AR10 .308 been told that is not good choice for close quarters your thoughts?

[marathonrunner]

I have been debating for a long time whether to buy an AR10 .308 as it seems much more effective than 5.56 at close range. However, many critics argue that the .308 is really designed for a long range gun and for close quarters it would be too difficult to shoot fast.

I was thinking about getting Windham's SRC .308 in a 16inch barrel

 

[robertrwalsh]

If you are talking about shooting people in a close-in, self-defense situation it is, in my humble opinion, too much gun. A .223 will rarely shoot all the way thru a body in a solid body shot but will usually penetrate soft body armor. I would be afraid of overpenetration. In a military situation it is not an issue. In your hallway it might very well be. Plus, have you ever shot a .308 short-barreled rifle indoors. (I have.) It is very, very unpleasant, to the point of being disorienting. Just my opinion, for what that may be worth to you.

 

[marathonrunner]

If you are talking about shooting people in a close-in, self-defense situation it is, in my humble opinion, too much gun. A .223 will rarely shoot all the way thru a body in a solid body shot but will usually penetrate soft body armor. I would be afraid of overpenetration. In a military situation it is not an issue. In your hallway it might very well be. Plus, have you ever shot a .308 short-barreled rifle indoors. (I have.) It is very, very unpleasant, to the point of being disorienting. Just my opinion, for what that may be worth to you.

I have seen youtube review where the guy shooting a .308 said follow up shots for close quarters made it too slow. The only .308 I shot was the M1A and the recoil felt very mild but never shot a .308 out of a 16 inch barrel

 

[Smithpride]

CQB-don't doubt the 5.56 at all. I'm not an officer, but I trust ours to do it's job. I've seen what it can do and it's horrific close in.

 

[Wyo]

I have a LMT MWS with a short barrel, much like the British Army issues to its designated marksmen. Wonderful rifle, accurate and reliable. But it is very heavy. I also have a number of AR-15s in various configurations, and I would choose any of them over the LMT for use indoors and at short range. The 5.56 cartridge actually does pretty well in those situations. It's the long range situations where it is lacking. The 7.62 is extremely harsh in closed environments and followup shots would be difficult. Stick with the AR platform for close quarters. It's plenty adequate and handles better close in.

 

[LVSteve]

The blast and concussion from a 16" .308 in a hallway is probably like shooting a .357 in a phone booth. You wouldn't dream of doing it.

I used to frequent a 15 yard, two lane range and shooting a 6" 686 with 125 gr JHP .357 loads @ around 1400 fps was quite an experience even with good ear defenders. The noise was "impressive" and after a short delay there was a return pressure wave off the backstop. The range also had some attempt at sound absorbing walls, I doubt your house does.

 

[amcline82]

CQB is best suited from a 12ga or 5.56.

Friends don't let friends buy Taurus.

 

[lebomm]

If by close quarters you mean inside your house, the .308 is WAY too much gun. The blast of a 12ga. is pretty mean, but at least it won't shoot through all your interior walls, to the outside, and into your neighbor's house.

Larry

 

[Big Cholla]

As stated any 308 Rifle is going to be much heavier than a 5.56 Carbine. The muzzle energy of the 5.56 is adequate for most purposes up close and personal. The problem is that after the first shot the time taken to make accurate second, third, and fourth shots can be of utmost importance to be QUICK. The heavier the rifle, the more the recoil, the more the muzzle blast and flame will only slow those shots down. IMHO, that could well be the difference between success and failure. Don't over gun yourself. Modern self defense bullet performance is outstanding with some 5.56 bullets. One very light short barreled 5.56 Carbine with a 30 round magazine is everything one needs and nothing that one doesn't need in close quarters. I have a top quality AR-10 type rifle that is very accurate and deadly out to 1,000 yds. It is in a 'drag bag' with extra loaded magazines. It is not my 'go to' rifle in case of anything 'needy' close to my house or property. The AR-15 Carbine with a red dot optic and a 16" bbl. is. And in the case that the AR-15 is not the optimum SD weapon I need, there is a Rem. 870 setting right next to it with extended magazine tube, side saddle with 00 Buck, Slugs and night sights a glowing. ..................

And a big Aside: My wife is a great pistol shooter, but only a mediocre rifle shooter. BUT, she can handle the AR-15 with aplomb. She actually likes to shoot it as long as she has ear muffs. ....

 

[Absalom]

I have been debating for a long time whether to buy an AR10 .308 as it seems much more effective than 5.56 at close range. However, many critics argue that the .308 is really designed for a long range gun and for close quarters it would be too difficult to shoot fast.
....

Frankly, if there is actually an "argument" going on about this, it must be between keyboard "experts" needing to fill blog pages, not actual practitioners.

The .308/7.62mm is a medium to long-range rifle round, which is why it has been a standard chambering for sniper rifles as well as one of the most popular hunting rounds. But you will be hard-pressed to find any SWAT/HRT or other professional user that uses a .308 weapon for short-range/close-in work, let alone inside buildings. The universal choice for that used to be 9mm SMG's, but nowadays are .223/5.56mm rifles.

Bigger is NOT always better, for all the reasons others have already listed. A .308 semi-auto rifle (but then a longer-barreled one) may be a sensible option if you anticipate defending a rural property, shooting outside over longer distances, but it would be more of a liability in close-in self-defense situations more typical of inhabited areas.

 

[R*E]

If it's rough on the shooter, image what it's like on the receiving end!

 

[marathonrunner]

Frankly, if there is actually an "argument" going on about this, it must be between keyboard "experts" needing to fill blog pages, not actual practitioners.

The .308/7.62mm is a medium to long-range rifle round, which is why it has been a standard chambering for sniper rifles as well as one of the most popular hunting rounds. But you will be hard-pressed to find any SWAT/HRT or other professional user that uses a .308 weapon for short-range/close-in work, let alone inside buildings. The universal choice for that used to be 9mm SMG's, but nowadays are .223/5.56mm rifles.

Bigger is NOT always better, for all the reasons others have already listed. A .308 semi-auto rifle (but then a longer-barreled one) may be a sensible option if you anticipate defending a rural property, shooting outside over longer distances, but it would be more of a liability in close-in self-defense situations more typical of inhabited areas.

Well I have never owned an AR in .308 so it is easy to think more power is better. I also quickly forget my one AR15 with a vortex strike eagle and a full 30 round clip feels very heavy so imagine the same load in .308 that has to be way too cumbersome. I guess there is a reason many are not using .308 for close quarters.

I Just figured the .308 was the best all around.

 

[rwsmith]

Bullet choice.....

Bullet choice is as important as mass/weight and velocity. For 'light' work I load my 30-06 down. Problem with AR is the you can only go down so far before function stops.

 

[Vulcan Bob]

As already said, a bit much for in the house. However lets go outside, say there is baddy's in a vehicle in front of your house or a baddy behind hard cover that needs shot. The 5.56/.223 may or may not get the job done, the 7.62/.308 Win is much better (read penetration) for that sort of thing. Of course we can construct all sorts of scenario's but for all around use it's hard to go wrong with the .308 Win.

With that said I have three AR-15's and one M1 Garand in 7.62 and one Armalite AR-10 in 7.62 along with three AK-47's and several suitable 12 Gauge shotguns for this sort of thing. I do believe a "well dressed" man or woman is pretty snazzy!

 

[ISCS Yoda]

Oh, my, a debate that we should never have, but we are having it. Just my opinion....And EVERYONE will have a different opinion. So here we go....YMMV!!

A rifle is the WORST possible choice for home defense. IMHO. A carbine is not much better except it might maneuver better in narrow hallways. If you live in a huge, palatial home, MAYBE you can use a rifle but it is not the best choice except for this:

https://media.giphy.com/media/BHfWOavrqAKuA/giphy.gif

(c) Universal Pictures, et al


There you are, up on the second floor balcony, fighting off hordes of bad guys. If that's what you are preparing for so be it. If you are a normal person it is just silly. Even if you have baddies in the street out front as noted above you still do not need a rifle until and unless we are in the midst of an American meltdown. THEN you will need a rifle.

In the meantime, a tactical shotgun (or maybe any shotgun but the long ones will be unwieldy indoors) in any gauge and a handgun or two will be sufficient to defend your home without sending high velocity rounds over to visit all of your neighbors.

A .308 indoors? In a 16 inch gun? You better hit every home invader all at once with the first shot because that second shot is going to be hard to find! Even in semi-auto mode. I am an M-14/M1A fan, and believe me I would not ever pick that one up inside my house. I don't know who came up with the concept of using modern sporting rifles, tactical set up or just plain Jane, for home defense but they are just wrong. Home offense is different - if you are kicking in doors and prepared to shoot terrorists, drug dealers, or other ne'er-do-wells okay, bring a long arm but you are not on TV and not para-military and your 15 round M&P/3rd Gen/SIG/Beretta/Hi-Power/six-shooter handguns will do the job, especially if backed up by a shotgun (if you can get to it).

As I said, YMMV, but I am a firm believer in not using too much gun inside your home.

 

[67tempest]

In my opinion it is way too much gun for inside a house! My ideal in house gun is a 12ga pump shotgun, 20 inch barrel, loaded with 00 buck.

 

[BigBill]

A 12ga in 3" or 3 1/2" "00" buck will serve you well but it may get messy. The 12 ga 2 3/4" "00" is 9 balls close to 38 diameter. But the 400gr slug maybe a better man stopper in close quarters determined by the light conditions. The "00" maybe better in the dark when the intended target can't be fully seen. My point is to wing them first then do a quick follow up shot.

I'm really impressed with the Russian Izmash Saiga Sporter with a 16" barrel in 308 or in 223. She's very light you can toss it around plus it never jams. I never seen a semi auto spit out the 308 rounds like this saiga does. The Russians at Izmash ( the ak47/ ak/akm people) find the saiga is more accurate in the two American rounds of 223/308 over the Russian calibers. Shooting 1 1/2" groups using South African 308 surplus ammo at 100yds no scope isn't too shabby. The guys on the IZHMASH Saiga-12 Shotguns forum are shooting 1/2" moa's with better new ammo.

 

[petepeterson]

I have seen youtube review where the guy shooting a .308 said follow up shots for close quarters made it too slow.

What is the follow up shot for? The first one should clear the hallway...at least three BGs deep.

 

[TXSWFAN]

"A .308 indoors? In a 16 inch gun? You better hit every home invader all at once with the first shot because that second shot is going to be hard to find."



So a semi-auto .308 has more recoil than a 12 gauge?

Use what you're most comfortable with OP. A 16" AR-10 is a wonderful rifle. The only reason I use a POF .308 for HD is because it has a 12" barrel. I just haven't got around to cutting the barrel down on the Armalite.

I use Hornady TAP Barrier. I want it to turn cover into concealment. I know my house layout, the bad guy doesn't.

 

[UNCLE PAULY]

What you need is a .50 cal Beowulf with 12" barrel.
It will stop any rhino or grizzly you find lurking in the hallway.

But for human bad guys try a 45 acp 1911 pistol or a 20 gauge 18" pump shotgun. Whichever.