2A Case out of DC Circuit Court of Appeals

[GaryS]

A DC Federal Court Just Ruled Carrying Guns In Public Is A "Core" 2nd Amendment Right

A federal appeals court on Tuesday struck down Washington, DC's latest attempt to limit residents from carrying guns in public.
The US Court of Appeals for the DC Circuit held in a 2-1 decision that public carrying of firearms is a "core" Second Amendment right, and that the District's regulations amounted to a "total ban" on exercising that right. The ruling breaks with several federal appeals courts that upheld similar regulations in other states.
"For that long struggle against gun violence, you might see in today’s decision a defeat; you might see the opposite. To say whether it is one or the other is beyond our ken here. We are bound to leave the District as much space to regulate as the Constitution allows — but no more," DC Circuit Judge Thomas Griffith wrote in the majority opinion.

For anyone who wants to read the entire opinion, here is the link.

 

[Watchdog]

It's interesting to me that Judge Griffith cites Heller.

He also states that, "... listening closely to Heller I reveals this much at least: the Second Amendment erects some absolute barriers that no gun law may breach."

That's pretty definitive, in and of itself. In effect, it's just another way of saying "shall not be infringed." It's a strong judicial opinion.

 

[richardw]

Thrilled to read about the decision. We are moving closer to SCOTUS hearing a case on the question of open carry. Can't happen soon enough for me.

 

[Rpg]

Thrilled to read about the decision. We are moving closer to SCOTUS hearing a case on the question of open carry. Can't happen soon enough for me.

Be careful what you wish for.

 

[ladder13]

Thank you once again Alan Gura. Also, a good reason why I financially support GOA and the SAF also.

 

[eb07]

Be careful what you wish for.

I like our chances

 

[Watchdog]

Thrilled to read about the decision. We are moving closer to SCOTUS hearing a case on the question of open carry. Can't happen soon enough for me.

Are you referring to a specific case? If so, which one?

 

[eb07]

Thrilled to read about the decision. We are moving closer to SCOTUS hearing a case on the question of open carry. Can't happen soon enough for me.

From what I read this has to do with carry outside the home period to include concealed carry permits which is the basis of the suit.

 

[bushmaster1313]

This is really BIG!

Thank you once again Alan Gura. Also, a good reason why I financially support GOA and the SAF also.

Thank you Alan Gura
First Heller
Then McDonald
Now Wrenn

Thank you Second Amendment Foundation
Second Amendment Foundation

Thank you
Joseph Tartaro
Alan M. Gottlieb
Julianne Versnel

Thank you Mathew Grace and the Pink Pistols
Pink Pistols – Pick On Someone Your Own Caliber

Thank you to all who have sworn to protect and defend the Constitution

I believe that the Supreme Court has been waiting for the right case out of the District of Columbia
This could be it

Did I say this is BIG?

 

[les.b]

Well, this is good news, but I wouldn't get too excited. DC will request a hearing by the entire DC Circuit, which IIRC, (and I may be off a couple numbers) consists of 11 Justices, 7 of which were appointed by Democratic Presidents. They will probably over turn this decision, and then the Plaintiffs will try to appeal to SCOTUS, and I would not be at all surprised if they declined to hear the case, and we will be right back where we were a week ago.

I hope that I am wrong. Many things could happen in the meantime. This will not happen overnight. My predictions may not happen at all, and I may be completely off base. A liberal Justice might retire, and President Trump might replace him or her with a conservative. And they might join the court by then....although I'm not holding my breath.

I hope that this is a step forward, but I am pessimistic.

Best Regards, Les

 

[bushmaster1313]

The District has 30 days from July 25 to ask for rehearing en banc
En banc ruling would likely be against the 2nd Amendment and result in Gura and the Plaintiffs appealing to the Supreme Court, who does not have to take the case.

If I recall correctly, the DC Circuit did not agree to hear Heller en banc and it went straight to the Supreme Court, who upheld the Circuit win fr the 2nd Amendment.

Here I suspect the Circuit will take a long time to decide whether to take the case en banc.

 

[les.b]

Bushmaster, I wasn't trying to dash cold water on your post. I want to be as excited as you were in your first post. And I agree that we all owe a big thanks to Alan Gura and all of the others who you named above. Maybe I have just gotten pessimistic over the years, although I am still excited over the victories you cited. I sure hope that this is the right case, at the right time. Thanks to the OP and all of the others who posted here.

Best Regards, Les

 

[bushmaster1313]

The District has 30 days from July 25 to ask for rehearing en banc
En banc ruling would likely be against the 2nd Amendment and result in Gura and the Plaintiffs appealing to the Supreme Court, who does not have to take the case.

If I recall correctly, the DC Circuit did not agree to hear Heller en banc and it went straight to the Supreme Court, who upheld the Circuit win fr the 2nd Amendment.

Here I suspect the Circuit will take a long time to decide whether to take the case en banc.

District must decide this week to appeal en banc or to Supreme Court.

I hope it goes directly to Suprem Court but that is unlikely

 

[bushmaster1313]

Update
Unclear whether District must file petition for rehearing by midnight tonight, August 25, or if it is an agency of the United States that has an extra 15 days.

 

[bushmaster1313]

Petition for en banc review was filed today, August 24

This is a unfortunate but expected development. Just as in the Peruta case out of California, the en banc DC Circuit could negate the right to carry win and the Supreme Court could decline to take up the case

 

[bushmaster1313]

I just looked up the rule

The winning party (in this case the pro 2A party) cannot file a response to the request for a rehearing en banc unless granted permission by the court.

The ruling is stayed pending resolution of the request for rehearing

Anything other than a denial of rehearing would be bad for the 2A

 

[GaryS]

It would be most unusual for the winning party to request a rehearing on a case that they had, uh, won.

An en banc rehearing wouldn't necessarily be bad for 2A supporters. When an appeal is heard, the rule is that the evidence must be looked at in the light most favorable to the non moving party. The non moving party being the side that won the last round.

Of course if the court refuses to rehear the case, it effectively becomes the law of the land due to the fact that it's the Appeals Court for the District of Columbia. At least that's how I understand it. Not being a lawyer and all, there is a good chance I don't understand it.

I just looked up the rule

The winning party (in this case the pro 2A party) cannot file a response to the request for a rehearing en banc unless granted permission by the court.

The ruling is stayed pending resolution of the request for rehearing

Anything other than a denial of rehearing would be bad for the 2A

 

[les.b]

Well, not going to predict how this is all going to pan out, but to the best of my knowledge, here are the 11 judges who compose the DC appellate court. And the presidents who appointed them...which may give us a clue as to their judicial philosophy. Or not. Out of the 11, 7 were appointed by Democratic Presidents, and 4 by Republicans. One, I hear, is retiring at the end of August, this year. Janice Rogers Brown. I'm not an expert on this, but I am just throwing this out there FWIW.

Chief Judge Merrick B. Garland 1997–present — Clinton

Circuit Judge Karen L. Henderson 1990–present — G.H.W. Bush

Circuit Judge Judith Ann Wilson 1994–present — Clinton

Circuit Judge David S. Tatel 1994–present — Clinton

Circuit Judge Janice Rogers Brown 2005–present — G.W. Bush

Circuit Judge Thomas B. Griffith 2005–present — G.W. Bush

Circuit Judge Brett Kavanaugh 2006–present — G.W. Bush

Circuit Judge Sri Srinivasan 2013–present — Obama

Circuit Judge Patricia Ann Millett 2013–present — Obama

Circuit Judge Cornelia T.L. Pillard 2013–present — Obama

Circuit Judge Robert L. Wilkins 2014–present — Obama

Best Regards, Les

 

[bushmaster1313]

It would be most unusual for the winning party to request a rehearing on a case that they had, uh, won.

An en banc rehearing wouldn't necessarily be bad for 2A supporters. When an appeal is heard, the rule is that the evidence must be looked at in the light most favorable to the non moving party. The non moving party being the side that won the last round.

Of course if the court refuses to rehear the case, it effectively becomes the law of the land due to the fact that it's the Appeals Court for the District of Columbia. At least that's how I understand it. Not being a lawyer and all, there is a good chance I don't understand it.

The losing party has petitioned the full circuit to rehear the case
The winning party is not allowed to say anything to the circuit about the petition to rehear unless the circuit grants permission.

A rehearing would be very bad. The full circuit would hear the appeal all over again. Moreover, INHO they would only agree to rehear if they were prepared to negate the pro 2A win

BTW I am a lawyer.

 

[bushmaster1313]

On August 31 the D.C. Circuit ordered the plaintiff (the pro right to carry winning party) to file a response to the petition for rehearing en banc. It is due September 15.