357 lever Vs 300BLK

[JustAnotherGunGuy]

I am trying to choose between a .357 lever action or a 300BLK upper for 200 yards and under hog/deer. Just don't trust the ole 5.56 against a charging boar.


I have an AR so I would just need the upper for the 300BLK. With California laws this would save on DROS, FFL fees etc. as it can be shipped straight to my front door. But......
There is just something about an old time classic lever action.
Thinking about investing in reloading equipment. Any help on reloading prices between the two would be appreciated.

 

[Mack]

5.56 with the right bullet would be way better than a pistol caliber carbine.

 

[Arik]

300blk (in a AR). More accurate at longer distances, faster follow up shots and target acquisition. Has more energy then a 357. Overall more versatile then a lever gun in 357.

Not saying lever guns are bad but for what you want i'd go with the 300.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2

 

[WNC Seabee]

I'm a big fan of lever guns, but .357 wouldn't be my choice at 200 yds. I use mine for thick woods, maybe 125 yds or so. Beyond that it's a .44 mag or something in the .30cal family.

 

[Smee78]

I agree with everyone else so far, for 200yds, I vote 300. As to reloading, the sky is the limit. I think it depends how much you are looking to reload, I still reload with my single stage press, never felt the need to use a progressive.

 

[oneyeopn]

I dont want to offend any of the previous posters. If you look at the ballistic charts you information will be seriously erroneous. The ballistic charts all show the ballistics for a 357 out of a pistol. When it come to 357 out of a rifle that is a new ball game. The 357 out of a good modern lever action can be loaded to match and exceed 30-30 levels with a larger caliber bullet. Check out PacoKelly'sLeverguns.com there you will find all sorts of good information on the 357 levergun. I have one in 45colt and always thought it was way to anemic for hunting. After studying and with some advice from some of the best levergun guys in CAS and SASS shooting I now am comfortable with my 45 colt to 150yard and with a little practice 200. When reading the ballistic charts and you see the 357 turning 1100 fps or so, remember that is out of a 7" barrel (apprx) when coming out of a 20" barrel your velocity is going to be closer to 2000fps. Not to discredit a 300 but the ballistics on it arent that shiny either. and subsonic rounds wont have any power over 100 yards. I would really like a 300 myself but you cannot discredit a solid pistol round out of a modern lever action.
But against a charging boar, I have taken them with 30-30's often but the older I get the bigger caliber makes sense unless you go to a full rifle round. But I would vote for a 44mag or a 45 colt.

 

[BBQLS1]

Pistol cartridges are good within 100 yards, but I wouldn't push them much farther than that until you get to the big heavies that shoot more like a rifle 454 Casull, .500 S&W Mag.......

I might not push a 30-30 up to 200 yards.

 

[storeyteller]

Down here in the south GA swamps we have hogs galore. The only ones that have ever 'charged' me were the ones we were trying to catch (alive). Most of the really serious hog catchers down here carry .357 or .44mag handguns. We do put tons of pressure on 'em. Most people around here have rifles (lots of lever guns) in their vehicles and all hogs will be shot (or shot at) on sight. As a result you rarely/never see 'em in the daylight so the majority of the hunting is done at night with night vision optics at distances 200-600yds. Daylight hog hunting is done with scent and catch dogs. The chances around here of walking up on hog and getting close enough for it to decide on fight rather than flight is slim to none. Your area may be different though.


I don't have a 300blk but I do have a .357 handgun and reloadig for it is dirt cheap, esp when you compare it to reloading for my rifles. My GUESS is that reloading for the .357 will be lots cheaper than loading for the 300blk.

I get the feeling that you really want the lever-action. Go for it!

 

[oneyeopn]

Pistol cartridges are good within 100 yards, but I wouldn't push them much farther than that until you get to the big heavies that shoot more like a rifle 454 Casull, .500 S&W Mag.......

I might not push a 30-30 up to 200 yards.

I must respectfully disagree the lever guys all shoot their pistol cartridged rifles to 200yards with a little hold over. A 250gr bullet with a muzzle velocity of 1800fps still carry's quite a bit of power at 150 to 200 yards although you may have to hold a foot high.
I am now shooting my 45 colt at 150yards holding 6 inches high and punching very clean holes through the paper and watching the dust from the shot hit quite a bit behind it. There is no berm behind my target just 3 miles of flat fields.

I only own the one lever gun and my 30-30 was a NEF handi-rifle but it was accurate and would do 150 easy. 30-30's were never known for long distance shooting. But the OTC bullets you can buy are made to shoot in rifles made for 100 years or so, they are not loaded to the rounds best potential as is any ammo made for the same thing.

 

[Gunslinger808]

Just get both, problem solved!

 

[Buffalohunter60]

I have a marlin 336 (30-30) scoped and at 165 yards it will hold 1.5 inch groups with federal ammo. I would have no problem using it at 200 yds if I had a good rest and a decent shot and I am a firm believer that its where you hit them that is really important. I also had a winchester rifle in .357 mag and just sold it....it was very accurate out to 100 yards and never tried it beyond that. I had a friend that would deer hunt with his Smith 27 and had no problem killing deer at 100 yds off hand (better man than me) I never hunted hogs biut it sounds like it would be a blast.

 

[Lineman73]

BLACKOUT!!!

Go with the Blackout, dude!!

 

[oneyeopn]

I am just prejudiced and think everyone should own a lever action....LOL

The Hodgdon 2012 Reloading Manual has a great story on the 300, and the writer really wrung it out as a hunting rifle. Everyone should read it. For any medium sized game the best you can do with reloads is 125 yards, beyond that it loses its punch and is not recommended for whitetail over that range. There are some bullets that were recommended for varmints and small whitetails but nothing rated to 150yards. According to the article the 300 blackout or whisper is ballisticaly identical to the 7.62x39. I have seen people try to hunt deer with sks's and they end up wounding most of the time unless they are real close. If you look in the lyman 49th edition reloading manual you will find that the 357 out of a rifle has more hunting potential than the 300. Thats my .02 cents.

 

[Jayhawkhuntclub]

Man I love pistol calibers in a good Marlin levergun! Great for plinking, hunting and even defense (in most situations)!

 

[oneyeopn]

Man I love pistol calibers in a good Marlin levergun! Great for plinking, hunting and even defense (in most situations)!

Missed having you around. And I like that line of thought...put new sights on my lever 45colt going to sight it in this evening!

 

[Erich]

Just for the record, my 20" 1892 throws .357 handloads pretty fast:

158-gr hardcasts at 2000 fps
180-gr hardcasts at 1800 fps
140-gr JHPs at 2150 fps.

My opinion on the OP's Q is that they'd both do the job fine. It's easier to load the straight-wall .357 (and you're right about there being something about an old-school levergun ), but the .300BLK's upper would save you paperwork. Good luck with whatever you decide.

 

[ral2ooo]

Depends on what you want to do with it. If it it JUST for hunting out to 200 yards neither There are many 30-30 Winchester 94s in sitting in pawn shops that would do the job and do it cheaply. Better yet but not quite as common a Savage model 99 in 300 Savage would really do the trick. Not much more recoil than the 30-30 with a good gain in energy. Also better BC not being hindered by the round nose bullets.
Back to the original choices the 300 Blackout beats the 357 in every way beyond 100 yards. 220 grain SS loads, effective range inside 150 yards, suppressed would be pretty neat....and the 125 loads pretty much duplicates the 30-30 out to 200 yards.
If ya want to spend money get the 300 Blackout. If you just want a gun to knock those pigs down at 200 yards get the 300 savage or the Ol 30-30.
My 2 cents. Enjoy the search it is after-all a good part of the fun.

RAL

 

[oneyeopn]

Depends on what you want to do with it. If it it JUST for hunting out to 200 yards neither There are many 30-30 Winchester 94s in sitting in pawn shops that would do the job and do it cheaply. Better yet but not quite as common a Savage model 99 in 300 Savage would really do the trick. Not much more recoil than the 30-30 with a good gain in energy. Also better BC not being hindered by the round nose bullets.
Back to the original choices the 300 Blackout beats the 357 in every way beyond 100 yards. 220 grain SS loads, effective range inside 150 yards, suppressed would be pretty neat....and the 125 loads pretty much duplicates the 30-30 out to 200 yards.
If ya want to spend money get the 300 Blackout. If you just want a gun to knock those pigs down at 200 yards get the 300 savage or the Ol 30-30.
My 2 cents. Enjoy the search it is after-all a good part of the fun.

RAL

You really need to check your facts, the 300 doesnt duplicate 30-30 loads anywhere, If you check the ballistic charts it duplicates 7.62x39 which wont break an egg at 200 yards if you can hit it. 357 in a 24 inch rifle will duplicate 30-30 loads. Back to the Hodgdon 2012 Annual Reloading Guide (magazine type) the 30-30 doesnt fall below 1000ft lbs of energy until around 175 yards where the 300 falls below that between 100 and 125 the latter being in the lighter bullets with a strong charge. The 357 properly loaded for a rifle will carry 1000lbs of energy to almost 200 yards also. I would love to have a 300 but you have to be realistic in its abilities. Suppressed at 50 yards, I can see. Subsonic at 50 yards paper puncher. Deer rifle at 100 yards very marginal. The newer lever action guns by Companies like Rossi or Marlin or even Winchester can shoot a lot hotter round very accurately than they ones made 50 years ago. The newer 92 actions in Steel or Stainless will go 50,000cup. My 45lc Rossi 92 has a brass frame so I keep it under 40,000cup but am shooting 3 1/2 inch groups at 100 with iron sights. You just cant discredit pistol caliber rifles anymore.

 

[Whitter]

If I were you I'd look into the data that Oneeyeopn provided. He knows of what he speaks, and there really is something about the 1892 design that just fits.

 

[ral2ooo]

You really need to check your facts, the 300 doesnt duplicate 30-30 loads anywhere, If you check the ballistic charts it duplicates 7.62x39 which wont break an egg at 200 yards if you can hit it. 357 in a 24 inch rifle will duplicate 30-30 loads. Back to the Hodgdon 2012 Annual Reloading Guide (magazine type) the 30-30 doesnt fall below 1000ft lbs of energy until around 175 ........ You just cant discredit pistol caliber rifles anymore.

7.62x39 Federal 123 high shock velocity at the muzzle 2300FPS, E ft-lbs 1445....30-30 Federal 125 High shock velocity @ the muzzle 2570FPS, E ft-lbs 1830 @ 200 yards 7.62x39 1780 FPS, E ft-lbs 860 30-30 1660 FPS E ft-lbs 770...at 500 yards the 7.62x39 retains 180 more ft-lbs energy than the 30-30....I think you under estimate the usefulness of the midpower 30 cal rounds at 200 yards a bit more than I over estimated the power of 300 blackout at that distance.
The 7.62x39 has enough energy to be used at 200yards as does the 300 blackout. As to the accuracy of SKS/AK rifles.. that has little to do with the energy delivered and even less to do with the accuracy of the blackout.
RAL