.32 Colt "Pocket Positive" .32 Colt Police CTG

[model3sw]

Yesterday one of the old timers (older than me) called that needed to sell some of his collection because of a terminal illness.

I took a ride to look as some of those he was selling. I came home with a early 1960s Model 36, a model 63-2 ANIB (it equates to a stainless .22 combat masterpiece), and an odd .32 Pocket Positive.

On the Pocket Positive he pulls out the large Colt coffee table book to show it was from the late 1890s to the 1900s but further indicates it was made until 1943.

Not being as well educated on Colt as I am on S&W, it appeared to me to be a very later than the 1900s, likely pre war 1930-ish model.

Case is, I recall reading something somewhere about the PRE-DETECTIVE (.38s) were called Pocket Positives and even had box end labels indicating same but I had NO CLUE about the .32 Police Positive (Pocket Positive named on the barrel)

It is SN:888xx, 2+1/2' Barrel .32 Police CTG

Looks like Colt Serial number look-up puts this at 1920. (Just indicates Pocket Positive but not caliber).

anyone familiar with these ?

And, what is .32 Colt Police Positive CTG ?

 

[AGR_TOYS]

Definitions of Colt 32 cartridge terms.

32 POLICE CTG. ...........32 S&W Long
32 COLT NP CTG ..........32 S&W Long
COLT DA 32 .................32 Long Colt
32 COLT CTG ...............32 Long Colt
COLT NEW POLICE 32 ...32 S&W Long
POLICE POSITIVE B 32 ..32 S&W Long
FOR 32 S&W CTG .........32 S&W Long
and anything manufactured after the mid-teens is 32 S&W Long.
Borrowed this information off the Colt Forum .
Note: The Colt 32 long marked guns will not chamber 32 S&W cartridges.
Also the 63-2 is a stainless version of the J frame Model 34 kit gun.

 

[desi2358]

The Pocket Positive was essentially a Police Positive with a shorter, rounded off grip frame making it a bit smaller for carry. It replaced the earlier New Pocket which did not have the improved safety mechanism of the later Positive series and came out @ 1905. If my memory is right the Colt Police CTG marking indicates it shoots Colt's version of the 32 S&W long (which had a flat nosed bullet but was otherwise identical). If it said Colt 32 or DA 32 it would shoot the older 32 Colt round which is slightly smaller in case diameter.

 

[jimgoldth]

The Pocket Positive was essentially a Police Positive with a shorter, rounded off grip frame making it a bit smaller for carry. It replaced the earlier New Pocket which did not have the improved safety mechanism of the later Positive series and came out @ 1905. If my memory is right the Colt Police CTG marking indicates it shoots Colt's version of the 32 S&W long (which had a flat nosed bullet but was otherwise identical). If it said Colt 32 or DA 32 it would shoot the older 32 Colt round which is slightly smaller in case diameter.

The 32 Short Colt and 32 Long Colt (not NEW POLICE) were the same diameter as the 32 Rim Fire. Some 32 rim fire rifles had provisions for a center fire firing pin or were after market modified to center fire thus allowing firing of the 32 short Colt or 32 long Colt CF cartridge in them.

 

[DWalt]

Some information. First, the Detective Special is a short-barreled Police Positive Special. Earlier ones had square butts, later ones became slightly rounded. The Police Positive revolver has a shorter cylinder designed (at least later) for the .32 Colt NP and the .38 Colt NP (same as .32 S&W Long and .38 S&W).
Second, the .32 Colt (and .32 Long Colt) is an obsolete cartridge, and it is NOT interchangeable with the .32 Colt New Police, .32 S&W, or .32 S&W Long, i.e., those cannot be chambered in a .32 Colt revolver due to differences in case diameter. Further, there is no current case which can be re-formed into the .32 Colt. Maybe one of the boutique ammo makers might make it, but I don't know about that. Seems I remember about it still being made in Brazil, but I am not sure about that either. The only other way to get some would be through antique ammo dealers, and probably those would be too old/too expensive to shoot many. You won't find it at Walmart.

 

[mrchuck]

Very popular back in the 20's and 30's.
Mild recoil and it killed. Most LEO's back then always "doubled tapped"
to assure the perp was put down.

 

[AGR_TOYS]

If you do a web search you can find a picture of J. Edgar Hoover's personal or issued dehorned Colt 32 np pocket positive. It is reported held in the FBI vault.

 

[bmcgilvray]

Several including desi2358, jimgoldth, and DWALT know their stuff.

A .32 S&W Long flanked by .32 Short Colt and .32 Long Colt.



A Colt New Pocket transitional lives here. It was made in 1905. It appears to be the same as a regular New Pocket but its lock work has the Colt "Positive Lock" feature of the later Pocket Positive. The frame is roll marked New Pocket normally on the left side while the barrel is rollmarked Pocket Positive on its right side. It's chambered for the .32 Colt cartridges.

I wagged it home from a Dallas Market Hall gun show years ago, thinking it'd be just fine for use with the boxes of .32 S&W Long I had on hand. They don't fit.

As late as 2006 a local gun show could get Winchester Western .32 Short Colt for me. I'd heard small batches were turned out from time to time. Don't know if this is still true or not. The .32 Long Colt had been discontinued by then.

I'd love to add a Colt Pocket Positive to the menagerie here like you've found model3sw.

The New Pocket is tiny and the Pocket Positive is of about the same dimensions.

Here's the New Pocket with a .32 Long Colt with a New Service and a .45 Colt. .22 Long Rifle for comparison. The little revolver is dwarfed.

 

[DWalt]

"Here's the New Pocket with a .32 Long Colt with a New Service and a .45 Colt. .22 Long Rifle for comparison. The little revolver is dwarfed."

That Colt New Service sure looks like a M1909. Is it?

 

[bmcgilvray]

You have a good eye. It is a Model 1909.