afriqueart
Member
I recently purchased a 1983 model 60. The barrel doesn't show 38+P. Would it be safe to shoot a +P load?
Thanks
Thanks
38 P+ load
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Five, 10 +Ps to see where it hits and how you react; otherwise limit practice to standard .38s. Then next year, try another 10.
The restriction on +Ps has been pretty much relaxed by S&W; still, you don't want to overstress the little feller.
Not uncommon for me and friends 20 years ago to practice with +Ps in airweight
models, again on a limited basis and just to get the feel of them. Frankly, we could
hardly tell the difference of popping a +P in an airweight vs. all steel.
The restriction on +Ps has been pretty much relaxed by S&W; still, you don't want to overstress the little feller.
Not uncommon for me and friends 20 years ago to practice with +Ps in airweight
models, again on a limited basis and just to get the feel of them. Frankly, we could
hardly tell the difference of popping a +P in an airweight vs. all steel.
Erich
Member
What amuses me about the cautious answers this oft-repeated question about pre-dash J-frames always gets is that Elmer Keith was shooting some pretty seriously hot (hotter than present-day +P specs) loadings in his first-year Chiefs Specials - read Sixguns to see how he reports they held up fine.
I don't think you need to concern yourself about a catastrophic failure: I've shot downright atomic handloads out of J-frames, and I'm not at all concerned about shooting +P loadings out of any steel J-frame that I own for the rest of time. People talk about the possibility of accelerated wear, but I've not seen it in a steel-framed J-frame gun that's been treated properly. (I pretty much don't bother shooting anything out of my J-frames that's not into the +P pressure range . . . or above it, now that the manuals have been dumbed down so much.)
I have concerns about the press-fit barrels in aluminum-framed guns and strive to keep their forcing cones squeaky-clean (and frankly don't shoot them much) based on seeing too many cracks (here on the forum and one on my own gun) in them over the years, but I really think this is a problem that is unrelated to the use of +P rounds (after discussions with people who know more about it than me, I believe it has more to do with manufacturing mistakes - which is what S&W told me happened with mine - and lead-plated forcing cones).
This is all worth exactly what you paid for it, of course. For the real skinny from the horse's lawyers and engineers (in that order), you should call the factory, of course: 1-800-331-0852.
I don't think you need to concern yourself about a catastrophic failure: I've shot downright atomic handloads out of J-frames, and I'm not at all concerned about shooting +P loadings out of any steel J-frame that I own for the rest of time. People talk about the possibility of accelerated wear, but I've not seen it in a steel-framed J-frame gun that's been treated properly. (I pretty much don't bother shooting anything out of my J-frames that's not into the +P pressure range . . . or above it, now that the manuals have been dumbed down so much.)
I have concerns about the press-fit barrels in aluminum-framed guns and strive to keep their forcing cones squeaky-clean (and frankly don't shoot them much) based on seeing too many cracks (here on the forum and one on my own gun) in them over the years, but I really think this is a problem that is unrelated to the use of +P rounds (after discussions with people who know more about it than me, I believe it has more to do with manufacturing mistakes - which is what S&W told me happened with mine - and lead-plated forcing cones).
This is all worth exactly what you paid for it, of course. For the real skinny from the horse's lawyers and engineers (in that order), you should call the factory, of course: 1-800-331-0852.
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RainDodger
Member
As I mentioned in this post in another section, I carried a Model 60 as a duty weapon for years. I bought it new in '87 and our issue ammunition was Winchester 158 grain hollow point lead rounds. White box, red lettering, government issue for federal law enforcement, and it's all +P. I still have some that was issued to me. I fired thousands of rounds through the Model 60 and I still have it. It's just fine and still shoots great. I carry it often in my truck.
Erich
Member
naw, that was a Model 12 (quasi-K-frame alloy frame 6-shot .38)
How about a 642 Airweight???
I just got one with NO lock. The others that I see have +P on the barrel but this one does not. Smith's website shows that +P is OK in 642's but again, the picture shows +P on the barrel.
I thought there might be a chance that this was older than the current models since it had no lock. Is there a chance that this would NOT accept +P?
I planned to shoot enough +P to sight in a Crimson Trace Laser grip. Then I would only shoot a cylinder or two on occassion to make sure it was still sighted in. Everything else would be .38 spl loads.
I just got one with NO lock. The others that I see have +P on the barrel but this one does not. Smith's website shows that +P is OK in 642's but again, the picture shows +P on the barrel.
I thought there might be a chance that this was older than the current models since it had no lock. Is there a chance that this would NOT accept +P?
I planned to shoot enough +P to sight in a Crimson Trace Laser grip. Then I would only shoot a cylinder or two on occassion to make sure it was still sighted in. Everything else would be .38 spl loads.
stiab
US Veteran
That's a good plan, stick with it and your shooting hand will thank you and your grandchildren can inherit a very nice fully functioning S&W revolver!
ArchAngelCD
Moderator, SWCA Member, Absent Comrade
As mentioned many times before today's .38 Special +P ammo is not "hotter" than the normal carry .38 Special ammo of the past. The current SAAMI max pressure for a .38 Special +P round is 18,500 PSI, hardly enough to harm an all Steel revolver. For the most part you can fire a current +P round from any post-war S&W revolver within limited use. (with the possible exception of the very hot stuff that's around using the older 20,000+ PSI standard)
Pisgah
Member
Common sense says that a hotter load will wear out any gun faster than a less-hot load; however, "faster" is a relative term.
I shoot +Ps in my J-frames without concern. I figure if it takes, say, 50,000 rounds of standard-pressure stuff to destroy a J-frame, then it won't take but maybe 45,000 to do it with +P. Big deal. I doubt I'll ever reach either number in one J-frame.
I shoot +Ps in my J-frames without concern. I figure if it takes, say, 50,000 rounds of standard-pressure stuff to destroy a J-frame, then it won't take but maybe 45,000 to do it with +P. Big deal. I doubt I'll ever reach either number in one J-frame.
deralte
US Veteran
What about .38 +P loads in a new 340CT .357? I am assuming that any revolver built for a .357 would easily accomodate the plus P.
flop-shank
US Veteran
Fire at will. .38 +P operates at much lower pressures than .357 magnum does.
Spotteddog
Member
Missed you F/S!
Good to read you!
Good to read you!
flop-shank
US Veteran
I've been around and read most every post in the CCW and ammo forums (except the Wal-Mart threads) Old lady family friend is ill, father's house got flooded (toasted both his cars), father-in-law is dying, work is nuts and friend is throwing out 20-something recalcitrant kids. I started going back to church (after a five year hiatus) about a month ago. No small coincidence IMO.
Erich
Member
I'll have a good thought for you, amigo.
flop-shank
US Veteran
Thanks much, bro. I had a relaxing day and remain in good spirits.
Erich
Member
Right on. Me, I saw carnivorous prairie dogs cannibalizing their dead, APD SWAT on a call-out with ARs on the freeway, and the cutest little girl in the world at an Appleseed shoot. Plus, the sunset right now is glorious.
Spotteddog
Member
OK Erich, I've got to ask!
I'm as "current" as cave painting, who, or what the Hell is your new Avatar?
Sorry OP for the mini-jack!
I'm as "current" as cave painting, who, or what the Hell is your new Avatar?
Sorry OP for the mini-jack!
Erich
Member
Evil Robot Monkey!
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