayne Charron several years back. His son said Dad would gladly consult on it, but after a few emails over the next 3 years, his son said his Dad could not consult on it. (that he was not physically or mentally able).

I think it was one of the 100 or so experimental high capacity frames made for a potential Navy contract that never came to be. Later these frames were used for the 147A.

The 39-1 (in house designation) became the 52-A. I feel the in house designation for the experimental high capacity was likely the 39-2 for quite awhile. But then, when the contract didn't come through to fruition, they likely scrapped the project number designation of 39-2 (high capacity) and re-assigned it to the revision of the single stack as the production Model 39-2.

I have no solid proof but it does logic if you read Roy Jinks S&W book and Dwayne Charron's book.

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ANTIQUESMITHS
LM1300 SWHF425

Hey guys a couple more photos downloaded you may want to take a look at

Wow! That packing list and box label settles a whole lot, even without the letter.

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Kevin Williams SWCA1649 HF208

Yeah I'd say it's pretty settled. Very neat piece of history there.

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Psalm 27:2

WINK! what a hoax that has been perpetrated on all of us!
Just look at the invoice and the box. Fake as ****. This guy is a KGB agent
sent here to infiltrate our club. Wink! I guess the expert was right.
You know your stuff.
Its a joke guys, we need a little humor.

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Mike 2796
SoFo Bunch member

Guess i forgot to post those 2 photos mike just recieved them a bit ago,,lol

Im thinking its allready turned out better than i thought, still waiting for the letter,

Regards

Thank you les,looking forward to it,

Regards

Yea, Yea, welcome to a really fine group.
Im not quite sure what a "customized" Mod-39 is?
I know what "personalized" is. Maybe model3sw can help me out on a definition.

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Mike 2796
SoFo Bunch member

I believe he explained his meaning in post #155. See above.

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Kevin Williams SWCA1649 HF208

Thanks kevin,

Regards

Thank you sir,

Regards,

Congratulations. Great history for a great gun. Nice to see when something good happens to a good person. Be Safe,

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I BACK OUR BLUE

Thank you,sir

Regards,

So apparantly the Aplication and check for swca has been swallowed by the US Postal service, copy of application and new check sent out today. Why cant they loose junk mail instead of the important things..

Those are 2 convincing photos. I think it’s odd that SW sold it to a company in Ohio for a NYS police officer. It is a special order however. Do you know the story there?

Also.. The long wait on the SWCA application makes more sense now.

Also.. 1 never doubted you !!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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John 1:17
NRA Life Benefactor

I believe at that time k williams.co was a police supply company, many officers purchased from various companys. Our salesman was from the midwest also, they would show up with a few sample guns in hopes of making department sales.
Usually they would "seek out" instructors to try and switch the departments to a new product. My belief is there salesman arrived with the m39 and in an attempt to sway russ they ordered this pistol.

I remember a rep showing up at our department with the then new 9mm S&W revolver. At that time we were using the S&W Highway Patrolman. One officer just had to have that revolver,so the rep gifted it to him. He still has the revolver, brand new,unused still in the box sitting in his safe!!

I haven't been able to post much in a while, but this thread got my attention. You found a great pistol there with a documented history. That will be a great addition to a collection, especially after you get the letter.

Thanks for sharing.

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J.D. Roy

Thank you sir,

Regards

So i have recieved the letter today from mr. Jinks but i guess im still confused,, the letter states the pistol left the factory with no engraving, however the shipping invoice from S&W says it was shipped engraved,, any help on this one?? Letter has been added to my album,,regards

It appears to me that the KM Williams Co had it engraved.

Chris, going to be another request to S&WHF for some records of a work order for engraving. Hang in there.

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Mike 2796
SoFo Bunch member

No, actually the letter says there is "no record" which may be an important distinction. Roy is looking at the shipping ledger, which we already have, and it does not mention the engraving. I agree it is confusing. I would recommend following up with Roy.

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Kevin Williams SWCA1649 HF208

Nice that the letter has arrived that seals the deal..and will silence any nay sayers if there were any left. You have all the documentation you need. Personally I would not worry about the engraving. The invoice says it was done. It was done... and the records at S&W that Roy uses to prepare a letter just do not. Likely an over sight at the factory. Roy may shed more light on it but to me it's a moot point. The important fact is that there is in fact a pistol with S/N 000025 that left the factory just as you said. You have documentation to show that it is authentic. More than 1 document. Congratulations. That is a pistol I would love to own. Both my brother in laws father and brother were NYS Troopers. My BILs father likely or may have known Trooper Slingerland.

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John 1:17
NRA Life Benefactor

I guess in the big picture its a moot point,, and doesnt really affect anything, it was more about the serial number. Your right kevin i misconstrued the phrasing of the letter,, i will tell you this its been one heck of a ride and ive learned alot!!!

I have seen reference to a barrel having 9mm ctg or just 9mm, Can I ask what this means?

I believe that the earlier pistols were marked 9mm ctg,and later shortened to 9mm,same cartridge just different bbl marking.

Yes, and some barrels had a hump feed ramp and some straight,
None of the slides, barrels, mags or grips had serial numbers. Parts
were getting swapped all the time. I have a German marked 39 with
the chamber marked 9mm PARA.

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Mike 2796
SoFo Bunch member

Well im officially a member in the "big boy" club!!, thanks to all!!!

Regards,
Chris

Welcome to the Collectors Association, Chris!

I just hope the membership will be more helpful to your collecting interests than they were to mine.

John

You're a good addition, Chris. Of such I'm certain.

Welcome aboard, Man.

Later.